I searched but did not get a good answer. Does anyone here have a RAMJET setup on their MAF TPI Car. Were can I get a RAMJET setup...not the crate engine...just the Intake. How much work what is the price and what is involved in it? Thanks for the info.

 

Ok..let me modify my statement. A Ramjet could be used, but would be easier to set up as SD instead of MAF. Below, someone mentioned the fact that it wont bolt up to older heads, so you would have to deal with that also.


[This message has been edited by Desert86Roc (edited May 25, 2001).]

 

There have been several people thinking about this (myself included) but it has yet to be done by anyone on the board that I am aware of. I believe that you may be able to use you MAF and corresponding computer to run a RamJet. You would need to purchase the intake @ $895, fuel rail kit @ $355, injectors if needed, and I believe a new throttle body. I have not done a lot of research so I am sure I am missing something. Many people (smarter than me) think it can be done.

Maybe someone else will chime in.

------------------
88 IROC convertible
-=ICON Motorsports=-

 

Also, you may have to deal with hood clearances as the Ramjet looks like a taller manifold. I just saw someone on the Engine Swap board who had a ramjet in their signature....maybe you might want to look over there.

------------------
Mike Metzler (Desert86Roc)[*] Webmaster: SpeedWorldMotorplex.com[*] Click Here For 86 IROC 305 TPI (406 build in progress) Page

ET's @ 1250 ft[*] 14.28 @ 95.461 mph (uncorrected, NOS, no headers)[*] 15.365 @ 86.785 mph (uncorrected, headers, no NOS)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|

In answer to your below question....Yes I am... Who is asking?
<><


[This message has been edited by Desert86Roc (edited May 24, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Desert86Roc (edited May 24, 2001).]

 

OK I will but this just cought my attention.... ARE YOU REALLY MIKE METZLER??!!

 

the bare intake in only $400 somehting. www.sdpc2000.com The TB is from a 6.0L vortec truck. I dunno if you can use TPI fuel rails or not. I would imagine so. I dunno anyone that has use this intake in a TPI system. If the 6.0L TB lacks the proper mechanisms that the TPI TB has, maybe a single blade mustang TB could be adapted. those should have IAC and whatever other stuff is needed.

------------------
-Tas
'89 Formula WS-6

305, TBI, auto, 14x3 chrome flat based open element with K&N, Milodon 160* thermo, functional Formula hood, cross-flow Flowmaster, '99z28 rear pipes and tips....

Soon to be installed:
Hooker 1-5/8" 50 state legal headers, Dynomax 3" I pipe (PN 44063 and 43248), Catco 3" cat, and injector spacer.

Super GRK_Taz World
F-Body Dual Exaust
EFI & Intake Options
AOL IM: superGRtaz

 

Hood clearance is not a problem. CHP Magazine put one of these in a 91 Camaro, and had no hood problems.

------------------
Joshua Johnston
1991 Z-28
Flowmaster
K&N
305 / 5spd. (Temporary)

 

OK...Could I adapt the RamJet to a MAF type system....Like...um..., replace the TPI plenuem, runners and base plate with the RJ, fabricate fuel rails, and connect the MAF sensor right be foe the throttle body just like the TPI setup, What would be missing and could the sensors be adapted to the RJ? How hard would it be to convert to SD?

 

guess what...I found another source for the RamJets TB, A GMC JIMMY OR CHEVY BLAZER WITH the 4.3L vortec engine, I just went out and checked because I remember cleaning the thing and when I thought about I decided to look and sure enough upon visual inspection it looks like the RJ's TB inside and out...

AND it is a MAF car.... hummm my camaro it MAF, this just might work....

[This message has been edited by camaro6spd (edited May 21, 2001).]

 

Has anyone called AS&M and asked how much a fuel rail kit would be? AS&M was the one who designed this thing first, then GM got in on it. If we can get a GP going with them for some fuel rails we could make this thing work. I dont think that a TPI fuel rail setup will even be close on that manifold. Does the Vortech throotle body have an IAC on it like the TPI units use?

 

The TPI fuel rails wont work. The Vortech/Ram Jet TB does have the IAC.

------------------
L98, 3.27 9-bolt, Hooker shorty headers, custom 2.5inch Y-pipe, no cat, 3inch 2chamber flowmaster, JET AFPR, Ported MAF, Best ET: 13.86 @100mph. 1.99 60'
17 inch ROH "ZS" wheels. 17x8.5(front) and 17x9.5 (rear). Firestone Firehawk SZ50s. 245/45/zr17s and 275/40/zr17s. T56

On the way... Radar Blue 89 Formula, T56, Ram Jet 430, Ram Air, 17inch ROHs.

 

So the Vortech IAC is in the TB just like the TPI unit? Are they the same IAC part? If they interchange I can see this being a possible swap with some fuel rails.

[This message has been edited by BLOWN85/TA (edited May 22, 2001).]

 

12489371 MANIFOLD 1 =$380.36 http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/
The price is right on the manifold, if we can just get the rest of the stuff figured out.

 

yep, almost positive, I took a quick look becuase it was raining, now can anyone answer my question of the sensors (see Sensors). AND any one with a MAF MR or SR or a good idea of MAF please see my RamJet post in Motor Swap.

[This message has been edited by camaro6spd (edited May 22, 2001).]

 

camaro6spd If we can get all the cables bracketed to hookup, the IAC is the same or at least will work the same with TPI, fuel rails are made or become available it will work with a MAF from the TPI not the Vortech.
You will give up EGR and have to have one hell of a nice chip burnt, but it can work with the TPI MAF if you get it plumbed in. If I attempt this I will use it on SD system, from what I have read it would be easier to tune than a MAF car would.

 

No need to fabricate anything!
Here are the part numbers & prices (gmpartsdirect.com):
12489371 Ram-Jet Manifold 367.50
10128305 Splash Shield 6.73
11514149 Bolt 2.00 (4)
12529094* Vortec Intake Gasket 14.75
12550027* Intake Bolt 2.00 (8)
14082470 Vacuum Fitting 2.00
17113520 Ram-Jet T-Body 154.50
12551240 TB Gasket 2.90
11516425* TB Bolt 2.06
17123852 Throttle Position Sensor 21.69
17113209 IAC Valve 49.20
17082049 IAC Seal 4.18
17113168 IAC Bolt/Screw Kit 8.37
12553918 Fuel Rail Assy 263.42
17124251* 28 lb/hr LT4 Fuel Injector 55.78 (8)
11516061 Fuel Rail Bolts .68 (4)
17123897* Fuel Pressure Regulator 53.72
9439930 FPR Bolt .31
12557247 FPR Hose 2.03
12489599 Fuel Line Connector 9.45
12489600 Fuel Line Connector Seal 4.20
25095452 PCV Valve 3.98
12556930 PCV Hose 3.35
336018 PCV Connector 2.67
12146312 Coolant Temp Sens 5.05

You could buy the TB used which will include the TPS & IAC valve, Buy some used LT1 injectors, have your PROM programmed. You will need "Vortec" style heads.

Also, I personally would convert to Speed Density.

[This message has been edited by drain89 (edited May 22, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by drain89 (edited May 22, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by drain89 (edited May 22, 2001).]

 

you don't need to spend $400+ on injectors. Ford SVO injectors are about $225 for 8

Remember that the SVOs are rated for less fuel pressure so they will flow more than advertised at a GM fuel pressure level.

------------------
-Tas
'89 Formula WS-6

305, TBI, auto, 14x3 chrome flat based open element with K&N, Milodon 160* thermo, functional Formula hood, cross-flow Flowmaster, '99z28 rear pipes and tips....

Soon to be installed:
Hooker 1-5/8" 50 state legal headers, Dynomax 3" I pipe (PN 44063 and 43248), Catco 3" cat, and injector spacer.

Super GRK_Taz World
F-Body Dual Exaust
EFI & Intake Options
AOL IM: superGRtaz

[This message has been edited by Tas (edited May 22, 2001).]

 

how much does the ram jet flow? would it be worth to spend the $$ on this than..say a SR or MR?

------------------
Originating member of the SJNEP Crew
Member of the Jersey Fbody Crew(JFA)
Check out MyGTA Nicknamed:The Big Red Machine
***AOL IM RiceEatinGTA***
Moderator at www.transamgta.com
"What does not kill us only makes us stronger"

Tony

 

Drain89 Where did you get all that info?

 

I flowed my Ramjet intake: 276CFM@28" if I can remember correctly.

 

what can't i just put it on there and have the chip burnt as if it was a MR or SR? what is the difference....

 

http://67camaross.cz28.com/RJ350/RJ350.html

Here is some scanned pics from the RamJet Service manual--- wiring diagrams, and part numbers. They are scanned huge so that you can print them out on a full sheet of paper. If anyone is serious about a RJ buildup shoot me an email, I can find used TB's identical to the RJ for cheap.
I plan on doing the same thing to my car someday, its in the planning stages now, so maybe next year

------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

 

What do you think a RamJet mated with Vortec heads with an L98 cam would produce?

[This message has been edited by camaro6spd (edited May 23, 2001).]

 

Off the top of my head, I'd say that it makes 350-360HP.
I was planning on using the LT4 Hot Cam and building the RamJet 430, using the cast iron Vortec Heads (don't like the Fastburn's $) I also have access to the programming required for that cam, so thats not a problem for me (Using the RJ Marine ECM)
By the time I build it...maybe the fuel injector rails will be readily available. Mine might see a little N02 also

------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

 

mayeb here is a better question....How hard is is to convert to SD and would it be easier to get the Marine Chip reprogrammed then a SD system.... How much will it cost to program each(SD and Marine) and what do i need to convert to SD

 

camaro6spd: if you check out the prom board they touch on useing the 730 ECM with Ram Jet. I wouldn't think the 165 MAF ECM would be much different for wireing purposes.

------------------
89 IROC-Z 350 TPI

-Flowmaster Catback
-Performance Resource Chip
-700R4 (Rebuilt) Too much done to actually list
-K&N Airfilters
-Ported Plenum
-2.77 Gears (not much to brag about but eh, its there)
-MSD 8.5 mm plug wires
-Gutted cat
-!AIR
-Gutted Air Boxes

 

No one here has really came out and said it, but you cannot direct swap a ramjet intake for a TPI intake. the bolt pattern is different.

------------------
-86 IROC
Jacked up like a mother!
this years goal: 10.50 @ 130+ mph
-=ICON Motorsports=-

 

Good point Guido. Unless it is unclear, the RamJet only works on the new Vortec or FastBurn heads. They will not work on the older style Gen 1 heads.

 

how much more does a SR and MR outflow the ram jet?

 

I doubt anyone has conducted a test fly89. To really get it right theyd all have to be flowed on the same bench on the same day for a really accurate comparo.

In all honesty, Id say its not a real big diff. I DO think that the RPM range it affect though makes the ram jet and mini ram similar.

------------------
-86 IROC
Jacked up like a mother!
this years goal: 10.50 @ 130+ mph
-=ICON Motorsports=-

 

I think that the Ramjet and MR will flow the same or very similar. The SR out of the box would not be very close to either one unless it was ported to the max. The Ramjet seems to offer more torque than the MR but not near the torque monster that the SR or TPI is.

 

Blown is right about having more torque. The ram jet is it's own design though. I think you could describe it as a compromise between the MR and SR. Or as a compromise between TPI and LT1/MR. That is why the intake appeals to me. If you want a high RPM screamer than get a MR. BUT, if you aren't gonna go past 6200-6500 RPM, but want to make good power past what the TPI can (while retaining a good torqe curve) than a ram jet would be a good choice.

[This message has been edited by drain89 (edited May 25, 2001).]

 

I worked up my Ramjet order with GMpartsdirect.com, those weird high $ shipping charges killed their deal. So a quick call to the local GM where I get a 28% discount showed the GMpartsdirect.com prices to be dealer cost. I will be calling S&D and getting everything I need, unless anybody know's where this stuff can be had for cheaper. Now I will have to wait until Monday to order this stuff, damnnnnnn. S&D has the Ramjet intake for $400 and my roller lifter kit for $179(only $5 above their cost).

 

JOE How many of those 9439930 FPR Bolt .31 do we need? They come in a 10 pack but I am guessing the Ramjet only needs one or two. Also are thier any hoses on the FPR or just the vacume line?


[This message has been edited by BLOWN85/TA (edited May 26, 2001).]

 

I think you'll be waiting until tuesday, since monday is a holiday or something...
The intake comes bare, no grommet for the PCV, no hoses. It sure looks nice though.
It would be nice if someone sponsered me a RJ fuel injection to try out on my car I'd even put a sticker on it for advertisement.

------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

[This message has been edited by Joseph@SDSC (edited May 27, 2001).]

 

Might flip over to the Prom Board, I just posted a few topics that would help ya figure this out

 

Camaro, why not start with your MAF system and give it a whirl? If it works, then you are bucks ahead. If it doesn't work, then look into SD.

As a starting BIN, I think the ARAP would be as good a place as any other. It is for the 89 F-body and probably the best GM BIN for a MAF car. Do a search it on "ARAP" on DIY PROM and do a little reading on it...lots of excellent info about that BIN.

You will definitely want an 89 BIN as it does not use the Cold Start Injector or the "9th Injector". Guys with older MAF cars just disable the 9th Injector and go ARAP. Again, read up on it on DIY PROM.

But, using the ARAP BIN, I cannot see any reason why you could not make the MAF system work with the RamJet. It may drive like crap initially, but with tweaking you should be able to get it to perform/no worst than a Miniram.

And, after all that, should you decide to go SD for whatever reason...(you can search on that at DIY PROM). You can pick up a 7730 ecm from any 3.1 Cavalier, Sunbird, Grand-Am, Berretta or Corsica (plus their other GM cousins...basically any 3.1 V6 from the early 90s EXCEPT "W" Bodies.

Harnesses can be repinned, scavanged or purchased...search on that subject too on DIY PROM. All that info is there too.

But converting to SD is not that hard or expensive...but you can do that AFTER you try making it work with MAF, and keep the SD Option as a Plan B.

 

Someone on the boards made their l98 a ramjet, this was when the ramjet FIRST came out so he hat to machine his own fuel rails... he later sold it on ebay...
Sorry i cant remember anything else

 

Yes, that was SuperChevy. As I recall, just as he got it fabricated together he had to sell it. It was around last Christmas.

He also did a little reworking of the intake and ported it. Circumstances required him to sell it before he got a chance to install it. He never got to the point of looking at his ecm options.

Most of the posts were on the Aftermarket Product Review Board, IIRC.

 

I bought a used 5.7 Vortec throtle body on Sat, hope its the right one. Got the money order sent off for the 7730 ECM memcal and wiring connectors for it. Now I need part #s for the MAP sensor? I hope to find time to order the Ramjet and almost everything else Tuesday from S&D.
Glenn, can I run a 2 bar MAP now, even though the ECM cant interpret the 2nd bar without it messing things up? I am one of those who needs people like you and Bobalos to help figure the 2 bar MAP code out for the 7730. I know you have worked on it when you find the time, and cant wait until you get more time. Now I am cant decide between a single turbo and v belts, or a Procharger or Vortech and serpentine? Either way the Ramjet will see some boost.

If I build it...GLenn's 2bar MAP code will come!
(field of ECM dreams, Warner Bros. 2001)

 

Let me know how that 5.7 TB works for you. I looked at those as a possibility for the RJ intake, but decided the Throttle cables would need a different bracket.
The 5.7 TB mounts flat on the intake, air inlet up. The LS1's and the RJ mount in the front (front air inlet) and pull the throttle open at a different angle than the 5.7L TB would, although you can probably change the Throttle shaft to a different one also. Another difference is the size of the TB housing, where the air inlet ducting would mount.
I can get takeoff TB's exactly like the RJ's for pretty cheap.

Here are a few scanned pics, there are part numbers scanned in there somewhere for the RamJet engine parts and stuff. http://67camaross.cz28.com/RJ350/RJ350.html


------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

 

Joseph
Yeah I had figured that out, but did not have a supplier of the other T/B's. ****** Carbs is about two blocks from me, we are going to MAKE not flip the TPI style T/B linkage and adapt to the Vortech, then I will remake a TPI throttle and other cable bracket. If it works I will share, and it should work. If you just flip the TPI bracket over it looks like it wont work right for all the cables. How much for one of the LS1 T/B's?

 

Sorry for not posting, i was away for the long weekend...I think I will just go ahead and try putting the MAF on the RamJet with vortec heads, does anyone have a clue what besides the 9th injector need to be disabled or enabled? What size injectors for the RamJet with the Vortec and the L98 Cam? Accel 24lbs work with an AFPR?

 

Yes, the Accel 24lb/hr injectors will work fine. You also might check the price against the SVO 24lbers. Im running the SVO 30lb on my Ram Jet setup with the Fast burn heads and Lt4 Hot cam. Check into the Aeromotive AFPR for the LT1 corvette. This one will work on the Ram Jet.

------------------
L98, 3.27 9-bolt, Hooker shorty headers, custom 2.5inch Y-pipe, no cat, 3inch 2chamber flowmaster, JET AFPR, Ported MAF, Best ET: 13.86 @100mph. 1.99 60'
17 inch ROH "ZS" wheels. 17x8.5(front) and 17x9.5 (rear). Firestone Firehawk SZ50s. 245/45/zr17s and 275/40/zr17s. T56

On the way... Radar Blue 89 Formula, T56, Ram Jet 430, Ram Air, 17inch ROHs.

 

These are used take-off's
Unported go for $45 shipped
Ported/polished will sell for $100 shipped
* either would come with the TP Sensor, and IAC motor, and if you didn't already know the throttle blade is 75mm in diameter.
I have 1 ported one set aside for myself, if I ever get the rest of the system. I plan on using the RJ harness and marine ECM (~$750). The RJ ECM does have a limited RPM range though (tops out at 6200 I think) I would like to get 6500 out of it since the engines I build make power to 6500 carburated.
I think that someone was building one with the Accel DFI system also, sounds like a very good idea, as far as programming capability, not on price though...

The SVO 24lb ones were on the RamJet ZZ430 that S/D made if I remember correctly. I will check more on that at after work. Aren't they priced around $230?


------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

 

Joseph Whats the size on the 5.7 Vortec T/B throttle blade? Cant remember everything myself.

 

It should also be 75mm. The 5.7 Vortec TB will have a air baffle riveted to the TB, I would find a way to remove it and plug the holes it left if you use it.


------------------
-Joseph
ASE Master Automobile Technician
Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet

1967 Camaro (Vortec Heads, GM Vortec Intake, ZZ4 roller camshaft) --- Planning T-56 Install in the near future
1992 Firebird (Weiler Vortec Heads, LT4 Hot Cam, GM Vortec Intake, 3000 Stall, 3.73's, Auburn Posi)

 

Joseph
Have you seen any Ramjet, fastburn head engines with the ZZ4 cam installed on a regular ZZ4 shortblock? I was thinking it would be around 400 or so HP. I know that the Hot cam gives about 30 or 40 more HP than the ZZ4 cam, but at the expense of streetability.

 

yeah...I think I will just try it with the MAF and then if it does not work convert to SD.



[This message has been edited by camaro6spd (edited June 01, 2001).]

 

I didn't see it posted here...but there was a letter in either GM High Tech Performance or Chevy High Performance in the last coupla months on the Ramjet topic. I am debating on going this route myself, but that article had all the part numbers listed...as someone posted here...I think it had the big stuff mainly...

Also, I did some research and yes, gmpartsdirect screws you on shipping. I looked on SDPC I believe...or it might have been at http://www.vandevere.com and got the price for what I'd need at around 800 bucks. That's not including small stuff like bolts, etc...just the big stuff(fuel rails inc). I saw it as a very cost effective solution and it would be 'different' which would be sweet.

I look forward to hearing about anyone's swap, but it looks fairly straight forward to me. I was going to retain my factory MAF setup for now and adapt the wiring harness as necassary.

------------------
GregF
87 IROC