camaro6spd

I wanna get mo rev out of the TPI 305, I would port the stock heads, Use SLP siameased runners, port teh base and port the plenum with a cam to match, what kind of RPMS should I expect power too and what cam would be good for this?

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1987 Black 305 TPI 5spd IROC, seems to be fully loaded, but can't find RPO codes.

AIM: IROC 5spd
http://www.geocities.com/chevy5spdiroc/87Roc.htm

deadbird

I've got a 305 TPI 5speed too. I took my bird out for some 'break-in' runs last week & it pulls great right up to 6000rpm (no b.s.) after some very mild port work & port matching to the TPI (the fresh engine doesn't hurt either). I don't know if it had anything left or not after that but I didn't want to risk finding out for more than one reason

------------------

• my Formula Homepage
• Collision P/Ns & Diagrams (Nearly complete now!)

"Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach
you to keep your mouth shut."

camaro6spd

cool, that sound awsome but I thought they ran of ouf power around 4800 5000

Crusader

iTrader: (1)

Stock they ran out of breath there. But porting helps the upper RPM breathing. My friend installed aluminum L98 Heads and either aftermarket runners or ported (siamesed?) stock runners and his car pulls much harder up top now.

Jess

[This message has been edited by Crusader (edited October 04, 2001).]

Bugsbunny

Look at my sig below. It used to only pull up to 5000rpm tops. Now after doing the intake and exhaust, it tachs out at 6000 RPM. It will go a hair over but I'm using a 6K rev limiter on it to be safe. This is with the stock heads and cam on a 120K mile motor.

Bugs

------------------
91 Z28 305TPI 5spd
Hypertech Stage II, EB Intake & Runners, Ported Plenum, EB Headers, 3" Cat, 3" FM Catback, 1.6RR's, 3.42gears, B&M Ripper Shifter, MSD Wires/Cap/Rotor/6AL, AFPR, Air Foil, K&N's, Gutted Airbox, TB Bypass, platinum plugs, and 160deg Stat.

camaro6spd

instead of buying a EB base and runners could I port my base to match the SLP runners and get the same results? Or would it just beworth buying the EB.


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1987 Black 305 TPI 5spd IROC, seems to be fully loaded, but can't find RPO codes.

AIM: IROC 5spd
http://www.geocities.com/chevy5spdiroc/87Roc.htm

RoadRocket L98

Its going to be tougher to wind up a 305 as opposed to a 350 due to the 305s valve-shrouding small bore. If you are serious about making any real power upwards in the powerband, you gotta get rid of the long-runner setup.

------------------
'89 Firebird Formula 350
L98, WS6, Red/grey, t-tops, and a 3.27:1 rear
K&N, TB bypass, no MAF screens, CAI, full Accel ignition, no cats, Hooker Supercomp shorties, Hooker 3-inch catback
ET? 14.8 @ 93mph
Also own '83 Firebird 2.8 2bbl. 155K miles.
ET? Break out the calendar!

Bugsbunny

Also, my car pulls like a mother between 4-6K rpm. Drop it in 4th when doing 85, slam the peddle, and it plants your *** in the seat.

Bugs

CloudZRoc

The Highest I've had my rpms was about 6150 on stock LB9 TPI 305

camaro6spd

yeah, i really looking for setup that would raise the peak power up in the RPMS

8Mike9

Hey Bugs,

You the same BB from camaroz28.com? If so, did you pull into the 13's?

Bugsbunny

Hey Mike, yeah it's me. I finally made it to the track yesterday. I'm both happy and mad: mad that my time slips sucked but happy to know that I have a great chance at breaking into high 13's with practice.

Heres how it went. On my first run, I was so nervous I forgot to pay attention to what I was doing. My tires spun off the line so I completely let off the gas to catch traction and then floored it again. Now while I was busy thinking about how stupid I was for doing that since I just lost all of my momentum, I then completely missed second gear. Now I was pissed off and wasted hella time to carefully put it in second and then hit the gas again. Shifting 2nd to 3rd was good. Then I completey missed 4th gear about 20yrds before the end. I'm still trying to get used to the B&M shifter...since it shifts faster, i need to make sure I fully press the clutch down before I start trying to shift. Anyways, my time was 15.39 @ 90mph with a 2.4x 60ft. I was so mad dood that I wanted to leave and come back another day. My times before the mods were better than this. Well, I had to give it one more try so I did. Second Run...I did a little burnout (either to clean off the tires or maybe warm them up) and this turned out to help me a lot even with my street tires giving me a 2.2 60ft. This time I was much more focused but I decided to only rev no more than 5.5K rpm thinking it would be easier for me to shift gears. (Driving home I realized that the car pulls really strong all the way up to 6K where my rev limiter is) Well I got a 14.51 on this run @ 92mph and after comparing the 2 time slips I was satisfied enough knowing I have the potential, but would be better off coming back on test and tune night to practice. On that second run, i also learned a lot more about how to shift fast with this B&M. And I also learned how to launch much better. I don't know when I'll be able to make it there for test n tune but I can't wait. I know shifting at only 5.5K killed me bad because on both runs, I had the same speed (73mph) at I3. I think I still reved to 6K in first but took it too easy in second and third. Thats why my speed was so ****ty even on the second run. Well, thats about it for now. I need some serious practice and will repost again I do. Thanks for inquiring Mike.

Bugs

------------------
91 Z28 305TPI 5spd
Hypertech Stage II, EB Intake & Runners, Ported Plenum, EB Headers, 3" Cat, 3" FM Catback, 1.6RR's, 3.42gears, B&M Ripper Shifter, MSD Wires/Cap/Rotor/6AL, AFPR, Air Foil, K&N's, Gutted Airbox, TB Bypass, platinum plugs, and 160deg Stat.

Blockhead

Silly wabbit!
Evweywon knows dat tpi wonwly wevs to 4500. anything else is like me twying to KILL DE WABBIT! It not going to happen!



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Yea .... but it's gonna to the big adios in a BLAZE a glory....
Director of Darwin Awards @ www.thirdgen.org

CamuMan

are those of you that wind out to 6 grand on a 305 relying on the stock tach and if so do you have an msd ignition? if so, than you tach is way off. when it says 6 grand your really only at 4500 or so. you need an msd tach adapter to correct it. not trying to burst your bubble cause i thought the same thing too. but when i started revving the biatch to an indicated 7000 rpm i questioned it. i then put an autometer tach attached directly to the msd ignition box and found out the real deal. my car pulls to about 5300 rpm and my mods are in the sig. i wouldn't call them minor either. just a thought.

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91 Z28, 305 TPI, SLP cam & runners, 3.73 gears, Hedman headers, BBK 58mm TB, k&N, tach, speedo, Hurst short shifter, NICE stereo, alarm w/ window module, MSD 6A, HP Alt., Ported WORLD Heads, Ported and Port Matched Intake Manifold. 99 C5 Rims 17"s in front 18"s out back
EAT, SLEEP, BREATH CHEVY

TRAXION

I hate it when TPI guys say that their car revs to 6K. I hate it because its deceiving to other people on the boards - especially newbies. Almost any car out there will rev to 6000rpms. The real story is POWER at 6000rpms. You won't really understand what that is until you get in a car with a shorter runner intake (or a car that has forced induction). It pulls. My old Chevrolet Celebrity would rev to 6K. But, that means crap. Also - reving a TPI long runner setup (no siamesing) to 6K is useless. You are basically putting stress on the valvetrain and engine when it is not warranted.

Tim

------------------
TRAXION's 1990 IROC-Z
Best Time = 12.244 @ 112.51mph (1.778 60' / 7.819@88.32mph in the 1/8)
All Natural. No Force. No Drugs. Stock Bottom End. Stock Body Panels.
Gunning for NA 11's with bigger cam, bigger stall, and bigger exhaust.
-=ICON Motorsports=-
Moderator: PROM board at thirdgen.org

8Mike9

Hey Good deal Bugs....looks like the mods shaved about a 1/2 second off your times? IIRC you were around 15-flat?

That's still about 50HP you bolted on.

Listen to Traxion, you may get to wher you want to be

I didn't realize you were in Sacramento, is Test and Tune on Wednesdays up there? When I was growing up is was called "Grudge Night" on Wednesdays.

Once I either pi$$ or get off the pot and decide what I'm going to do with the topend of my engine, maybe we can hook up and make a few passes together, I'm about an hour below ya.

camaro6spd

yeah, i am looking to extend the power up a few hundred RPMS, something like 500.

deadbird

Not to argue anyone but..
I guess my car(tach) is wrong from the factory then It came with a 5500rpm redline (it's a formula 5 speed) & was able to hit that before I ever touched a thing (aside from a new FP). Granted it wasn't pulling like a rocketship @ 52-55k but, it certainly wasn't falling flat on its face either (altho valve float was a problem). I don't see where an extra 500rmp above what GM thought it would run to is so implausable after rebuilding my motor.

I could be completely wrong (which wouldn't be a 1st) but I do know the motor in my bird winds up alot harder and higher rpms then the p.o.s. lg4 in my camaro that I've run (unless the tachs are wrong in those cars too) to 5k many times (to the car's dismay).

The 305 doesn't have quite the hunger for air like a 350 so one would think it could rev higher than a 350 with identical setups.

If a 350 needs 532cfm@5250rpm (100% v.e. for simplicity),,, even at 6000 rpm,, a 305 is still under at 529 CFM*

Maybe that makes sense or it's simply a stupid way of thinking, I just know the feel of my cars.

* based on this air flow formula from a book
c.i. of engine / 1728 = cu.ft.
cu.ft. * RPM / 2 = ideal cfm


[This message has been edited by deadbird (edited October 12, 2001).]

Bugsbunny

Camuman, yeah I do have an msd ignition. I never knew that it would throw off the rpm's though. Thanks for the info.

Bugsbunny

I am a newbie, and I did not know.



[This message has been edited by Bugsbunny (edited October 12, 2001).]

Bugsbunny

Hey Mike,

I think the mods are actually more than half a second when i drive it right..it's just that on that last run, I didn't tach out anywhere near where I should have. When playing around on my way home, I saw that it really pulled hard all the way up to 6K (not truly 6K, but on my display), and on that run I only reved 2nd and 3rd up to about 5400K. Thats why even on that second faster run, I only ended up going the exact same speed at the third marker as the first run. I really slowed myself down bad!

Test n' Tune is on Saturdays...I think it might change to Fridays soon but I'm not sure. Wednesday's are race nights for all. Grudges are on Fridays for now. Yeah, let me know when you plan on racing if you get around to it. I'm sure I could use some pointers.

Bugs

Bugsbunny

campuman/traxion,

After thinking about it, I have to disagree with you guys. Taking into consideration that my car went to 5K before, I definately believe it now goes to 6K since I opened up everything to allow the car to breath more ie. ported plenum, bigger runners, intake, headers, 3"cat and 3"catback. If you disagree, lets hear it.

Bugs

------------------
91 Z28 305TPI 5spd
Hypertech Stage II, EB Intake & Runners, Ported Plenum, EB Headers, 3" Cat, 3" FM Catback, 1.6RR's, 3.42gears, B&M Ripper Shifter, MSD Wires/Cap/Rotor/6AL, AFPR, Air Foil, K&N's, Gutted Airbox, TB Bypass, platinum plugs, and 160deg Stat.

67 Camaro 88

I am no expert, so no flames please , but I thought the stock cam was a big hold back on the high rpm power. Ive heard many refer to it as a "truck cam."

82resto

Well,
I went out after work last night to see exactly where my nearly stock LB9 stopped making power. I just took it on some side streets, and with my Accel ignition rev limiter set at 5250, I drove the hell out of it. Sure enough, right before the limiter kicked in, my car stopped making power. No, it didn't die, but it was not at its peak. It peaked around 4,800 RPMS or so, and then started losing oomph.

There's some input from me as to where the stock TPI long runner power stops putting out.

Jon

------------------
89 GTA
Beautiful Gunmetal gray, LB9 305 and T5 tranny. Only 60,000 miles!
Dual cats, 3"flomaster
Accel 300+ Ignition, wires, cap, coil, etc
Airfoil
KN Airfilter
Removed Screens on MAF
SLP 1 3/4 headers
No Smog/AIR system

camaro6spd

yesh, and i will further that info, but......i have a 305 with a truck cam(no, really it is a truck cam K blazer TBI, and truck TBI heads. lol
oh well

CamuMan

your car does NOT pull to 6,000 rpm. impossible. dude, i have way more mods then you ie ported world heads, new cam, headers, blah blah look in sig and i don't pull to 6000 rpm. i am telling you, you msd box is throwing your tach off. get the damned adapter to fix it or tap off the tach output on your msd box with an external tach to see what i am saying. however, if your car pulls to 6000 rpm than mine pulls to 10000 rpm lol. tpi cars do not wind out.

CamuMan

oops see sig.

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91 Z28, 305 TPI, SLP cam & runners, 3.73 gears, Hedman headers, BBK 58mm TB, k&N, tach, speedo, Hurst short shifter, NICE stereo, alarm w/ window module, MSD 6A, HP Alt., Ported WORLD Heads, Ported and Port Matched Intake Manifold. 99 C5 Rims 17"s in front 18"s out back
EAT, SLEEP, BREATH CHEVY

Bugsbunny

Uh, yes it does! Are you trying to tell me that allowing my engine to breath makes no effect on rpm? And if the rpm were to be off, then that means my car is idling at 400rpm now huh? Just because something is wacky with your car doesn't mean theres something wacky about mine!

Bugs

CamuMan

dude, its almost a stock tpi. did you change the intake runners. listen to traxion. he knows what hes talking about. have you even brought your car to the track yet. do yourself a favor and buy an external tach. hook it directly to the tach output switch on the msd box and then compare the two readings. you'll **** yourself when you see that they are very different!!!!! also, they ain't nothing wrong with my car. i just think realistically and not in the imagination world. but for real, stop making these claims until you get an accurate tachometer. and if you won't then you'll never know that your car only pulls to about 5000 rpm.

Bugsbunny

Yes I did change the runners...and intake..and ported the plenum as well.

------------------
91 Z28 305TPI 5spd
Hypertech Stage II, EB Intake & Runners, Ported Plenum, EB Headers, 3" Cat, 3" FM Catback, 1.6RR's, 3.42gears, B&M Ripper Shifter, MSD Wires/Cap/Rotor/6AL, AFPR, Air Foil, K&N's, Gutted Airbox, TB Bypass, platinum plugs, and 160deg Stat.

CamuMan

do you still have the stock peanut cam. that sure as hell ain't gonna let ya wind to 6. dude, trust me, put an aftermarket tach and get an "accurate reading". you'll be surprised.

Bugsbunny

Let me ask you this...in your opinion, name everything that limits our stock cars from going over 5K rpm?

[This message has been edited by Bugsbunny (edited October 16, 2001).]

CamuMan

ask traxion, he knows all about tpi. an inherent quality about tpi is the fact that it improves lowend grunt but is not designed to see 6000 rpm EFFECTIVELY. the setup of the entire intake system limits the high end rpms. in addition, your stock cam has no duration and very minimal lift. take my advice for the fourth time, get an aftermarket tach and get an accurate reading. the msd THROWS OFF YOUR STOCK TACHS READING AND MAKES IT VERY OPTIMISTIC. i know this cause it happened to me. trust me.

85transamtpi

This is my first post in this thread, and I have to say my 85 LB9 likes to pull all the way to the red also. I've heard many times about the 4500 tpi problem, and I have done some experimenting at the track last year. My car lost .5 sec shifting at 5000rpm vs. shifting at 6000rpm. I dont have a MSD box so my tach couldnt be off because of it. The only thing I could think of was that I have a fairly large (for stock) cam. I have stock heads that I've never taken off. Either the theory is wrong or a previous owner of my car has ported out the tpi (VERY DOUBTFUL). Maybe I'll take some video and post it so you believe me.
peace

Guido

Bugs your losing it man.

I had a TPIS base, SLP runners, and plenum all extrude honed before. I also had a 218/224 duration cam and AFR190 heads and it would pull to 5000 rpms MAX before it started to drop off.

Get someone else to run the butt dyno.
Quit now and save face.

------------------
-86 IROC

-=ICON Motorsports=-

Bugsbunny

And I enhanced my setup therefore increasing the limit


------------------
91 Z28 305TPI 5spd
Hypertech Stage II, EB Intake & Runners, Ported Plenum, EB Headers, 3" Cat, 3" FM Catback, 1.6RR's, 3.42gears, B&M Ripper Shifter, MSD Wires/Cap/Rotor/6AL, AFPR, Air Foil, K&N's, Gutted Airbox, TB Bypass, platinum plugs, and 160deg Stat.

TRAXION

I don't doubt that your car can get 6000rpms. DO YOU HEAR WHAT I AM SAYING? Man - how can some people be so dam stupid. Read this next sentence VERY carefully. Many many cars out there can rev to 6000 rpms. But, there is a difference between reving to 6000rpms and making power to 6000rpms. Get it? My stock L98 would rev to 6000rpms. My Chevrolet Celebrity would rev to 6000rpms. But, that means chit. The whole point is power. Geeeez. Go home. Nobody is saying your car doesn't rev to 6000rpms. The point is that your car isn't making any real power at 6000rpms.

Tim

------------------
TRAXION's 1990 IROC-Z
Best Time = 12.244 @ 112.51mph (1.778 60' / 7.819@88.32mph in the 1/8)
All Natural. No Force. No Drugs. Stock Bottom End. Stock Body Panels.
Gunning for NA 11's with bigger cam, bigger stall, and bigger exhaust.
-=ICON Motorsports=-
Moderator: PROM board at thirdgen.org

Bugsbunny

Traxion,

You wanna talk about stupid, try looking in the mirror because you have no clue. You act like you've driven my car and you haven't. It's making horses up to 6K and I know that for a fact. And as for what compuman is saying about the msd, I didn't even install the msd until 3 weeks after doing all my mods. The car pulls up to 6K and then starts to drop off after that, which is why I chose to use a 6K rev limiter. Maybe my mechanic was better than yours..who knows?

85transamtpi

I dont mean to cause trouble, but I am Sure my car is slower in the quarter mile by .5 sec when I shift at 5000rpm vs 6000rpm. I've got the timeslips to prove it.
This would disprove the thoery that my engine isnt making any power there.
again, Im just saying that is how my car performs.
peace

Bugsbunny

85transamtpi, what is your setup?

And for traxion and compuman, what do you have to say about his LB9?



[This message has been edited by Bugsbunny (edited October 16, 2001).]

Guido

He is as dilusional as you are.

Bugsbunny

Guido,

And what about deadbirds post up above?

Guido

I think I know what works and what doesnt work.

6000 rpm TPI's dont work.
I know. I went from extrude honed TPI to a mini ram and that being the ONLY change it REALLY opened things up. I was able to shift it at 6500 then and make power. It was worthless after 5000 with the TPI before.

I know my own experience and hundreds of others on this board.

Bugsbunny

Guido,

And most of you guys have the same size motor too, a 350...thats a different situation.

85transamtpi

85transam
LB9
3.27 bw rear
700r4
my only mods are a tpis airfoil, catback exhaust, and K&N.
At the track I ran a consistant 15.5 @ 89mph while shifting at 5000rpm. When shifting at 6000rpm I got a consistant 15.0 @ 91.5. I ran each three times that day and results were within .0xx.
Im not trying to fuel any debates but this is how my car ran.
peace

Guest

Ive had my 305 to 6400, so whats your point Bugs?

Have you done experimentation (ie:Racetrack, timeslips) using different shift points to determine the best RPM to shift at in each gear? Something tells me no.

Blockhead

bugsbunny your a ****in retard.

Jarod

This just goes to show that you have absolutely no idea what in the hell you're talking about. Guido and Traxion don't have mechanics, they do all their own work because they know their ****. Here's a good lesson for you, if you don't know how to work on your own damn car then don't argue with guys who can and have 11 second timeslips to prove it.

Also for the record, I use to own an 87 IROC w/ a 305 TPI that had every bolt on available including a fully port-matched TPI, ram air, and TES headers. I know for a fact that my car never made power above 5k rpm either.

------------------
Black '99 T/A M6
12.67 @ 111 mph N/A

Bugsbunny

Yes I have, I just ran last wednesday and my second run was terrible because I only tached to 5400 instead of 6K in 2nd and 3rd gear. And hey, it's not just me saying this..read above and there's more proof from others and with time slips as well. BTW, I'm willing to bet deadbird has a LB9 too.

Anyways, I don't see why you guys have such a hard time believing this. If you had the exact same setup, I could possibly understand your point...but it does appear that others in this post have experienced the same results as me.

I don't know why you guys have to be so hard headed about it.....that's just the way it is and I got proof as well as others. But I have noticed a heavy presence of moderators building up in here...am I on trial now just because my car performs like other people with the same motor which happens to differ from most of yours???

Bugsbunny

Look dude, my buddy who worked on my car has been racing camaros for 10 years. He himself has a 9 second car. He does all his work himself and definately knows what he is doing.

But truthfully, just to state what times they pull doesn't mean jack and even you should know that. Anyone can pull 11's, 10's, even 7's if you want to spend the money.


[This message has been edited by Bugsbunny (edited October 16, 2001).]