corvette servo and shift kit bad for 700?
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 344
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From: michigan
Car: 1985 TransAm
Engine: 5.0L TPI
Transmission: 700R4 auto
Axle/Gears: 3.27 BorgWarner
corvette servo and shift kit bad for 700?
so i was on google and doing some research on the corvette servo i cam across this
id like some input on what u think
Some transmissions do have shift quality problems that need to be dealt with. For example, the 700R4 transmission has a nasty habit of burning the 3/4 clutches. To "fix" this problem, many rebuilders add an "Alto" kit (or another brand of clutch pack, that are thinner, providing room for more clutches), and drill out the apply hole (which makes the clutch pack apply more quickly). In addition, to make the transmission shift harder into second gear, they change to a Corvette servo piston, which has more apply serface area. The 700R4 3/4 clutch pack usually burns up, as a direct result of a few different problems, all of which are not addressed by most technicians. Number one: the 2nd gear band must release when the 3/4 clutches apply, to produce a 2nd to 3rd shift, so, when they increase the apply area of the band,(to make the 2nd gear shift harder), they also make the band release more slowly, and, together, with the 3rd apply hole, they drilled out, to make the 3/4 clutches apply more quickly, they produce a "bind up" in the 700 which causes the 3/4 clutches, and the 2nd gear band, to burn up, prematurely, due to excessive heat. (Remember, the original problem with a 700R4 is premature 3/4 clutch burn up, which has just been made worse by the technician who "improved" the unit). In addition, the 700 has a couple other weak points that include a weak sungear shell, and a weak input sprag, which both hold up fine, unless they are "hammered on" by harsh shifts. Installing a shiftkit in a 700, to produce firm shifts, will CAUSE transmission failure. GM has found, by smoothing out the shifts, that the input sprag, and sungear shell, are very reliable components. GM has also found that by INCREASING the thickness of the 3/4 clutch steels (rather than decreasing the thickness, like the Alto kit does), the clutches can dissipate more heat, sucessfully, without burning up the clutches, and make the 3/4 clutch pack last longer. In addition, many rebuilders have found, including myself, that increasing the size of the 3/4 release hole to .078" (I got this trick from a shift kit, so I must admit that shiftkits can be a "good thing" if the correct things are altered, for the right reasons), which tends to help the 3/4 clutches release during a 3rd to 2nd downshift, eliminating "bind up" in this condition, as well as replacing the servo accumulator check ball capsule (the capsule wears severely, and can be the CAUSE of 3/4 clutch failure, in many cases, and drilling the 3rd clutch apply hole to around .090", can all help make the 3/4 clutch failure a "thing of the past", in most cases. One more interesting comment about 700 "common repair mistakes": I have never seen a problem with the 2nd gear band overheating, due to a soft 1st to 2nd gear shift....So why does everyone want to install the Corvette servo piston that has more surface area. The corvette uses a specially calibrated valvebody and separator plate, designed with the special servo piston in mind, so it does not produce a tremendously hard shift, into second; installing the Corvette servo in a transmission that does not have a valvebody and separator plate designed with the Corvette servo piston in mind, produces a harsh shift that causes premature failure of the sungear shell, and input sprag.
id like some input on what u think
Some transmissions do have shift quality problems that need to be dealt with. For example, the 700R4 transmission has a nasty habit of burning the 3/4 clutches. To "fix" this problem, many rebuilders add an "Alto" kit (or another brand of clutch pack, that are thinner, providing room for more clutches), and drill out the apply hole (which makes the clutch pack apply more quickly). In addition, to make the transmission shift harder into second gear, they change to a Corvette servo piston, which has more apply serface area. The 700R4 3/4 clutch pack usually burns up, as a direct result of a few different problems, all of which are not addressed by most technicians. Number one: the 2nd gear band must release when the 3/4 clutches apply, to produce a 2nd to 3rd shift, so, when they increase the apply area of the band,(to make the 2nd gear shift harder), they also make the band release more slowly, and, together, with the 3rd apply hole, they drilled out, to make the 3/4 clutches apply more quickly, they produce a "bind up" in the 700 which causes the 3/4 clutches, and the 2nd gear band, to burn up, prematurely, due to excessive heat. (Remember, the original problem with a 700R4 is premature 3/4 clutch burn up, which has just been made worse by the technician who "improved" the unit). In addition, the 700 has a couple other weak points that include a weak sungear shell, and a weak input sprag, which both hold up fine, unless they are "hammered on" by harsh shifts. Installing a shiftkit in a 700, to produce firm shifts, will CAUSE transmission failure. GM has found, by smoothing out the shifts, that the input sprag, and sungear shell, are very reliable components. GM has also found that by INCREASING the thickness of the 3/4 clutch steels (rather than decreasing the thickness, like the Alto kit does), the clutches can dissipate more heat, sucessfully, without burning up the clutches, and make the 3/4 clutch pack last longer. In addition, many rebuilders have found, including myself, that increasing the size of the 3/4 release hole to .078" (I got this trick from a shift kit, so I must admit that shiftkits can be a "good thing" if the correct things are altered, for the right reasons), which tends to help the 3/4 clutches release during a 3rd to 2nd downshift, eliminating "bind up" in this condition, as well as replacing the servo accumulator check ball capsule (the capsule wears severely, and can be the CAUSE of 3/4 clutch failure, in many cases, and drilling the 3rd clutch apply hole to around .090", can all help make the 3/4 clutch failure a "thing of the past", in most cases. One more interesting comment about 700 "common repair mistakes": I have never seen a problem with the 2nd gear band overheating, due to a soft 1st to 2nd gear shift....So why does everyone want to install the Corvette servo piston that has more surface area. The corvette uses a specially calibrated valvebody and separator plate, designed with the special servo piston in mind, so it does not produce a tremendously hard shift, into second; installing the Corvette servo in a transmission that does not have a valvebody and separator plate designed with the Corvette servo piston in mind, produces a harsh shift that causes premature failure of the sungear shell, and input sprag.
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Joined: Aug 2007
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From: Mass
Car: 92 Rs
Engine: 4 Bolt "010" 383
Transmission: 700R4 trans brake Hughes 3K convert
Axle/Gears: BW 9Bolt 3.70's
Re: corvette servo and shift kit bad for 700?
you are correct about the vette servo in a tranny thats not meant for it.
such as the separator plate and the valve body.
shift kits.... well it all depends on what it consists of...
for example. the kit from Transgo. is an improver and a "Manual AutoMatic" and a "full Manual" conversion all in one. and yes it comes with a new "vette" style servo but you can choose if you want to install it or not. and it also comes with apply pistons and gaskets as well.
its all where you get your parts and who puts them in that makes all the difference.
LUKE
such as the separator plate and the valve body.
shift kits.... well it all depends on what it consists of...
for example. the kit from Transgo. is an improver and a "Manual AutoMatic" and a "full Manual" conversion all in one. and yes it comes with a new "vette" style servo but you can choose if you want to install it or not. and it also comes with apply pistons and gaskets as well.
its all where you get your parts and who puts them in that makes all the difference.
LUKE
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,366
Likes: 1
From: louisville, ky
Axle/Gears: '01 3.42 10 bolt
Re: corvette servo and shift kit bad for 700?
i've been using a billet servo which has more apply area than the vette servo and a 29 element input sprag. i also use a hardened sunshell. the new factory shells are hardened from what i've seen. i haven't had any input sprag issues or sunshell issues. i also use the transgo 700 2&3 kit. this kit is really good as you can do some calibrating with it. i haven't used a b&m kit but i hear it can cause some rough shifting because all it does is block accumulators and such.
do a search and draw your own conclusions. the good shift kits(transgo) don't destroy transmission unless they aren't installed properly.
do a search and draw your own conclusions. the good shift kits(transgo) don't destroy transmission unless they aren't installed properly.
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