4th gen rear end questions
09-13-2010, 07:19 PM
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4th gen rear end questions
is a rear end from an LT1 car the same as one from a LS1 car? i came across an LT1 Z28 posi rear for $200 and i want to put it in my 89 camaro but i didnt know if one from a 98 or newer car will be stronger?
09-13-2010, 07:21 PM
#2
Re: 4th gen rear end questions
As for "the same" - No, the LT1 rear is actually a tiny bit wider than the LS1 rear and the brakes are much smaller.
For $200, I'd keep looking; I see LS1 complete rears go for $300-$350 usually.
09-13-2010, 07:55 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
thanks for it info, i actually just found out it was from a 98 camaro, but it has 2.73 gears and that is what i have not and i want somthing better like 373
09-14-2010, 07:47 AM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...-10-bolts.html
JamesC
09-14-2010, 02:34 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
that guy has a friend that has an aurbun gear posi center section with 3.73 ratio that will go in my stock housing, im most likely going to get that, he wants 400 for it, cheaper then buying a new one. he says it only has about 1000 miles on it. he is sellling it because he is getting one with 4.88 ratio.
the down fall is that it is posi not limited slip so i dont know how well that will work on the street but i guess it cant be that bad
the down fall is that it is posi not limited slip so i dont know how well that will work on the street but i guess it cant be that bad
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09-14-2010, 07:27 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
You don't want an Auburn.
It's DEFINITELY not worth $400. I might accept one, if somebody gave me $100 along with it; no way would I pay even one cent for it. $100 might be enough to compensate me for my trouble storing it and then disposing of it, since I'd have to go out of my way to do that, my local sanitation engineering service won't haul off car parts that are that dense.
"Posi" is GM's old trade name, from the 60s, for "limited slip". They are one and the same, like "Charmin" is just a trade name for "facial quality tissue".
The Auburn technically is, or more likely was at one time in its very early history, a "posi". But it's complete and total utter garbage now: just call Auburn Gear (get the phone # here http://www.auburngear.com/ ) and try to order parts for it, ANY parts. I'd suggest trying to get the things that are the basic wear element, namely the clutch frictions. You'll find out REAL QUICK what the problem is. RUN AWAY from that deal; don't walk, RUN. I screwed up and bought one of those one time about 15 years ago, for AHELLUVALOT less money than that though, so I learned my lesson the hard way. You get to learn it the easy way if you listen though.
Sounds like your friend is one of those that nobody needs one like that, that's what you keep enemies around for.
Your 89 most likely has, or at least came with, 26-spline axles. 90-up carriers have 28-spline side gears. So if you upgrade to any later carrier, you'll probably need axles as well. I'd recommend these if you get to that point. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
It's DEFINITELY not worth $400. I might accept one, if somebody gave me $100 along with it; no way would I pay even one cent for it. $100 might be enough to compensate me for my trouble storing it and then disposing of it, since I'd have to go out of my way to do that, my local sanitation engineering service won't haul off car parts that are that dense.
"Posi" is GM's old trade name, from the 60s, for "limited slip". They are one and the same, like "Charmin" is just a trade name for "facial quality tissue".
The Auburn technically is, or more likely was at one time in its very early history, a "posi". But it's complete and total utter garbage now: just call Auburn Gear (get the phone # here http://www.auburngear.com/ ) and try to order parts for it, ANY parts. I'd suggest trying to get the things that are the basic wear element, namely the clutch frictions. You'll find out REAL QUICK what the problem is. RUN AWAY from that deal; don't walk, RUN. I screwed up and bought one of those one time about 15 years ago, for AHELLUVALOT less money than that though, so I learned my lesson the hard way. You get to learn it the easy way if you listen though.
Sounds like your friend is one of those that nobody needs one like that, that's what you keep enemies around for.
Your 89 most likely has, or at least came with, 26-spline axles. 90-up carriers have 28-spline side gears. So if you upgrade to any later carrier, you'll probably need axles as well. I'd recommend these if you get to that point. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
09-18-2010, 05:05 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
i was lookin on summit and saw the eaton LSD, http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ETN-19599-010/ i have 2.73 gears now. it looks to me that if i would get that i would have to get ring and pinion gear also? at first i thought all i needed was that differential but i think im wrong
09-18-2010, 05:49 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
They may not make a 2-series Eaton; after all, nobody in his/her right mind would buy it.
The best junkyard rear to get is a 98-up ("LS1") one. Those will come with a Zexel Torsen carrier, so you wouldn't need to buy a carrier at all; from there, all you have to do is make sure it's a 3-series (3.23 or higher), which I think any of them that would come with that carrier will be, and then all you'd have to change is the gears if you want something besides what comes in it. There is no difference in "strength" between that and a 90-up 3rd gen rear, although it might be marginally stronger than your 89, because 89 was the last year of 26-spline axles although a few very late production ones got the newer 28-spline ones. There is no difference in legth between the 93-97 ("LT1") rears and the 98-up ones, they are both about 1-5/8" longer on each side, and will make the stock 15" wheels stick out the sides of these cars and look laughably stupid especially from behind where you can see how narrow the stock pizza-cutter base-model RS wheels are. They look just SUPER "poseur" sticking out that way. But, 4th gen wheels bolt right up and fit the car perfect, so it's not a big deal to get right.
You are correct, if you buy a 3-series carrier for your existing rear, there is no way to put your stock 2-series gears on it. You would have to change them. I don't recall Eaton making a 26-spline carrier although I could be misshapen about that, meaning you'd have to change your axles, which is good except that it costs money. If you do go that route, use these axles right here. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
The best junkyard rear to get is a 98-up ("LS1") one. Those will come with a Zexel Torsen carrier, so you wouldn't need to buy a carrier at all; from there, all you have to do is make sure it's a 3-series (3.23 or higher), which I think any of them that would come with that carrier will be, and then all you'd have to change is the gears if you want something besides what comes in it. There is no difference in "strength" between that and a 90-up 3rd gen rear, although it might be marginally stronger than your 89, because 89 was the last year of 26-spline axles although a few very late production ones got the newer 28-spline ones. There is no difference in legth between the 93-97 ("LT1") rears and the 98-up ones, they are both about 1-5/8" longer on each side, and will make the stock 15" wheels stick out the sides of these cars and look laughably stupid especially from behind where you can see how narrow the stock pizza-cutter base-model RS wheels are. They look just SUPER "poseur" sticking out that way. But, 4th gen wheels bolt right up and fit the car perfect, so it's not a big deal to get right.
You are correct, if you buy a 3-series carrier for your existing rear, there is no way to put your stock 2-series gears on it. You would have to change them. I don't recall Eaton making a 26-spline carrier although I could be misshapen about that, meaning you'd have to change your axles, which is good except that it costs money. If you do go that route, use these axles right here. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
09-21-2010, 07:46 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
no matter what i seem to do it looks like its all $$$. im trying to find the best way to get posi and a different gear ratio then 2.73 in my car, i guess finding a stock rear for my car but from and iroc or z28 will be the cheapest and easiest
09-21-2010, 08:34 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
its all $$$
"Speed costs; how fast do you want to spend today sir?"
If you could pick that stuff up for free, there wouldn't be near as many slow cars in the world as there are.
Of course, if ALL it took was $$$$, there ALSO wouldn't be near as many slow cars as there are. It DOES take a couple of neurons you can rub together and get to fire, at least once or twice. Asking here, and PAYING ATTENTION to the advice you get from people who KNOW what they're doing (isn't too hard to separate us from the "look at my Home Depot cold air intake, I've already taken a long road trip about 3.6 miles and it only fell off once and had a couple of pieces that weren't completely melted when I got back" and "what's the loudest glass packs I can get, but don't forget I'm on a budget" types), will show how intelligent you are.Best way to get a posi and a good gear in your car is to lay low and wait; watch your local buzzard; and when some stroke with a 2002 SS or WS6 wraps his pride & joy around a fire plug, snarf the rear end QUICK. Don't even BOTHER trying to "dicker" or "negotiate" with the buzzard, just PAY HIM. NOW. INSTANTLY. Don't even let him draw the next breath. Whatever he asks, it's cheeeeeep. Done. Don't screw around with a bunch of carriers and gears and all that, too much like work and costs more besides. Cheeeeeepest you can possibly get off. Expect it'll cost you maybe $350 - 400, less than the cost of a carrier ALONE, let alone a carrier, gears, axle set, install kit, and labor, PLUS you get the late-model brakes, FOR FREE. Then, all you need (as detailed above about "poseur") is some 4th gen or C5 or C6 wheels.
Last edited by sofakingdom; 09-21-2010 at 08:37 PM.
10-06-2010, 11:52 AM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
You don't want an Auburn.
It's DEFINITELY not worth $400. I might accept one, if somebody gave me $100 along with it; no way would I pay even one cent for it. $100 might be enough to compensate me for my trouble storing it and then disposing of it, since I'd have to go out of my way to do that, my local sanitation engineering service won't haul off car parts that are that dense.
"Posi" is GM's old trade name, from the 60s, for "limited slip". They are one and the same, like "Charmin" is just a trade name for "facial quality tissue".
The Auburn technically is, or more likely was at one time in its very early history, a "posi". But it's complete and total utter garbage now: just call Auburn Gear (get the phone # here http://www.auburngear.com/ ) and try to order parts for it, ANY parts. I'd suggest trying to get the things that are the basic wear element, namely the clutch frictions. You'll find out REAL QUICK what the problem is. RUN AWAY from that deal; don't walk, RUN. I screwed up and bought one of those one time about 15 years ago, for AHELLUVALOT less money than that though, so I learned my lesson the hard way. You get to learn it the easy way if you listen though.
Sounds like your friend is one of those that nobody needs one like that, that's what you keep enemies around for.
Your 89 most likely has, or at least came with, 26-spline axles. 90-up carriers have 28-spline side gears. So if you upgrade to any later carrier, you'll probably need axles as well. I'd recommend these if you get to that point. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
It's DEFINITELY not worth $400. I might accept one, if somebody gave me $100 along with it; no way would I pay even one cent for it. $100 might be enough to compensate me for my trouble storing it and then disposing of it, since I'd have to go out of my way to do that, my local sanitation engineering service won't haul off car parts that are that dense.
"Posi" is GM's old trade name, from the 60s, for "limited slip". They are one and the same, like "Charmin" is just a trade name for "facial quality tissue".
The Auburn technically is, or more likely was at one time in its very early history, a "posi". But it's complete and total utter garbage now: just call Auburn Gear (get the phone # here http://www.auburngear.com/ ) and try to order parts for it, ANY parts. I'd suggest trying to get the things that are the basic wear element, namely the clutch frictions. You'll find out REAL QUICK what the problem is. RUN AWAY from that deal; don't walk, RUN. I screwed up and bought one of those one time about 15 years ago, for AHELLUVALOT less money than that though, so I learned my lesson the hard way. You get to learn it the easy way if you listen though.
Sounds like your friend is one of those that nobody needs one like that, that's what you keep enemies around for.
Your 89 most likely has, or at least came with, 26-spline axles. 90-up carriers have 28-spline side gears. So if you upgrade to any later carrier, you'll probably need axles as well. I'd recommend these if you get to that point. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAG-EV10-4/
Ok, I've read that on different threads that Auburn isn't good and that the Gov. Loc is junk so what does that leave me with if I wanted a used 3rd gen 28 spline carrier?
10-06-2010, 03:45 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
Bear with me on this. Something like this unit is something a should avoid?http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...=STRK:MEWAX:IT
Last edited by Rich2279; 10-06-2010 at 06:45 PM.
10-06-2010, 03:50 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
if you were in my area, my local auto yard has a nice ls1 camaro sitting there and rear ends with disk brakes are $111.09
10-06-2010, 06:53 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
my auto yard is sooo stupid, they sell based on the type of part, not what kind. all v8's are 218. dont matter if its a old 350, new 350, lt1,lt4, ls1 it doesnt matter. they just see a v8. plus if you buy something, you have 30 days to return it sooo i just bring in my old one. i got a t56 trans for $88 and brought my old t5 in and got my money back lol
10-06-2010, 09:08 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
that makes me sick!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
10-06-2010, 11:51 PM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
i kno! i love it. i just started going there and now that i kno this, my car isnt gonna take long to finish! im about to start a thread on it
10-07-2010, 10:57 AM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
my auto yard is sooo stupid, they sell based on the type of part, not what kind. all v8's are 218. dont matter if its a old 350, new 350, lt1,lt4, ls1 it doesnt matter. they just see a v8. plus if you buy something, you have 30 days to return it sooo i just bring in my old one. i got a t56 trans for $88 and brought my old t5 in and got my money back lol
10-07-2010, 11:04 AM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
If I could go back in time and do it again. I wouldn't put a dime into my 10 bolt, unless it was a junkyard part just to get it back on the road.
With that said, I got my 7.5 eaton 3 series, 28 spline, new off of ebay from some wholesaler for 380. the same exact one summit sells for 550ish.
I also recommend the Superior axles, if you feel so inclined to drop more cash. Do not buy moser axles.
Remember the 4th gen LS1s that came with the T56 received the 3.42 gears. Being that it did have said T56 most people drove the **** out of them, then put them away wet. With this said I'd still recommend getting a whole 4th gen rear instead of trying to build your own. Like 'king said you're getting the brakes for basically free, and with the 4th gen offset you can run some 11 inch wide wheels and 315s.
With that said, I got my 7.5 eaton 3 series, 28 spline, new off of ebay from some wholesaler for 380. the same exact one summit sells for 550ish.
I also recommend the Superior axles, if you feel so inclined to drop more cash. Do not buy moser axles.
Remember the 4th gen LS1s that came with the T56 received the 3.42 gears. Being that it did have said T56 most people drove the **** out of them, then put them away wet. With this said I'd still recommend getting a whole 4th gen rear instead of trying to build your own. Like 'king said you're getting the brakes for basically free, and with the 4th gen offset you can run some 11 inch wide wheels and 315s.
10-07-2010, 11:41 AM
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Re: 4th gen rear end questions
hopefully it only applies to recent products, but I was about to buy some axles myself...
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-...ser-stuff.html
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/gears-...ser-stuff.html
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