Has anyone tried this combo?

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/QTI-RM-6064/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FMS-M-7003-Z/

 

Why?

If you run a T-5, the bolt pattern on the front doesn't matter; it's still just a T-5. Nothing about a Frod one is any different from a GM one, on the inside, except it has crappy gear ratios.

Seems like AHELLUVALOT of maze (and money) to deal with, but ABSOLUTELY ZERO cheeeeeeeeze at the end. Unless of course you're the one making the parts. Just a way for those with low ethical standards to empty the pockets of the gullible.

 

$1600 for a new stronger t5 was appealing.

 

Really???

When you can get a T-56 for around $1000? What's so appealing about a T-5? (I'm guessing you haven't tore up enough of em yet?)

 

From April 2004 issue of car craft:

T5 WC late 300 lb-ft ('90-'93 mustang)

3.35 1.93 1.29 1.00 .68

T5 Cobra Z-spec 330 lb-ft ('93 cobra)

2.95 1.94 1.34 1.00 .63


Page 58:
"For the '90 model year, Ford worked with Borg-Warner to further upgrade the T5, resulting in new Second and Third gearsets using course-pitch gear teeth and higher nickel-content steel. These changes raised the torque rating to 300 lb-ft in Mustangs. Later, the T5 was further upgraded to harness the power of the '93 Mustang Cobra. This version, dubbed the T5 'Z' because of its Ford part number designation, has tapered output bearings and a steel front-bearing retainer (versus aluminum) among other things, pushing its torque rating to 330 lb-ft."

The aftermarket Tremec 3550 is just marginally stronger at 350 lb-ft.

 

If I already had the T5, I'd maybe kinda sorta consider it.

What I don't like about it is:

• custom pilot bearing (I like to be able to buy "such and such part for 1990 V8 5 spd Camaro" instead)
• custom coarse 10 spline clutch (see above, plus it's a weaker input shaft spline than the 26 spline GM V8 T5)
• custom driveshaft work needed (just to get a 28 spline yoke plus correct the lenght) rather than "most any 83-2002 F-body shaft will work")
• No option to run third gen hydraulics.
• Fork angle is straight-out ('77-down A-body, '81-down F-body etc.) so it's not correctly (read: not bashing your floor with a hammer) fitting a third-gen (or my cars for that matter) - it won't even work in an 82-83 w/ mechanical linkage.
• It's still a T5 with no inherent strength increase compared to a V8 third gen T5. I mean, it has the 2.95 first which means the headset gears are a stronger set than any other T5 but that doesn't fix the 10 spline input.

I could go on but you get the point. Buying the wrong parts and making them work is kind of like investing in cars. You better be good at it or you'll just lose money and have nothing to show for it.

Plus for the money you're looking at, I did a custom mechanical linkage T56 minus the speedometer work and the T56 is a LOT stronger than that T5.

 

10-spline input is not a concern at just 330 ft-lbs. Too much hassle for no reward.

 

Since T-5s usually don't break because of an engine's steady-state torque output, I fail to see where some "rating" matters.

You can scatter a T-5 with a 6-cyl if you put sticky tires on the car, rev it up, and dump the clutch. Some kind of torque "rating" isn't going to keep it from grenading.

Then of course there's the question of what that "rating" means, and to whom... does it mean that the transmission is permanently perfect for a million miles at 329.97 ft-lbs, but will grenade instantly at 330.01 ft-lbs? Does it mean that Tremec won't sell it to an OEM if the motor the OEM proposes to put it behind is "rated" at less than that? Or what?

So this thing is "rated" for 10% more torque than the others.... is that REALLY worth however much it costs? Compare that cost to getting a T-56 out of a wrecked Z28 or TransAm; is it REALLY a better deal than that somehow?

You can quote as many magazine articles as you want. Maybe in Magazine World, it's A Good Idea; but personally, out here in The Real World, it looks like a giant waste of money to me. But if that's what you want to do, hey, it's your money. Seems like it would be less work to just light a pile of $100s on fire and walk away, and not use the car as a weapon to burn the money instead.

 

Sofakingdom, sounds like you just need to learn how to drive a 5 speed. Also, I was just quoting specs of the transmission so he could compare it to a stock third gen T5. Maybe in your world, its a good idea to **** on everyone else's idea, but if everyone thought like you we wouldn't have LS1 and Corvette brake upgrades and all the other nice swap threads. All you ever seem to do here is provide your opinion, I hardly ever see you put facts down.

JMD, thanks for the info, I have been wondering about a Ford T5 swap for awhile, since they seem to be plentiful and slightly beefier.

 

No, no more 5-speeds for me. I "learned to drive a 5-speed" actually long before there was such a thing. My first stick trans was a Chevrolet 3-speed. I used to do a fairly lively business rebuilding Muncies and T-10s back in the late 70s and early 80s. I tore up WAY too many T-5s in my 83 thinking I could drive it like a hot-rod 4-speed; finally gave up and realized I had to treat em like a Saginaw 4-speed, which was unacceptable to me. Finally got sick of that and did basically THE SAME THING as the "LS1 brake upgrade" kind of thing you're talking about, namely, got a T-56 out of a 4th gen.

Sounds to me like you need to read less magazines and get some more Real World experience; and in the meantime, listen more to people who ALREADY HAVE IT instead of getting all self-righteous about your magazines.

Meanwhile, got any REAL answers to the questions I asked about those "ratings"? I'd like to hear your opinion on how significant that 10% increase in the torque "rating" is, and how much longer that's going to make one of those weenie little things last behind a mtor with some power in a car with some traction. Which is why they last longer in Mustangs; they're lighter and get less traction. It's NOT because they're any better, since the trans itself is absolutely identical in every way in properties THAT MATTER to durability (case thickness, shaft diameter, distance between shafts and therefore size of the gears, and so forth).

And yes, I supply my opinion; but with FACTS and EXPERIENCE to back it up. If I'm not mistaken, that's usually considered a good thing on message boards, by most people.

 

Sofa, you are always a breath of fresh air. Seriously, I'd buy you an adult beverage if I could.

 

Actually, the original poster asked if anyone has tried the combo, which means if anyone has attempted the swap. This wasn't an invitation for you to get on your soap box and let everyone know how much of a sour troll you are.

As for the magazine article I quoted, again, all I was quote spec data from the magazine so I really don't know what your beef is with reading. It wasn't even a reply to your comment anyway, you just have to give your opinion, as unwarranted as it may be. Just because you write some words in capital, it doesn't give your ideas any more weight or turn your opinion into facts. You have posted 0 facts in this thread and this is a tech board. Well, you did post that you "...tore up WAY too many T-5s in my 83 thinking I could drive it like a hot-rod 4-speed..." Sounds like operator error based on your "Numquam ponenda est pluralitas sine necessitate" quote.

Still interested in hearing from those that have actually swapped a ford T5 into a third gen. I know I saw a post awhile back from one of the moderators that have done it by using a conversion u-joint and ford yoke and driveshaft.

 

 

Exactly...

It's all about cost vs benefit, leaving the magazine articles aside. EVEN IF THEY'RE 100% TRUE, it's still VERY little benefit in exchange for ALOT of cost, especially compared to the upgrade via a swap from a later model car (in the same manner as LS1 brake upgrades compared to spending giga$$$$$ on some pie-in-the-sky 10.5" rotor system, for example).

What's all this about "soap box"? Pot, meet kettle. Glad this other guy here has so much constructive to add to his magazine articles; and is doing such a great job at talking about what a great idea the OP had, like he seems to think should be done, rather than attacking people who use LOGIC and REASON instead of fantasy. I'm sure he's ready to spend HIS OWN money doing JUST EXACTLY THAT because it's such a terrific plan. In which case, I'd encourage him to do just that, and come back and tell us all how it worked out for him. But UNLIKE HIM, I've already done what I advise; I know the results; I have the experience. Too bad he doesn't have the equivalent to back up his point of view. But that's OK, his vitriol doesn't offend me, it only makes me pity him; it's not hard to tell who is giving out the more sound advice.

Motorq, thanks!

I appreciate that; but, just buy yourself the one of your choice, and enjoy it in my honor.

 

Next time, just quote his entire post and just bold / underline / italicize the words that spell out "I was a chevrolet weenie."

He might laugh. I would. And the effect of your post would be more soothing.

On that note, I wish I could get parts at night so I could get stuff done.

 

Thanks jmd and lucid. That was exactly the info that I needed.