I have read the sticky's and even the how to in the FAQ section about a T56 install. I am still confused on all parts needed. One place says all gen 4 parts with a custom crossmember. and another says about cavalier parts. I don't want to buy the wrong parts and also this is going to become a daily driver soon, so I want to have everything before I start. I have the T56, shifter, bellhousing, flywheel, and fork. What clutch would I need for a 96 t56 into a 1985 tpi5.0? And do I need a crossmember and torque arm relocation, or just a crossmember. Thanks a lot in advance.

 

The hydraulics dont match up. You need an adjustable master cylinder or a cavalier slave to compensate. The former method is probably better, but the latter method is easier if it's already in the car.

You will need a conversion flywheel that is probably more expensive than a pullout L98.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ctf-700170

If you get an L98 or any other 87+ engine you can use the factory style LT1 flywheel.

You will also need to figure out the speedo, no real easy or cheap solution for that in a car with an analog speedo. Someone here can machineout the tailshaft for you to put regular speedo gears into, but I dont know who.

Lastly you will need an 85-97 F-body manual transmission torque arm mount. Maybe 84's have the same one, Im not super clear on what years... probably all the T5 years but Im not sure. But basically from 85 to 97 I know all the torque arm mounts are the same, but they are different from manual to auto cars, so you will need to source that. That was one of the things I got stuck on doing my swap. Had to sit around and wait a week for one to show up. You will need a new crossmember. i would avoid the monstrosity that Spohn sells. get something that doesnt hang 3 feet below the car. Torque arm and driveshaft can be reused.

Any factory LT1 clutch will work.

 

So I cant use the pullout L98 flywheel? I hope so $500 bucks is a lot more than I had figured on. But all the same thanks a lot for the info. As for the speedo I am considering just going with a gps unit.

 

Several problems and answers:
4th gen pedals + 96 hydraulics, clutch and transmission = proper clutch release. Using 3rd gen pedals (with more throw at the attachment point on the clutch pedal) brings problems with over-travel of the fork.

Your powertrain is not well matched to the 96 T56 ratios. Your car with an auto came with, at absolute best, 3.45 gears. Probably 3.23. Maybe 2.73. Doesn't matter. every single one of them in addition to the 305 LB9 makes for a gross mis-match with the 96 T56. Even with going to gears like 4.10 in the rear diff, the ratio spread (closer 1-4, wider 4-6) are a poor match for your engine. Don't make your car slower, less fun to drive, and less tractable than it can be.

VSS has function in the ECM. If you think "I'll just use a GPS and let my car run curiously different, stall at times, get worse mileage and basically half-*** the job" is a smart way to go, well it's not. You can mask the check engine light from coming on (Im not telling you how) but it doesn't change the other drivability issues that arise.

You're not ready to spend the flywheel money or speedometer functionality money. No problem. Just don't do the swap right now. Wait, figure out what you really want (a well-matched drivetrain combination that drives like a new car when you need it to and rocks and rolls when you need it to) and carefully put that together, instead of deciding to do the mod of the day that sounds cool.

Been there, done that, over 10 years ago and have the t-shirt. And there are posts on here to prove it. Take my word for it, a 3.42 (or higher) geared L98 third gen is the minimum starting point for a good running 94-97 T56 swap.

 

Thanks a lot. I think you r right. I was going to rush in because I wanted the T56, without really thinking further. I never thought about the gears or even the engine. I think I will wait until I have a lt1 and better rear to start this. My main goal is to have a 30 year old 3rd gen that can keep up with newer vehicles. Driveability is very important. Thanks for slowing me down. I appreciate it. I think I will just continue enjoying the car as is as long as I can, and continue to amass parts to get to my goal.

 

When you get ready to do your T56 swap let me know. I'm the one that mods the trans for a cable speedometer drive.

 

I prefer third gen pedals because they have the extra bracing to the firewall. My firewall flexes a lot even with these braces, so I cant imagine how bad it would be without them. An adjustable master cylinder is a lot better than anything stock on either car, but making a factory one adjustable isnt very difficult either. But the point is there are multiple ways to solve that problem, ranging from $20 to $200.

Do analog speedo cars have a vss? Is it something the SGI-5 box can compensate for? Just makes me glad I have a 92 instead of an earlier one...

I ran with a T56 and 3.27s for a while... it wasnt fun. As soon as it was rolling it was a blast but the car became 10x more fun when I got my 3.70s, and even now I'd prefer some 4.10s or 4.56's.

To the OP... just throwing it out there... an LT1 swap is pretty easy. They cost less than the T56... and they have all the perks of a modern roller cam 350. It will save you the hassle of modding the tailshaft or a GPS speedo AND the cost of the conversion flywheel... You're spending very little on an LT1 when you account for that.

 

Third picture down shows the VSS optical sensor bolted to the back of the speedo: https://www.thirdgen.org/leddash

It's a different type of signal and while I think the SGI-5 might be capable of converting signal type and doubling it, there's no thirdgen in need of that combination of parts.

 

I ultimately want to do the LT1 swap. Just really want to make sure I am all ready to go before I would half *** anything. I love my car and want to make it the best I can. I am just unsure about the wiring swap more than anything else with this swap. I have read a lot on this swap and still am unsure about sending the harness out or buying a painless model or what to do. Once I am certain I have all my ducks in a row I really want to start this swap and finally have my T56 behind a great engine.

 

Get the 1985 factory wiring diagrams.
Get the 1995 (or what year you swap) wiring diagrams.

Educate yourself on what's the same, what's different, and adapt.
If you make your car's powertrain entirely serviceable as a 1995 (no one who has to fix it later has to wonder "where the hell does this go?",) there's no reason for it to be any less reliable, any less serviceable, or any less a car than a stone reliable 195 T/A.

 

Thanks again for the input. When I can get the LT1 (hopefully late spring) Do I still need to have the tailshaft modified, or is there a solution with using the LT1 harness? This speedometer thing seems to be the only tricky part so far that is going to hold me back. or at least slow me down.

 

Yes. No. Read the T56 swap sticky again and again.

 

Removing the T56 tail housing is easy, and so is installing it after I mod the housing. So don't let this scare you from going forward with your swap.

I will be there with any help you need installing the tail housing. I also did the T56 swap on my 87 so I've been there and done it.
That's how I started to mod housings, I needed a speedometer drive and being a machinist I figured out how to do it. That was in 2008. I've done over 200 housings since then, many of them for members of TGO.

JMD is right, read and reread the swap thread. Yes it's long, but 99% of your questions will be answered there.

 

Will try and memorize it. Thanks guys. I will contact Alloy as soon as I a ready.