vote here
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=324454



i just figured their are two groups on here v8 guys and everybody else.

would you guys be against adding four bangers to this forum?

 

I don't think it should be renamed (there are only two 4cyl guys on here that I know of), but don't mind if 4cyl questions are posted. BTW you can get lots of Duke (and other 4cyl) info at http://www.fieroforum.com

 

i have a v6 and don't care

 

I object.

 

fiero forum doesnt haver fbody specific info on the duke.

hell, no one can tell me how to change the cap and rotor anywhere on the internet.and the only people that have done it in an fbody didnt have ac or cruise control,which is the problem.




i just figured that since it is such a rare car,and info is very scarce,it would be helpful to have a place to put iron duke specific information.

 

Its not that much different...Redraif has an 84 Fiero with a 2.5, and I've become pretty familiar with it.
Having trouble changing the cap and rotor? Its not exactly easy to do on a Fiero (less than half the engine compartment room, and the rear firewall in the way), but its just two screws like any Delco distributor, and the rotor just pulls off like a V6 IIRC. If its inaccesible to you, try a different tool, or take off whatever is in the way...just like any other car. Or check the factory service manual; it usually has tips for stuff like that, if its at all difficult.

 

right now i think i need to remove the entire intake to get to it without ruining the ac.


i know HOW to take it off,its the fact that there is not enough room to actualy take it off and get it out.it took me over an hour to replace a bad plug wire.

i have tried to post pics of it,but this site has image file size requirments and my comp refuses to resize the pics.its new so it doesnt have all its sofware yet.

 

Its tight, but not as tight as a Fiero... have you tried it from underneath?

 

yeah, i had it up on the ramps and tried to get to it.
no luck.

i guess ill just pull off the intake,it probably needs to be cleaned anyway.


it sucks that it isnt in front or higher on top of the motor.

 

that motor just looks so small and puny sitting in there in that huge engine bay.

just imagine something like a late 60's early 70's fullsized truck with an iron duke in there.

geez on my freidns truck we already just sit on the fenders to work on it with a duke I could prolly sleep in the engine bay to take a break from working on the truck

 

can you pose a picture of the distributor on your car?

 

was the iron duke ever offered in a firebird? when did the iron dukes reign end? only reson i ask is because my factory service manual for 86f-bird has a 2.5L section.
(and it does not tell you how to change the distrubuter.)

 

82-86 was the only years the fbodies came with a four banger.


and there isnt as much room as you would think,the duke is just as long as a v8 its just not as wide.

there is plenty of room on the driver side,but the passenger side has the intake,cruise and ac stuff.

look at the pic a few post up,the distributer is under the intake
right by the firewall.


if i didnt have ac or cruise it would be easy.

 

I had an Astro that had the 2.5 as well as a S10 with one.

 

Neighbor had an S10 with the Duke in it, as well - found it funny, my block undressed (with heads/intake tho) was SMALLER than the 2.5L... at least, it looked it!!

 

(cheap plug) look how much more room I had w/the 3800 in there:



bigger engine, & more engine bay room. Go figure

 

thats because the 3800 is shorter.that motor also didnt have ac or cruise.

the duke is a huge motor for a four cylinder,and with the cross flow heads it uses both sides of the engine bay .

if i scraped the ac along with the cruise ,and power steering i would have alot more room under the hood.


by the way that 3800 looked real nice,why doesnt it have a supercharger?their cheap for those.

what kind of hp does your get?

 

Ididn't bother keeping the compressor on for the non-used a/c, and didn't have any provisions for cruise w/the 2.8 or any other motor that's been/going in.

The 3800 Series II is rated 200 hp & 225 tq. The s/c kits available are the powerdyne kit & the rk sport kits. THey're about 3.5k, although you could try to modify the firewall & hvac ducting to put in an L67. The Aussie rwd L67's have the side inlet tb's, but are rarer than an honest politician to locate.

 

they have super chargers on ebay for $200 rebuilt.they are for the 3800 in the bonneville or something.

all you would need is the wiring harness and the injectors and stuff off the bonneville and put them all on.

im not sure of the hp out put but it should be decent,like 275-300hp .

 

i know this is a little off topic, but are there any tech articles on TGO or something linked for removing a/c, cruise, other unnecessary components?

from wut i understand removing the a/c will be hard due to depressurizing and disposing of fluids

 

mine has been converted to r134,so i thunk its ok to just open and bleed off.


im definityl getting an electric water pump and amanual steering,that should be 15 -20hp right there.

maybe ill scrap everything but go,after all,i only have four cylinders to work with.

 

\

what the heck is a crossflow head?

 

the orginal dukes had the intake and exsaust on the same side,after a few years the crossflow heads were used,they were more effecient.

 

there is no clearance in the engine bay for the s/c tb unless you modify the firewall as I've stated. Plus, you'll be putting all that boost i a 9.5:1 engien not designed for that much boost.

Best thing to do is to get a series III engine from the 2004+ cars. They run 260hp & 280 tq on 87 oct

also run a 5/6 speed behind one for that bada$$

 

Your barking up the wrong tree. They really don’t care. I was on a campaign of my own for a long time trying to get a decent mod that cares. Was trying to get TomP a mod but we ended up with buthead. Who likes to follow me around the forum contradicting everything I say in a rude manor so I will call him a buthead [ A buthead is different from a butthead] so he can put me on probation. Then days or weeks later he will post a message agreeing with what I had said, which totally contradicts what he said earlier. But long as it took the opposite position to me, it was the right answer then.

Maybe one day we will get a decent V6 and under section with proper control.
But until then those poor poor 4-cylinder guy don’t even bother. [ There is no reason a 3rd gen owner should need to ask help from a fiero board.] Many V6ers don’t either.
As its totally worthless to ask a question about anything in any other section of this forum if you let them know you have a V6. You will get 90 messages telling you how your better off buying a V8 then changing a flat tire on a V6.

Only reason I still visit, as I don’t want to see people twist in the wind as they try to fix what they got.

 

see,thats how i feel, to many people despise anything less then a 350.

all the harrassment over not owning a v8 gets real old.
i only bought my car because it had a four cylinder.

and when i get the 3.0 in it i bet more then one v8 will see taillights.
at least a few hondas will definitly get beat.

200hp and 2250tq out of a four is is pretty good, almost no other four will do that without boost.

 

no kidding that is MIGHTY impressive to get out of a 4 wanger.
what does it take to get that much?

 

well first you start with a marine 3.0 181 gm motor,then have the crank machined to fit a light weight car flywheel.

get a complete performance cam and gear set and a vin ''R''head,have it ported along with the intake and a bigger exsauhst manifold.

silvolite flat top pistons,with the stock connecting rods,they are plenty strong.

have the entire thing cryo tempered for $400.

you could either go with the stock tbi or a carb,which ever you prefer.

upgrade the ignition system for more spark.

switch to an electric water pump,manual steering and an electric rad fan.

and you should have 200hp ,maybe more . and add a super charger and you should have 300hp easy.

and it should be less then $2500 for everything but the super charger.

 

I agree it would be nice if there as 4cyl info available here, but the numbers don't really support a whole forum dedicated to it...there aren't enough of them on this board, or anywhere for that matter (I've only seen 2 or 3 of them ever).
I wouldn't discount information just because it isn't on a thirdgen site, though; the Fiero guys have done a lot more with the Dukes because there were tens of thousands of them built, they're very common. They also tend to have a little more cash to spend than the average thirdgen owner, so there are more people who have gone further with them. There are turboed 2.5s, Super Duty buildups...you name it. Same goes for V6 stuff...you'll see 3.1 and 3.4 swaps, DOHC swaps, and all sorts of stuff you will rarely see here, not to mention Shortstar and Northstar swaps, 3800SC swaps (common as dirt now), and of course SBC swaps of all types. S10 sites can be good info sources also, and there are probably 4cyl specific sites just as there are a couple for GM V6s. Use the info that is already out there. Heck, my favorite site for GM turbo stuff is turbomustangs.com!

 

I have no problem with 4cyl guys coming on here asking questions, at all.

Personally, I already see this forum as the 'anything other than V8' forum.

 

yeah me too, err, wait.....

 

well the moderaters spend more time arguing instead of trying to help people,it really is annoying.

the way i see it,if your not here to help,you shouldnt be a moderater.

it pisses me off because all they would have to do is add the words''iron duke'to the v6 forum so four banger guys know where to go. it should read ''v6-l4 engine forum'' or something.

no body gets hurt and everybodys happy,but then they cant be control freaks if a four cylinder got any recognition.

i moderate several ironduke specific forums on yahoo groups and im never a dick just because i dont like someones motor choice,when it comes to moderating,i dont let my opinions
rule,i lets the forums rules guide me.even thou i dont like v8s i would never tell someone to get a duke or get out,thats just stupid.

but there is fbody specific info that cant be found on fiero or s10 sites, trust me i have looked at every website about the duke on the internet.

heres a cool fact,the duke was only availbe as an engine option for the years knightrider was on the air.

 

parts list for the 153 and the 181 3.0 l4.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1976-...RANKSHAFT_W0Q\
QcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ26455QQitemZ4566035755QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V#ebayphotoh\
osting

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/4-Zol...-Oversize_W0Q\
QcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33623QQitemZ8004783679QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1987-...t-Motor-Engin\
e_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ50442QQitemZ4580087817QQrdZ1

http://www.basicpower.com/engines/b181.htm

http://www.greenbaypartsworld.com/g153am.htm

http://www.compcams.com/catalog/046_047.html

http://www.flatlanderracing.com/comp-sbc153.html

http://www.amotion.com/amcams.html#19411

http://www.boatingbuddy.com/sierra-m.../page_474.html

http://www.rpmrons.com/MarineKits.html

 

thats because while that show was on everybody wanted KITT, so they would run to there local GM dealer and ask how much the cheapest black firebird was. enter THE DUKE from stage left

all fooling aside i think that if the forum subtitle read
"Discussion and questions about the often overlooked base V6's, 4cyl Iron Duke and the rare Turbo V6"


NO IT IS NOT!!!! r134A is still a freon based chemical.
you should be able to remove the system without breaking the seal, i think there is a tech article on it. EDIT: i just looked and could find no tech article, i must have read a thread on it.

 

well i guess i wont mess with it then. ill have to have it drained somewhere.

 

so moderaters,could we add ''iron duke'' to the v6 board title?

 

Does the duke have a v8 tranny, cuz the marine 3.0 uses a v8 bellhousing.

(I've had a lot of boats)


-- Joe

 

yeah i think it does, but the starter is on the driver side,and the sb v8 starter is on the passenger side.

it should be pretty cool when im done.

i just removed and sealed all the rust on the body today.
its slow going but hopefully ill be done this time next year.

i want to get an old 3.0 block and start tearing it down.

 

i want to get a 3.8 block and start tearing it down

 

the 3.0 can produce as much power as the stock 3800.

but my van has the 3800 and its unstopable,240,000 miles with a rebiuld at 100,000 and it still runs like new.