DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I went from my 94 camaro with a 3.4L to my new 86 2.8L and have noticed a huge difference. I expected some but just wanted to see if this seemed normal to everyone else.
For an example when I am going 50mph, and say I'm merging or passing someone. I can floor the gas petal and it probably takes me around 10 seconds to get up to 55mph, unless I'm going down a large hill. If I'm going up hardly any hill at all I can have it floored and lose speed.
I think a big difference was my 94 would shift down and almost red line to get up to the speed I wanted. This one won't shift down at all. Does this sound normal? Thanks!

58mark

iTrader: (3)

well, i have a 5 speed v6 so I can't testify on your experience, but yes, the v6 is slow. Not enough torque to break the tires free under normal circumstances, and pretty weak acceleration on the highway.
I'm lucky I don't care about speed, or I would be pretty frustrated with my car.

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

Stock, these engines have NOTHING above say 2700rpm. They were built and geared to have good low end, and really they do for how small they are.
You would benifit alot by opening up the exhaust and intake, I've done that somewhat and it does make a big difference in the higher rpm's.

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

there is 30 HP difference between the 2.8 and the 3.4 engines, and 20 ft-lbs of TQ.

It sounds like your 2.8 needs a tuneup and a TV cable adjustment.. also check the vacuum line to the trans and make sure it's in good shape.



They are slow.. but not that bad..

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Well where I live now out in the country power is not a major issue. But there is a possibility that we could be moving to the Dallas-fort worth area that has crazy freeways and traffic and some power to be able to merge in and out of traffic is a concern.
The car has been tuned up, I haven't checked vacuum lines yet. The trans seems to be in good shape and I changed the fluid last fall. The engine only has about 8000 miles on it because the previous owner had a create engine put in after the original engine was run without oil. But then it sat for about 8 years in his drive way and was hardly run.
The main difference from this and the 94 was the it doesn't shift down when I floor it. Is that normal? It just stays in overdrive and very very slowly accelerates. Low end power is good though.
Maybe a high flow exhaust would help?... Nitrous
Anything else that might help?

58mark

iTrader: (3)

eh, i live in dallas, drive on the highways every day... a normal 2.8 is fine for that. if yours cant get up to speed by the end of a on ramp, then something may be worng after all

DeathStarr89

iTrader: (1)

Adjust the TV cable. it should down shift when you put it to the floor.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Going down hill it does alright I guess but if I need to accelerate to get into a hole in traffic on flat ground or heaven forbid up a hill it doesn't have a chance. And if I’m going up a steep hill I loose a lot a speed and feel like a tractor holding up traffic. I have tried shifting down but that doesn’t even help much.
I checked a site about the TV cables and it sounds like it is working ok. It shifts at all the correct speeds. Could it be a throttle cable issue or something? Maybe I'm just not getting wide open throttle.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I didn't see that on the site, but I'll look into it more. Thanks!

92camarorv6

58mark you buting the 2.8s down why i have a 3.4 with bult tranny 700r4 and from a standing strat i can smoke the tire off and about lose it

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

maybe he should get a 3.1?, kidding, im not sure the 3.1 is much faster than the 2.8

58mark

iTrader: (3)

was there a question in there?

Project 3.4 Camaro

The 2.8 puts out 135 hp and 160 tq, the 3.4 puts out 160 and, I don't recall how much tq, but probably something like 175-185, the 3.4 can't breathe for crap at higher rpm though, it has the same heads and cam as the 2.8, and the most god awful intake manifold ever forced upon a car from what I've heard. Idk how thorough your tuneup was but the following would help if not already done: spark plugs/wires, aftermarket CAI only if you don't have a tpi dual snorkel, if you do, gut the airboxes or go a step further with ram air, replace air filter/s with K&Ns as well. Fuel filter, and oil change are important as well, you should also check your timing, and check if you have a vacuum leak, run seafoam through the car. I really don't see a properly running car losing speed going up a hill...especially considering my buick century can gain speed going up one...last but not least, headers, exhaust, and cam never hurt-which could also be another issue, timing chain maybe, lack of compression due to a bad HG could also be a potential culprit.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I wish I had another 2.8 to drive and compare, but my 3.4 could probably run circles around my 2.8 right now. Lets see I changed oil with Mobil 1, fuel filter, spark plugs/wires, I did seafoam and other injector cleaners. I had the voltage to the injectors checked. The shop said the timing was dead on. I wouldn't think the HG would be bad since the engine only has 8000 on it, but maybe I should get the compression checked just for the heck of it. I have looked at the vacuum hoses before and the all look good, I can try to check them again. What are the CAI and tpi duel snorkel? I was debating if it would be worth it to buy K&N but after researching it I didn't really think it would do much for my power problem.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Oh, I think I know what you mean now. Yes it has the duel snorkel with the two air filters. I haven't done a box gut mod. Is there a thread to that. Anyone have a link for it?

RSFreak

I have a '89 2.8L with a T5. I used to have a '94 3.4L with a T5 and to be honest I think they were about equal in acceleration (and seriously lacking in power). My Buddy's '98 with a 3.8L and T5 was a different story! That thing was quick for a V6!

Project 3.4 Camaro

Don't need a link for it, its pretty easy to do, just take the airbox out, remove the splash guards and cut the bottom piece off of each box, such that it makes the air filters open element ones. And I bought an '85 with 116k on the clock and bad head gaskets, so its not as unlikely as you might think, if these engines have a weak spot its the crap gaskets in them.

firebird904

My 2.8 camaro does pretty good in getting up to speed I did a full tune up being its been sitting for about 10 years now it starts as soon as you turn the key but it does sputter when you get on the throttle when its not up to operating temperature but after that it runs like new car i had a 305 firebird and the only difference i noticed between the two cars was the torque they both got up to speed about the same.

ymenic

iTrader: (1)

Have you check the timing in the car? My timing in my 2.8 was off by 20 degrees and it did the same thing. You unplug this tan wire with a black strip, then turn on your car. If you got a timing gun set it to 10 degrees. If you don't have a timing gun use a vacuum gauge. Is it hard for your car to turn on or does you car overheat? Also you have any engine lights on?

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I took it in and the shop said the timing was dead on. There are no check engine lights on and it was running way under temp for a long time till I changed the thermostat.

It might just be the shifting problem. If any of you guys are out with your V6, get up above 50mph and make sure it is in overdrive, then floor it, does it shift down when you floor it? Because mine doesn't. I don't know if its not shifting down because there is not enough power there or of my TV cable is out of adjustment. I really don't know to much about automatic trans shifting.

I may go get a second opinion at another shop. The shop I have been taking it to has given me some problems. Like when I told them that they needed to change the thermostat because I had no heat and it wasn't shifting into over drive. They looked at it and told me that I didn't know what I was talking about. And they said that the thermostat was fine and it was too hard to get to and I would have to schedule another day. So I got charged $45.00 with nothing fixed. So I changed it myself in about 30mins and it fixed all the problems I was having. When I asked them about the low power they told me all 2.8’s are just slow and there was nothing wrong with it. Hmm..

Project 3.4 Camaro

They're definitely not fast stock, but losing speed up a hill with pedal to the floor is pretty extreme, and have you tried putting it in drive instead of overdrive? I'm not 100% sure, but USUALLY, as in both the GM cars I've owned you could put them in drive at any speed, and I pretty much had to with both when going up hills, just because of the gear ratio difference between drive and overdrive, otherwise I had to step on it to maintain speed. I haven't driven my TG yet since it doesn't run, but it's probably the same way.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Thats the thing, I'm pretty sure I have tried that before and it didn't help much at all. I'll try it again on the way home from work today. There is a specific hill near my house that I climb. My 3.4 could pick up speed going up it if I shifted to drive without it even being floored. My 2.8 seems to pretty rapidly lose speed going up it even when I have it floored in drive. Seems like it might be and engine power issue.

ymenic

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, when I'm in overdrive and I give it about 3/4 the way down it will drop into I think 3rd gear. When I don't want to go to 3/4 the way down I will just upshift manual then once I get over that little hill I will put it back into OD.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Thats what I use to do with my 94 3.4. What year is yours? Is it the 2.8?

Project 3.4 Camaro

If you have it floored in drive and still lose speed then something is probably up with the engine, unless were talking about a ludicrously steep hill.

regal301

cat converter clogged,dirty or bad maf,weak fuel pump and or plugged fuel filter.

i had a 86 sport coupe,2.8 auto,would spin a little tire off the line and get to 85 no problem.

you definitly have a problem.the v6 moves these cars around good.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Check the fuel pressure. Check the timing yourself (don't trust a shop for ANYTHING... most of the guys working in a shop today have probably NEVER seen a distributor before in their lives on a GM car/truck). Check the color of the spark plugs, it will tell you volumes. Readjust the TV cable and check the level and color of the transmission fluid. Can you somehow find a way to note the shift speeds for your transmission?

:edit: Even my half dead 2.8 got to 60 really quick and didn't have any problems passing on the highway, even when almost overheating due to not having an air dam.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

At least I feel hope from these stories, when I first bought it I was afraid I would have to chug around forever. I was about to cut the floor out and go flintstone.

Tomorrow I'm off work so I'm going to do everything I can. I'll mark down what speeds it shifts and I'm going to try to check fuel pressure/compression/timing again.

What should the fuel pressure be? They guy that I bought it from said he had just changed the fuel pump but he seemed like he was a fry short of a happy meal. Maybe he got the wrong one.

Is there any way to test the MAF specifically without buying a new one?

Hmm... looked up some symptoms of clogged cat converter includes: loss of gas mileage.. check... decreased power, noticeably while going up hill... check... low tack rpms... I don't think I have even seen my tach get over 30 or 35k. I asked about the cat converter at the last shop and they didn't think there was anything wrong with it... though they were wrong before...
Sounds like I should look into that to.

Thanks for the help guys!

IROC85X1

Not sure about the cat, but when my 85 2.8 was running I had to buy a new tv cable because the previous owner somehow managed to fray it to the point of breaking. Easiest way I found to adjust it was to have someone press the release button so that it reset to fully un-adjusted and then push the accelerator 90% of the way to the deck. I never had any problems with accelerating once the car was moving.

Of course, I replaced the cat on mine with a piece of exhaust pipe, but that was highly illegal...even in FL.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Fuel pressure: 37 to 47 PSI RUNNING
MAF: Remove it and look at the film inside with a light shining in through the screen. If the film doesn't appear completely flat, get a new one.
Catalytic converter: If you have an IR pyrometer, use it on the in and out of the cat. If the IN side of the cat is hotter, then it's clogged. The OUT side should be about 10-15% hotter than the IN side due to the catalytic reactions going on inside. Also inspect the rest of the exhaust for dents or other restrictions to flow, and use the IR pyrometer on the muffler as well. The temps should be about the same on the in and out of the muffler, and, again, if the IN is hotter, there is a restriction there. Don't have a pyrometer or thermocouple-enhanced DMM? Drive at night sometime and get the engine and exhaust nice and hot. Any restriction will be evidenced by a nice cherry glow (which is a BAD thing).

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I checked that converter like you said and the in was close to 20% hotter than the out.. hmm maybe I should get that changed before spending too much. Is there any good high flow cat's that will work on the 2.8? Is this http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MPE-93456/ a good choice?

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I took it for a drive and tried to listen for the shift points. It sounded seemed to shift at 10-15, 20-25, 30-35 and 40-45. I'm guessing that the 40-45 is the torque converter locking right?

I try to climb the hill near my house and in OD it was losing speed fast with my foot to the floor so I shifted into D, the RPMs went up but there was no noticeable increase in power, I lost a little more speed and then held steady at 47mph with my foot still to the floor.

I tried calling around to different shops to get pricing on how much it would cost to get the compression and fuel pressure tested and they all wanted over $100 for it but I found I can get my own testing gauges for less than half that. I might change the cat converter before I buy them just to see if its the problem first.

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

Yeah, there's something really wrong if your losing speed going up hill with the pedal to the floor...

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Pretty much any cat that is a replacement nowadays is a high flow cat... Any one of them, even the $120 Walker direct-fit cat, is better than the factory POS you probably have on there.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Could a fuel pressure tester be rigged to check the back pressure of the exhaust? Maybe if I buy one to check the fuel pressure I can use it to test the catalytic converter also.

Project 3.4 Camaro

I really, really, really doubt it....and even if you could it really wouldn't tell you anything unless you know what PSI your exhaust should be at...

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

I seriously doubt your engine is pushing more than say 20 PSI exhaust pressure... The only possibility I can think of for a fuel pressure gauge to work would be one for a carburetor. Go to an exhaust shop or a place that can do it. A vacuum/manifold pressure gauge may do it...

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

In that case I think I'm just going to change it, its probably the one that came stock and its falling apart and rattling anyway. It couldn't hurt anyway. I'm going to order it from summit today.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

If it's already rattling, I'd try like mad to not drive it before the guts inside break up and travel to the muffler so you don't have to replace that as well.

Project 3.4 Camaro

Hey, if you don't have emissions could just go catless and put a straight pipe in its place.

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

+1 only put a $20 Cherry Bomb there. It'll help lower the exhaust note and cut down on the buzz that comes from many V6 exhausts

Project 3.4 Camaro

Well if you put a cherry bomb in, take out the muffler too,lol.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I don't have emission testing now but I might be moving to Dallas-Fort worth Texas where I will so I went ahead and ordered the MagnaFlow. I'll post the results on if it worked or not when I get it on.

sam24th

iTrader: (1)

Ive got a 2.8 and I drive on freeway all the time no problem. Hell I have nough power to pass people on freeway. I think something is up with your engine if your only getting to like 55mph. My 4 cylinder 2.5 jeep gets to 70 on freeway so the your 2.8 should do just fine. Also if your losing power going up hill something is up. Id check the TV cable like suggested earlier. Also when I first bought my car it was a lil weak and I changed the fuel filter and it helped a bit. Might wanna check that out. Also try opening up the intake and exhaust a bit.

K-slice

iTrader: (2)

why?

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

Ok, well I got the new cat and when to put it on this morning and had something really weird happen. I went to start it so I could pull it up on the ramps and it kind of misfired and stalled, then it completely wouldn't start at all! I tried cranking it for a long time messing with the gas pedal and sometimes it would rumble a little but it wouldn't start. I stopped for a while and came in and read some depressing stories on here about V6's that wouldn't start. Then I went back out and tried again. It took me about 4 minutes of cranking and I finally got it to start. After it was running it seemed fine. It has never happened before and I hope it never happens again since this is the car that I drive to work.

Any ideas of what could cause that? I have changed the fuel filter twice but I think I might go get another one, and maybe I'll get that fuel pressure tester for the heck of it.

ymenic

iTrader: (1)

Fuel pump? and your sure the timing is at 10 degrees right? i would get that fuel pressure checked for sure

IROC85X1

I would guess fuel pump on its vway out. Bad news therfe as dropping the tank is a pain. I would refer to the thread regarding making a door for the fuel pump if this is the case.

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I got the cat changed and looked though the old one, it looked pretty clean and I could see light pretty easy through it. I'm going to take it for a test drive and get a new fuel filter and fuel pressure tester. The guy that sold it to me said he had just changed the fuel pump last spring but maybe he got the wrong one or something.

I noticed when I was having trouble starting it, when I would turn the key off, the fuel pump was buzzing for longer than normal. Hopefully its just the filter though..

DirtDawg57

iTrader: (3)

I tested the fuel pressure and it was around 45psi with just the ignition on and around 40psi with the car running. Do these sound about right? I thought the pressure was supposed to drop off more when the car was running.