Well, we're really damn close to getting the engine outta there!

Friday, we successfully loosened the trans-to-engine bolts! Here's how we did it. First, the tools: All were 1/2 inch drive- the thick stuff. The tools were: a 24" extension, a 7" extension, a universal (swivel) adapter, a breaker bar, and a 15 mm socket. Something interesting: My '86 has 18mm trans-to-engine bolts, and this '89 uses 15mm trans-to-engine bolts!

First, we blocked the rear tires, raised the front of the car, and placed it on jackstands. We removed the flywheel inspection cover. The lower two (left & right sides) trans-to-engine bolts were removed directly- there's plenty of room to get to them. In fact, the lower driver's side was loose enough to remove without tools!

Next, we had to remove the crossmember, and lower the transmission down. (The trans would only lower so far, and this was because we left the driveshaft & torque arm attached.) For the middle two bellhousing bolts, the tools were assembled in this order: Socket, 24" long extension, universal, 7" long extension, 16" long breaker bar. I busted my knuckles really bad on passenger side when the bolt broke free- I smashed my hand into the cat's rusted-apart heat shield- I need to remember my Mechanix gloves for jobs like this!

Finally, we went after the top bolts. These were harder to figure out how to get to. We were able to get a box wrench up top, but the bolts were in too tight- the wrench was going sideways. So finally I got it- the combination was (from under the car): socket, universal, 24" extension, 7" extension, breaker bar. That did it! We didn't remove any bolts, we just loosened them all so we can remove them with our fingers. Finally, we raised the trans back up, bolted the crossmember back on, and removed the jack from under the trans.

My friend went to get his engine hoist, and I started working on the y-pipe-to-exhaust-manifold nuts. The driver's side came out beautifully- no problems. (I used a deep 15mm socket, 24" extension, breaker bar.) The passenger side's another story! Someone must've tried these before, because the f#@&ing nuts were already stripped. (Either that, or they're rusted away!) The 15mm socket was too big, the 14mm was on there loosely, 13mm was too small, 5/8" was too loose, etc.. finally, we did get a socket up there that was relatively tight- and the nuts stripped the rest of the way! (insert cursing here)

So, as you know, those nuts are pretty impossible to get at- there's no room! My friend cut the uppermost y-pipe-to-manifold stud in half with a grinder, so we're left with the lower stud. I have three ideas left- #1: Remove the manifold from the engine, spin it on the y-pipe so it's upside down, and cut thru the remaining stud. #2: Try to get a nut splitter in there. #3: Cut the y-pipe's flange (at the bolt hole) with a hacksaw, and weld it back together when the engine's out. Anyone have other ideas for that tight spot?

What's left at this point? Well, the starter motor's gotta be pulled, and the ECM grounds at the back of the passenger side head need to be removed. Next, the sensors for coolant temp & oil pressure get unhooked, and .. uh.. well, heck, I guess that's when we unbolt the motor mounts! Hopefully we're going to get that motor out of there this afternoon, and slide the new one in. I'll take some pictures!

Anyone got tips for that remaining nut?


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
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Tom, all sounds normal. For that last nut I'd be thinking about unbolting the manifold from the head and worry about it while the engine is out so you have room to work on it. You might be able to leave the starter in to take out the engine. Make sure it doesn't bolt to the trans or is going to be in the way when you lift and it should be fine. You'll have to have it off to ease the installation of the new engine though. When you go to lift the engine out remember thet you need to go several inches forward to clear the input shaft of the trans. If you had unbolted the torque converter you could've just about gone straight up. Since you can't do that you'll need to go far enough that the input shaft comes out of the converter.

As for that last bolt, Do you have access to a dremel? One of those and a cutoff wheel works great

 

So, I take it we'd have to lift the engine, and then pull the hoist backwards so the TC falls off of the tranny's input shaft? We'll probably remove the starter anyway; on the small 2.8, it's not hard to get to at all. It just bolts to the block, too.

That's true; we could just lift the motor out with the manifold left in the bay. I have a die-grinder and a cutoff tool, but I don't know if his air compressor (looks like an antique! ) can push them. Right now, neither would fit up in that little spot. Makes me wish I bought a flex extension for the thing!

Thanks!


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
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Ok Tom, number one:

On the passenger side oil pan of my 2.8 (It's a '87, don't know if the one you're working on will have this, but check anyway), there was a little clip holding on two metal lines, that run from the radiator, back to the tranny (I think they end there, but I don't know...). Make sure these are out of the clips BEFORE jacking the motor up (duh!) I know, it sounds like common sense, but I had to stand out there bent over the fender for a hour bending them back to original (well, not anymore) places. Also, the motor hoist we had didn't really reach all the way back to grab the center of the chain on the motor, so when we did free up those lines (after they were about 2 1/2 feet ABOVE where they were supposed to be), the motor swung forward and almost:
#1. Broke my dad's arm... got caught between the motor and the radiator... ouch.
#2. Almost put a hole through my radiator (that's the real reason I grabbed it and pulled it back as hard as I could... I wasn't even thinking about my dad's arm... heh... whoops. )
So, watch out for that too. They're definately light little motors though, so it shouldn't be too much trouble moving it around to get it out of there....

And, you can remove the starter, but I left mine on, and the motor came right out. It's not really in the way of anything. It's all up to you. I'll probably put mine back on before I put it in the car too... dunno yet.

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--'87 Camaro LT --
Currently undergoing a 2.8->3.4 swap.....

 

Tom, does that last post remind you of my comment to pull the rad as a precaution? Others say you have enough room to pull the engine without removing the rad, and I say I'm too cheap to pay to fix it if I make a booboo.

 

Honestly, there is PLENTY of room to pull the motor without pulling the radiator. But, like I said, the arm on the motor hoist wasn't long enough to get over the center of the motor (damn long *** nosed car), so when it slipped off the input shaft, the motor swung forward. But, I was luckily standing right beside it, and grabbed it before it broke anything (or anyone). But, my dad's borrowing a different hoist to put it back in... hopefully one that's long enough. I keep saying that it'll be any day now, but then again, the motor's been sitting in the garage, finished, for a week now....

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--'87 Camaro LT --
Currently undergoing a 2.8->3.4 swap.....

 

Wow, glad your dad's arm's in one piece! Yep, we removed both the radiator and the a/c condensor. (Actually we removed the whole a/c system without releasing any freon, better safe then sorry.)

Thanks for the info about that clip for the trans lines. His 2.8's an '89, so it must have it. I don't recall my '86 having it, but I might not've looked that closely.

The hoist my friend has is insane! It's this huge *** , 3-ton , heavy-as-hell, ANSI-certified, engine hoist! Hell, we could lift the whole car with this thing! I never expected a hoist to be that big or that heavy. I figured when I rebuilt a 2.8 for my car that I'd buy a hoist; now, after seeing this thing, I have no idea where I'd put one at my house!


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
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