Hi does anyone know if i can swap out my third gen camaro 2.8 engine for a fourth gen firebird 3.8 L36,and if there is anything i should know before considering it,i have the whole car available to use,both have 5 speed manual trans is this possible or should i forget it

 

ok i just realised that i should of read the stickys first,it does not look like it's possible without a load of mods

 

Yes it is possible.

You do need to have reasonably good fabrication skills, and wiring ability, or the funds to have one or both done for you.

You'll need to fabricate engine mounts to bolt it in, there are no stock mounts to do this.

You'll need to make one wiring harness out of the 4th gen engine harness and your thirdgen harness.

You'll need to modify or get a new PS hose.

And you'll need to cut and remake the Y pipe into something usable.

Aside from that there will be the typical cooling hoses cut to fit, radiator hoses, fuel lines.

 

Will it take some work ? Yes

Is it a good idea if you just HAVE to have a V6 and refuse to install a V8, yes.

 

i have the 4th gen firebird complete,so could be used rather than spending out on other engines,fabrication is not a problem,wiring may be a little bit harder depending on what needs doing,what about fuel pumps? do i need to change stock camaro one for firebird or would 2.8 one cope?do i need trans also or could i use 2.8 on 3.8 and is it worth taking rear axle etc from 4th gen bird or can i use camaro's

 

it would probably be about as much work as swapping an LSx into it.

 

Your stock fuel pump will do though its probably quite old, and if you are going to swap over the rear axle, having that out of the way makes doing the fuel pump a quick easy job.

I would use the transmission from the 4th gen as the vss (speed sensor) is a different type, but largely they are the same transmission.

You can use the rear axle from the 4th gen, however it will make you wheels stick out a bit on each side, depending on what you use for wheels can make this a good, or very bad thing, does the axle in the car have disc brakes ?

 

firebird axle is drums on rear,im running 20" irocs on camaro with 235's all round so the rears sit inside arch slightly,from what i understand the firebird axle is a meant to be straight swap over..is that right??

 

Yes its a direct bolt in other than moving the wheels out 1.5 or 2" I forget which, per side.

 

if the car already has a vss cluster, the wiring is not that hard. If you already have the whole 4th gen donor car it will be cake. Late 4th gen header style exhaust manifolds will hit the frame rails unless you grind the collector rings a lot. Early style msnifolds will not have fitment issues. You will also need to program the ecm; 97 & later iifc can dome w/hp Tuners or Digital Horsepower.

fwiw, I've done this swap.

 

Thanks this is sounding easier by the minute,what is a vss cluster??
and when you say earlier headers wont be a problem mines a 97 would that be classed as early?
when you say i would need to program ecm?? the 2.8 one??
can i not just fit 3.8 ecm?

 

You will have to use the 3.8's computer, and make one wiring harness from the two.

Realistically if you keep everything in tact (egr, evap), and are swapping the rear axle over, the only thing you would need to do reprogramming for is VATS, the antitheft, however it would be a lot simpler with your location to just buy a vats bypass module.

 

vss electronic speedo, unless you want to to pony up the $$$ for the convertor box or aftermarket electronic speedo

97 logs should be good, I used a 95 engine/tranny

use the swapped motor pcm, 2.8/-3.4 ecm is a no go

 

If his info is correct, 88 camaro, cable speedometer.

He'll need a cable box or aftermarket speedometer.

 

i agree.

just cant see the point of this swap.

sure seems like alot of work for next to nothing.

ive only bought one v-6 third gen,...just cause it was in nice shape, & cheap, $100. first thing i did was throw the v-6 in the trash and put a v-8 in it.

as much as i like 3rd gens, id leave the 4th gen alone and drive that, before id swap motors.

your wasting your time and money, IMO. but its your car. your gonna take 2 cars apart and make one,...hopefully? why? just sell them both and buy a v-8 car. youll be way ahead of the game.

im not trying to be rude at all,...i just dont understand why you would waste your time doing this?

 

Because you cant seem to look a little to the left and see that he's from the UK, so he probably doesnt have anywhere near the parts availability we do.

The 4th gen is probably wrecked, and he's going to gain 50HP in doing the swap.

For what, a full day worth of work ?

 

why waste time w/ an ellis ex when a gen 1 sbc cain be built? or then why waste time w/a v8 when v10 can fit?

n e way, back to topic.... iirc, and need to search for my swap posts, I wapped in an 89 cluster, repinned the harness for it, then spliced in the 95 wiring. just rememberd, i didn't have vats in the 85 so i got some cheap, and i mean crappy cheap, signal boxes for the 95 ecm. worked for about 5 starts each then they'd die. Since you have an entire car, you hold be able to transplant all electronics needed, hell, a full interior swap might be an option. I didn't have the funds to send the ecm out to have various stuff programmed out, to include the 3rd & 4th o2 sensors

btw, the 3800 use 87oct, so there's $$$ everytime at the pump, esp by the litre

 

89 Camaro clusters are cable as well.

The 90-92 electronic speedometer cluster doesnt fit the earlier dash.

 

interesting, mine was from a bird.. gonna check the specs yr by yr for comparison

 

Birds went electronic in 1986 iirc.

Camaro didnt until the 90-92's which got a completely different dashboard. The metal brackets that the dashboard mounts to are also different for the 90-92s

 

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/325040...ntiac-firebird pics of my swaps inside

 

i can understand what you mean but are little old island uk does not offer much in the way of parts(well at reasonable prices anyway)and v8's are Great but the cost of buying one over here is stupid money,so it's just considering using what i have available for free,the 4th gen is a runner and is all good and up for sale on ebay now,maybe i should sell them both and buy a v8,will see if the firebird sells and maybe consider that option i just wanted to gain hp to be honest,the 2.8 is dog slow and the 3.8
firebird goes very well compared to the 5.0l camaro's i have been in ..
whats this about 87 oct fuel??
we only get 91 oct premuim or 97/98 super! maybe thats why it cost so much here

 

that engine looks nice painted and polished well done!

 

can u get a 3.4 engine out of a 93/93 camaro or firebird by any chance?

this is the most direct swap, to use the 3.4 u will need to reuse the oil pan,front cover, and intake off the 2.8, the 2.8 ecm will even run 3.4

 

i have seen a couple of camaro's/firebirds around with 3.4 engine's
how much HP do the 3.4's produce?
my firebird never sold so it's looking more like an ideal donor day by day

 

160hp@ 4500rpm
200tq@ 3500rpm