So today was the day, I went down to the test only station (since DMV randomly selected me to go right to a test only). They were offering a deal today, so I went for it.

My results were:

15 mph test:
HC--115 (max 110) FAIL
CO--.36 (max .73) PASS
NO--116 (max 772) PASS

25 mph test:
HC--94 (max 85) FAIL
CO--.30 (max .59) PASS
NO--109 (max 711) PASS

So I barely failed Hydro Carbons. The tech told me that they are not supposed to diagonse or give advice, since they are a test only station, however he did so anyways.

He told me that my timing was set at 7*, where stock is 6*, and I am fine 3* in either direction, but I should set it back to about 3-4* and I would possibly pass. He also said I should replace my spark plugs with AC Delco RapidFires (I have Bosch Platnum Standards in there now). He said with that I possibly would pass fine.

Do you guys think I would pass if I do what he said?

I have another cat in my closet, the one that's on there looks like it's a year or more old, Should I put that on? If I do, will it cut my numbers down more, or will it even make a difference? I am also planning on running a bottle of that sure pass stuff through my car before I go for my retest. Any other suggestions?

 

I am by no means an emissions expert, but here's my shot. Hydrocarbons means unburnt fuel Sure, the cat may help, however, the cat also helps the CO level and since you passed on the CO's, replacing the cat shouldn't be the first thing to look to. What is the condition of the plugs, wires, cap and rotor? What's the fuel pressure at? What condition is the o2 in? Try dropping the timing a tad and dumping it drygas.

 

What is this DryGas I keep hearing about?

The plugs have less than 5k on them, same with wires, cap, and rotor. They are Bosch Platinum plugs, which the smog tech said can cause problems with chevy engines.

Fuel Pressure is stock, as I only have a stock regulator. I have never put a fuel gauge on it yet, I am thinking I should buy one.

I think I should replace the o2 sensor, I got this one from a friend, who said it had less than 5k on it, and it's been in my car for about 3k, but I kinda want to replace it anyways.

 

A partially clogged or leaking fuel injector could also up the hydrocarbon readings. Try running a bottle of injector cleaner through it. I've had good luck with the Redline stuff.

 

Drygas is basically methyl alcohol IIRC. Same theory as denatured alcohol for the most part. Haven't used it personally as i've never had to go through emissions. Basically, from what i've heard about it, it's less dense than gasoline therfore allowing for a more compete burn off.

 

did u pass the visuals? If so tell me where u got ur car smogged It could be ur 22lb injectors. Probably need a afpr to tone it down a bit. But i don't know. I'll help you out if u need help. Was it a pretest

 

I passed the visuals fine. The Smog Tech said that the injectors shouldn't cause a problem, the computer should compensate for them, and since SMOG testing isn't done at WOT, there should be little difference in injectors.

I'm still thinking, New Cat on there, new plugs (I want AC Delcos) and pull out a little timing, and run some of that sure pass smog stuff, and see what happens.

The Smog shop is in Oakland, it's a test only, off 85th ave at Baldwin (right by the collseum)

 

well my cat was clogged within a year of when it was new but my car was in pretty bad shape with the injector leak. i think ur cat is fine. Try running some injector cleaner since their used injectors

 

That's true IF all the injectors flow similarly and the injector size is relatively close to original. The ECM, however, does not have the ability to compensate for injectors that have widely varying flowrates within a given set, like if one is partially clogged. Hence, the two recommendations to try the injector cleaner.

 

Well I have a game plan now...

Injector Cleaner
Oil Change
New Cat
New AC Delco Spark Plugs
Sure Pass smog stuff
Turn timing down to 4*

Then I'm gonna take it back for the retest. I think I'll pass with all that work.

Does it matter if I run 87, 89 or 91 octane gas? Should I still run some Dry Gas or methyl alcohol when I go to get it smogged again? If so How much?

 

Are you running 22lb injectors on a stock 305 bin that still has the 19lb injector constant????

 

Yeah, Stock Chip.

 

Cant Hydrocarbons be caused by not enough fuel being delivered to the engine?

 

My Chiltons Manual says Too Rich of a Mixture, Improper Spark Timing, and Low Engine temperatures.

I believe too little fuel will show up in the NO category, and if I was getting lean misses, it would show up in all 3 categories. (All from my understanding)

I also read somewhere on the Net that if your oil is dirty, the PCV system can also be causing higher than normal Hydrocarbons by burning the mist of that dirty oil... So I'm thinking changing that will help me out.

I really don't think the injectors being 22lbs will cause that much of a difference, as you can see I BARELY failed, I think I can pull those numbers under the limits and pass with a little work, Not including replacing the injectors.

 

I agree do that you should be fine, you might also throw in a new PCV if yours hasn't been replaced in the last year. There only about $4.

 

Have you ever scanned your car???? I know that 3 lbs difference in a constant is pretty big when it comes to tuning. I have played with injectors and bins and datalogging enough to know that there is no way the ECM can control that kind of fuel difference in the BLM's. I bet you see BLM's in the 108-114 range. The ECM will be adding what it "thinks" is a certian amount of fuel but really its getting that amount of fuel plus 15% more. To add 15 percent more fuel and ask the ECM to compensate will not work.

Regardless of the emissions you should really get a different chip with the correct constant. The money you could save on fuel alone would pay for it in just a short while not to mention the extra load on your cat with all the unburned fuel.

 

Not to argue with you, but yes I have scanned the car. My BLMs at idle are between 130 and 135, they are consistantly lean, even at cruising speeds. I have never been able to understand this. I seriously need to do some tuning, but I don't think my injectors are playing that big of a deal here.

 

If your car runs lean while adding 15 percent more fuel you have some serious issues with fuel delivery. I would be dead scared about how lean you could be going at WOT. Maybe try the diy prom board to get some honest advice from someone who can tell you firsthand. Regardless I hope you pass emissions...

 

How warm was the motor and what do you have in for a stat? Seems like you need to get the temps up just a tad to bring down both CO and HC and bring up the NOx just a tad. Maybe advance the timing a tad. (Why did he want you to retard the timing?)
The Bosch Platinums are fine especially if you're lazy or have problems changing your plugs) so long as you are not running a spark box.

Also, last O2 sensor and air filter change? FP is set to what?

 

The thermostat is a 180, the car was right about there for the test. I did have the fan on.

He said retarding the timing would bring down HC and CO. I also wondered about that, but I kinda believe him, cause he's the tech.

As for plugs.. I will be doing them shortly I'm gonna run AC Delcos. Airfilter is a K&N and was cleaned about 500 miles ago. o2 sensor will probably be replaced before the retest also.

Fuel Pressure is stock, since I don't have an AFPR.

 

I wouldn't beleive him, but it's not my car...

I'll put two pennies on that one as partially to blame. Try a new paper filter when you go in, you may be surprised. And I'd let the car get a tad warmer than 180º. You may want to invest in an AFPR before the new O2.

 

Explain that! If you try to say that the K & N flows more air and that creates a lean AFR, no way thats why we have EFI with MAF it will compensate for any mild changes in air volume. I have never heard of an aftermarket filter causing erroneous hydro carbon readings.

So please explain your rational.

 

No!
It's advice dude, not an inquisition, chill out. The guy probably won't adhere to the advice anyway.

And where in the hell would you assume I would say a K&N would cause a lean condition on a TPI MAF system in a thread about high HC with a LOW NOx?!? That's :werd: Gotta read my stuff in context, I know we have a lot of 'dude' guys whose posts are three words, I throw people off right?
And I'm not sure about you, but I have EFI because the factory put it on there so as to conform with the tightening CAFE standards which the Federal Government imposed on the manufacturers in order to reduce the emissions and increase the gas milage of the automobiles occupying the roadways... or something like that.

Better read up some more then huh? I've even heard of stock and paper filters doing this. Can you believe that!

As for the rationale ... Deductive reasoning. I didn't put only 'K & N' I put the fact that it was just cleaned, and I assumed re-oiled. That's the key right there. Issues have come up in the past with an over-oiled filter. Anyone with a thick film MAF has even worse, much worse, problems with that. (Ask some LS1 guys what they think) So my rationale would be, um... experience.

As I apparently alluded to it in the previous post, I'll clarify now.
1. Swap in paper filter.
2. Install AFPR and, well, adjust the FP.
3. NOW you can change your O2.
4. Adjust timing.
5. Bring in the car HOT.

Good job, or did I miss anything?

 

No you covered yourself ok. Your reasoning on the filter was based on the oil in the filter causing funky readings in the MAF. I have heard about this, I think its important to clarify that when you tell someone to change there filter out. People won't adhere to advise on these boards often because theres to much mis-information out there. Explain why you should change your filter and somebody might listen. We don't know the people giving advice on these boards, you may be highly qualified, speaking from experience, or just speaking out your Azz. Putting some logical rational behind your advice gives it more credibility.

As far as the my statements on wanting you to explain how the filter could be causing lean conditions, just follow the post. The couple post right above yours is talking about how hes running lean not rich then you pop in and tell him to change his K&N filter to a paper element.

I have no beef with you RedDevil, I actually was curious as to why you would tell him to change the filter. I thought maybe you knew something I hadn't heard about regarding aftermarket filters and you could educate us on your advice.

 

MUAHAHAHA!! All I did last year was fool with cars and get them to pass emissions.

There are a few things you could do. Your car is running rich when it is being tested.

AFTER the car is warmed up, you could put an air leak in it, like pull off any small hose on the intake and the computer won't completley counteract it. This will raise your NOX and CO2 will probably stay about the same.

You could also retard your timing but this will raise your NOX also.

Hope this helps good luck! PS, I have a new cat if you need it.

 

Well I am probably going to go in for my retest on Thursday...

Here's what I did for Smog:

New Cat
New AC Delco Plugs
New AC Delco 02 Sensor
Fresh Oil and Filter
Sure Pass Smog Treatment
Injector Treatment
Pulled out 3* of timing (I'm running 4*, 6* is stock)

In the last few weeks I also had my fuel pump go out on me, I replaced it with a Autozone "Master" brand since I needed my car running quickly and only had a little money to spend. After I did my pump my car had so much more power, and the pinging is gone, I guess my pump had been going for a while.

I plan on putting a bottle of this Iso-heat stuff (same as dry gas I believe) It is Isopropal Alcohol, treats 10 gallons, so one bottle to a half tank (or less) of gas should help me a bit.

Should I run 91 octane gas for my retest, or does it matter?

 

The timing is all you really needed to remove to pass. In a nutshell it reduces HC by a few means (reduces misfires due to sparking at a more compressed state, allowing combustion to take place later with less cylinder pressure). It reduces HC and CO together by having hotter exhaust, which also heats the cat better, which also allows the cat to catalize the HC and CO, and self heat from that reaction. The reduced peak cylinder pressure (late combustion) reduces NOx, since NOx is primarily influenced by temperature, and presence of Oxygen (lean). Also, remember the hotter cat - that reduces NOx better when hotter. If you were to pull all timing out to 0 deg initial, it would pass. It'd be down on power, but that can be fixed after the test.
And before you all ask, yes, I'm an EFI engineer that has to deal with emissions for a living.
The cat is sort of OK, not perfect, but OK. as long as it's stoichiometric, and CO is below .5, it's doing something. Reduced timing will only make it better, and since it passed I'd focus on HC, and realize the NOx was low, so it's probably not Lean.
Your emissions condition indicates a misfire, or a tired cat. It's so close though, that timing should make up for either.

Good luck (I failed the first time too, but I don't have to do the dyno test here - but, timing fixed it - you should have seen it - I had our 5 gas analyzer right there in the tailpipe during the test, and I burned a chip with less low load timing - I knew I passed before the machine did!).

 

Cool an emissions expert at our fingertips :lala:

 

Okay, I passed the retest with flying colors.

Results at 15 mph:
HC-- 43 (110 max, previously 115) PASS
CO-- .03 (.71 max, previously .36) PASS
NO-- 111 (772 max, previously 116) PASS

Results at 25 mph:
HC--33 (85 max, previously 94) PASS
CO-- .03 (.59 max, previously .3) PASS
NO--101 (711 max, previously 109) PASS

I did run Dry Gas (Iso Heat, which is Isopropyl alcohol) and 91 octane gas for the test. I was still burning a little oil from my bad valve seals, but about 1/3 as much as before. I ran 20w-50 Oil to cut back on the smoke along with a bottle of Bardahl NO-Smoke, seemed to do the trick.

I did everything else I listed above also. I'm glad I passed. Thanks for all your help guys.

 

congrats on passing ur smog. Where did u buy the Bardahl NO-Smoke?

 

So you ran Dry gas and Bardahl together? I'd be nervous putting that many additives in at once. Great to hear you passed. You did so much though its hard to tell what was the main factor. Thats one big worry off your hands though, damn California smog *****.

 

Bardahl is an Oil Treatment... basically super thick sticky oil.
Dry Gas (Iso Heat) is just Isopropyl Alcohol.

So they are not in the same system. When I did the injector cleaner and the Sure Pass smog stuff, they were used in seperate tanks, and the Dry Gas stuff was used seperately also.

Next time smog comes around, I'll just be setting my timing to about 4*, and running a little Dry Gas, along with thicker oil and Bardahl probably. Everything else I did should still be alright, we'll see.

 

I got the Bardahl from Pep Boys, I believe it was only like 5 bux.