Hello everyone,

I haven't kept on top of the whole header situation, so I don't know if this is common knowledge yet. I was poking around Pacesetter's website, curious to see if the V6 headers where listed in the products yet. I couldn't find them anywhere on the site (not surprising), but I did run across this jem in the pricing list, under the "PaceSetter Headers" section:

70-1206 85-90 Camaro/Firebird, 2.8L 349.95

That is $349.95

For reference, the 93-95 Chev Camaro/Firebird 3.4L (P/N 70-1208 - just below the "2.8L" 70-1206 headers in the price list) are $334.95

 

that's probably about the price i was expecing to see...amazing how these engines are everywhere, yet the price for performance parts is damn near exotic (might as well buy that ferrari) jk. NOt bad, but sad if u consider you can get Sbc headers for a buck and a quarter. Glad to konw there available though, that's a million dollar kick.

 

Yeah, it is nice. I've got a 1989 Camaro RS with the 2.8L and a 5-speed. I have a couple exhaust leaks (probably manifold gaskets and y-pipe to manifold joints) that I have been afraid to tackle due to the chance of breaking bolts. I also have a new Catco cat for the car, but can't put it on because the existing cat is welded to the y-pipe. I was thinking of taking it to a muffler shop and having them get the old cat off and put in the new one (probably weld it too) and track down the leaks.

I am guessing, however, that I could get the PS headers and y-pipe for what it would cost me to get the work done at an exhaust shop (or at least maybe the headers would cost twice as much). As long as the y-pipe will fit a manaul car OK (read something about possible interference with the slave cylinder? Anyone know anything about this?) and as long as the y-pipe will mount to a cat in the stock location so that I can still use the I-pipe and such from my Dynomax cat-back, I would seriously consider buying this set. Also, I am probably going to have to get rid of the smog equipment to, right? I doubt the headers have the connections. (No big deal, no emissions checks around here.)

 

far as I know, they PS y-pipe leaves it to the owner to take responsabilty for the cat. So you should beable to clamp on your own cat. This would be in the stock location also.

PS was sent emails reguarding the interference of the slave cylinder on manuals. No word on it, someone will have to take the chance.

PS was also sent emails reguarding smog pump bungs, and EGR mounting. Since they intend to make these 50 state legal, they SHOULD have all proper bungs/mounts/smog hookup.

 

I mailed PS about the manual thing. They said they left clearance in any area they could that would effect the manual but were still waiting for someone to try a set.

 

That's what I thought, and that's what it looked to me like in the picture, but I wasn't sure.

Yeah, I thought the same thing...when I said "I doubt the headers have the connections" in my previous post, it should have read "I don't see the smog connections in the picture floating around the board". Must have been for non-smog cars.

Ok...
Who did you e-mail by the way?
Was it Fred Gerle at fgerle@pacesetterexhaust.com address that has been floating around? I was wondering because I would like to ask about the smog stuff and such (maybe confirm the cat thing too).

Thanks everyone.

 

An interesting note on the AIR/smog stuff:
I was poking through some threads on the forum about removing AIR equipment and found that TRAXION discovered that in the case of the $8D V8 code, whenever the ECM diverts air to the exhaust manifolds, it changes the O2 sensor thresholds by 100mV. As TRAXION said:I would not be surprised if V6 ECM's are doing the same thing when AIR is diverted to the manifolds. So if the headers do not have the connections for the AIR/smog tubes, this could possibly cause an issue (albiet, minor) that to be properly taken care of should probably be tuned out of the PROM. This is not to say that removal of AIR from the car is a big problem or is hurting anything. As TRAXION said:Also, I don't know if this could easily be tuned out of the V6 PROM because in TunerCat's definition file, I don't see any sort of flag refering to AIR (such as "AIR Divert Enable Coolant Temp.").

I doubt that putting headers without AIR connections into a car that has AIR would cause any serious problems (as TRAXION said, people have been doing it for a long time now), however, I would rather play it safe and have the connections available. The AIR system does not rob very much engine power and does add very much wieght to the car. It helps to clean up the exhaust (from TRAXION's findings in $8d, at many different times, not just idle or start-up), and complies with the ECM's assumption that when AIR divert is commanded, 100mV worth of extra oxygen is in the exhaust. Also, if these headers are going to be 50 state legal, they should have these connections. At some point I am going to have to e-mail PaceSetter and see what they have to say.

See also:
TRAXION's thread about removing smog/AIR and the auto-100mV change:
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=214321
And
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=213310

 

Its really great we have headders now, but is the price worth the gain? I mean, for 400 i can get a whole 3.4! Just wondering what everyone else thought.

 

Well, it depends on the situation. Some probably won't be swapping engines for quite awhile because the existing engine is in good shape, and they want some extra power. Some might not really feel like dealing with a full engine swap right now. I would guess that there are others have already put a lot into a 2.8L or 3.1 and would love headers. Others, who already have a 3.4 swapped in, I'm sure would like some good headers to go with it.

In my case, I have a 2.8L that runs great, I don't feel like swapping, and I have a bunch of annoying exhaust leaks. The cat on the car is also welded to the existing y-pipe. If I get the headers and y-pipe, I'll get rid of leaks, gain some power, and be able to use this new Catco cat I have sitting around. All without having to go to an exhaust shop.

Also, I happened to look at Summit Racing to see how much the 93-95 3.4L (70-1208) headers are. Summit has them for $217.99, $116.96 lower than the $334.95 shown at PaceSetter's website. Let's hope it will be the same situation with the ThirdGen V6 (70-1206) headers.

 

Maybe someone could clarify something for me. For 2.8/3.1/3.4 in a 3rd gen, the headers match up to the car, not the engine, correct? That is, whether you had a 2.8, 3.1, or 3.4 block in your 3rd gen you'd still want this new set of PS headers.

 

Yes, that is correct. These headers will fit any 60 degree V6 engine in a third gen.

 

Cool. I do intend to get a set when I have some ca$h. Good thing I've fixed all the bolts on the manifold and they're all ready to come off.

 

Sweet! $350 is great for emissions-legal headers! And these are supposed to come with a y-pipe, too? Can't wait can't wait can't wait... thank you Fred & Karl!!

(Side note- LinuxGuy, what do you use? RedHat or Debian? I had to set up RedHat 7.3 the other day so I could "learn" it quickly to help someone out with a problem; it wasn't that painless to set up. 'Course, it's uninstalled already... didn't need it for too long. )

 

I vote for Knoppix. with colinux it can run in and with win2k or xp. both at the same time. 2 OS's at once and useable at the same time.

 

LOL, things sure can get off topic sometimes! (Not that I have been exactly on topic, the original topic was the price.)

I've got Red Hat 7.3 on here, although I haven't used it in a while, my Linux usage comes in spurts. I need to get the latest Red Hat. Last thing I was doing was working on some video streaming for a local public TV station. I manage a server at work with 7.3 on it too though. I have a soft spot for Slackware too, nice a clean system. Yeah, Knoppix is cool (although I can't say I have tried it out yet!).

Yes, I know what ya mean Tom, I can't wait until the headers are available either! I hope that they'll be less expensive at Summit just like the 93-95 3.4L headers too. I hope they come with the y-pipe.

Gumby:
Ya never did say who it was you emailed...
I suppose I should just send one off to Fred, I have a couple questions about these that I would like to have answered and confirmed. Like the smog/AIR issue.

 

I checked the pacesetter website again. Our headers are suggested retail at $500 with the armor coating. I don't actually know if it's worth the extra money, but they do claim it reduces underhood temps, which sounds good to me.

 

Please send any questions to Fgerle@pacesetterexhaust.com
Mr. Fred Gerle can assist ya with probably any detail ya need before forwarding your funds to them.
Ceramic coating certainly does do as claim, reduce underhood temps.
The price offered is a very good price. Our pipes definetly require the "Y" pipe. A 4th gen set up, I'll bet does not, thus the reduced price.
IF people want to put money on the table, we "may" win. Volumn discount anyone?
IF ya send a quick email to Mr. Fred Gerle, ask if they are available for purchase.
Designed to fit any 60* mill under the 3rd Gen hood.
Two details in designing the headers, I pointed out...
I said many people install subframe connectors. And that addition "interferes/it's tight" with the CC location.
I also suggested to "box" pipe the "Y" pipe "CC" location, as that is "closest to ground". For additional clearence.
We'll see when we get these Pace Setter Exhaust Street Legal Headers in our hands!
Pic is of the set, fresh off the engineering mule vehicle.
Again, THANK YOU EVERYONE that wrote a short kind email to help make these pipes happen.
FINALLY I can install a set of headers on this 3.4 & see what really happens now!
IF ya can grab a 3.4 in great shape for price of these headers, think of this....
3.4 crate motors no longer in production.
They sell for $2500 if ya find one in crate, new.
Headers $350, Used 3.4 Engine $500, Misc engine stuff $300 (easily, right?) equals $1150! OF a $2500 crate price, minus above parts at $1150, ya got TONS OF SPARE CHANGE for the "other projects" on your ride! In end you have a very powerful decent fun Classic 3rd gen ride! For Chump Change!
These Pace Setter Street Legal Headers for us are a bargin!
Illegal smog stickers cost ($350) that much in LA!

 

I email pacesetters, what ever the contact email is or was for them headers.

 

OK, I'll e-mail Fred, thanks!

 

In your quick emails to Mr Fred Gerle, always thank him.
He listened to my request and to all of us (one website I only visit and it's here).
I wrote a letter to Vic Edelbrock suggesting this plan (modify "something" send it thru CARB, ya got money!).
Bastard never wrote me back.
I even spoke to his Daughter, Cammee, about this plan (during an interview with her). No response like "I'll have my father get back on that idea".

Mr. Fred Gerle is a wonderful gentleman.
He came through for us.
I can't wait to thank them with my money!
Income tax refund where are you!?!

Thanks again everyone. I can't wait to go for my next "smog check only" with those pipes under the hood! AND cure my current rattling exhaust with new Engine to Tail pipe Pace Setter exhaust 2 1/2" system.

 

i can't wait to get to hopefully get the job i'm after, then I can't wait to find a nice 3.4, then I can't wait to put maybe some roller rockers and such on that 3.4, then I can't wait to put those headers on it with the Y-pipe and install it in my car.

 

As with all things, initial price will be high, but also the distibutors like Summit Racing, Jegs, P.A.W., Northern Auto, etc will have thier prices and I seriously doubt they will be over $300, and they do coome w/the y-pipes.

 

Yea we gotta get Summit to stock them things. They will order 50,000 units. sell em for $250+

Maybe we need another email campaign to all the major parts companies asking why they don't offer the V6 headers that pacesetters sells. They sell all the other ones? Acting dumb and nudging them into asking the part buyer, why arnt you stock them V6 headers. and it snow ***** form there.

Sounds good. who do we write?

 

Contact EACH catalog CSR Rep ask for Director of Sales & Purchasing!
Say Hello to them!
Give it a shot...
Carry on with that idea, please. Here's one mail order place, too
Northern Auto Parts
800-831-0884
www.northernautoparts.com
JCWhitney does sell Pace Setter stuff. They helped me contact Mr. Fred Gerle.
Also Contact Mr. Fred Gerle about the idea, too.
I'm up for volumn discount purchase.
We would EACH forward 50% of "to be sold" price to seal the deal. Once we reach "X" quantity to purchase, we all send in rest of dough plus shipping. Sounds fair, mouth plus money equals $aving$.

 

I hear everyone talking about the "ones that pacesetter sells", but when I go to the website they are not listed. Are people talking in future tense or am i just a morron (don't answer that)....

Dave M.
----------------------
89 Camaro RS 173ci black w/t-tops
Future projects:
- sand t-bar top panel, paint it,put new weatherstripping on.
- SLP or Banks exhaust
- Posi rear
- Pacesetter Headers
- Gutting the cat
- new tires (not really a project)

 

I'll answer anyway, you're not. It is future tense.