posted 04-07-2002 08:39 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I wanted to see what difficulties I might have installing SLP headers.

I am planning on purchasing and installing SLP headers on my 1991 TA. The car has 305 w/ 5 speed and has AC.

I would like some install hints from someone who has put headers on a similar car.

Some things I have noticed already:

I can see right off that there is a place where the altenator bracket bolts to the driver's side exhaust manifold.
Does the SLP header have a place to bolt this bracket or include something in the install kit to move it?

There is also an AC bracket that bolts to the passanger side head through the exhaust manifold. Does the SLP header allow clearance for this bracket to be installed to the head or include something in the install kit for this?

Want to get this information in advance of any difficulties.

Thanks.

 

I'm running the 1 5/8" SLP headers on my 92 style TPI set up. The Alt bracket is fine, as is the ac compressor bracket.
You will need to reuse your old exhaust manifold studs on these two brackets. I don't think SLP includes them.

 

So they do provide a provision on the Driver's side for a stud to be inserted, eh??

This was my concern. No place for the bracket to be fastened down.

 

By the way Bob, have you ever run the 92' at the track??

Curious to see what you got out of these mods as I will be doing a similar set up.

Thanks.

 

Yep, there is like a piece of tubing welded to bring the header flange to the correct size.
On my old L98 motor I ran 13.81@98.96mph. I'd expect better out of the ZZ4. However the boost valve in my tranny will not allow much spirited driving. Trying to get other problems ironed out before I spring for the TransGo shift kit to fix the problem.

 

the hardest part is getting the old stuff out. You're dealing with stuff that has been attached for more than 10 years and has grown accustomed to being there. WHen i put slp's on my buddy's 89 gta 305 5 speed, we eliminated the AC, and our biggest issue was one of the back pass side bolts with a heat shield that just wouldn't budge.
Putting the stuff in wasn't bad, we had to take the bolt out of the motormount on the drivers side to lift the engine a bit to get the header in, and afterwards the steering shaft rubbed when turning, cured with a die grinder, but could have probably been fixed by putting in new motor mounts.

 

I find it much easer to undo the two 10mm bolts holding the steering shaft and pull it. Then you have plenty room to work.
I don't think there are clearance issues with the 1 5/8" headers but you may want to test fit 1 3/4" SLP's before you get them coated. Ashame to have to dent a freshly coated header

 

Yes. I was advised by Kevin at SLP to unbolt the engine from the mounts to allow the engine to be raised for the header installation.

He also advised me to replace the engine mounts to avoid the steering rubbing problem.

So now the thousand dollar question: How difficult is it to change the engine mounts from the frame?

I changed them on a 2nd generation TA and it took me and a friend to do it. Had to thread the bolts onto the nuts which I could barely hold onto inside the frame. Does the 3rd generation f-body have the nuts welded to the inside of the frame or do they need to be fastened seperately by hand????

Thanks.

 

by hand



When I did mine I didn't think it was that bad at first but it was a bit of a pain ...

I would set aside a good 25-30 min just for the motor mounts with the right tools

 

And the right tools are?????

Please tell me I must know.

I read an old post where someone used a wire hangar twisted around the nut to hold it in place!!!

What is the secret? I would do it fo 30 min of work.

 

whats the right motor mount to get? do you have a PN for it? Also, does anyone have pics of the job?

-=-Mike

 

I meant having all basic tool and ready to go to do the job

I had all the tools out next to me and it took about 30 min start to finish

I was able to hold the nut with one hand under the car and reach up and guide the bolt from the top

I don't know about the hanger thing... seem like too much work
It can be done by you self no problem

If you get the Energy Susp. Poly mount that will raise your over all motor hight enough to clear any problem with the Headers

I don't know the part # but the GM "Clam Shell" mounts were used in alot of applications

Just call up Summit and tell them what you need it for , and they will have it I think Mine ran me 36 bucks or something

 

Thanks Hecubus.

That is encouraging news.

Think I will stick with the GM mounts since I hear too much about harsh ride with the poly mounts. This is for my daily driver.

What kind of times are you running?

 

My Jet-Hot coated 1-3/4" SLP headers have arrived today.

What do you lift the engine by to do the motor mounts (using a floor jack)? Do you have to disconnect/disassemble anything or can you just lift it?

Why does it seem like everyone else has various things bolted to their exhaust manifolds and I have nothing? (Not that I'm complaining.) Do serpentine systems not bolt anything to the manifolds or something?

 

Hi Synapsis,

From what I have read this week, the engine has been lifted with a board on the oil pan to ditribute the load. I was recommended by a SLP rep to also disconnect the transmission mount to allow the engine to lift more freely.

Carefully watch the distributor as it will be lifted towards the underside of the cowl as the engine is raised.

Stage 8 header bolts have also been recommended. Some may need some slight grinding for clearance issues.

Let me know how it goes.

Can you take any digital photos???

Thanks.

 

Sure, I can take digital pics.. but it'll be another couple of weeks before I can install them. I still need to get my Catco cats and have my cutout welded in.

 

Thats funny, since I dont have a driveway and a good back I had SLP install my headers at their Toms River facility and to avoid the steering shaft problem, they dented the headers and got the car back to me THREE days later, says alot for fitment of their "quality" parts and service but hey for $960 total my car is a few thousandths slower and they broke my Made For You wirelooms in the process....

 

Thanks. Just send them to my listed e-mail.

Good luck.

 

Here's some pics of my SLP headers installed.

I had to move the coolant hardline on the passenger's side to get that one in, and the other one required me to move some brake lines out of the way.

Total installation time for headers only: 5 hours. The biggest difficulties I had was that I didn't have a "double ended bolt" short enough to be able to bolt down my dipstick, and I can't get a socket over the #3 and #5 spark plugs anymore.

Here's the driver's side from above. Notice here I'm going to have to grind down the steering shaft because it's too close.

 

Here's the bottom of the driver's side. I like the placement of the O2 sensor.

 

The top of the passenger's side.

 

Notice I have no a/c installed in the previous picture. That probably cut a couple hours off my time right there.

The bottom of the passenger's side. I still need to put the heat shielding hose on that sensor.

 

Thanks Synapsis. Those are great photos.

Why are you going to grind down the steeting shaft?
Iread in previous posts that you can loosen the bolts that hold down the steering column and just move it over.

Did you change your engine mounts?

How difficult was it to get the old manifolds off?

How hard was it to get the dip stick in and out?

Do you just simply bend the break lines with your hands?

Did you raise the engine and get them in from under the car?

What can you do now to get those spark plugs out?? I remember that SLP sells a spark plug remover socket. Must be why!!!

Let me know how it sounds when you are finished. What cat back exhaust are you using?

 

Hi ThirdGenZ28 92,

Sorry to hear the problems. Did you complain to a manager?

If your car is running slower now, sounds like you might be running lean with the extra air flow. You might need a chip to compensate. That is what was recommended to me since I have a 91' TA with 305 which does not use a MAF to tell the ECM that more air is flowing into the engine. I am pretty sure your 92' does not have the MAF either. We have a speed density sensor instead.

Hope things work out.

 

I'm grinding down the steering shaft because it was that close *after* I moved it (it didn't move much.)

I still have the stock engine mounts. Even if new mounts lifted the engine 1/2", the tube would still be close to the steering shaft.

My old manifolds practically fell off. I was missing two bolts on one side, and three bolts on the driver's side were loose. Just unbolted them and lifted them out with one hand.

My dipstick was held down by one manifold bolt, and it just slips out of the block after it's unbolted.

I bent the brake lines *gently* with my hands. I only had to move them 1/4".

I put both headers in from above. On the driver's side I put the rear end in first, and pushed the front end down in. I did have to tug on my power brake booster, and also turn my steering wheel a little. The passenger's side went in easy after unbolting the coolant hardline and pulling it up.

To do the #3 and #5 spark plugs I put a 5/8" open end wrench on it, then stick a screwdriver through the other end of the wrench to turn it. I'm going to cut a spark plug socket in the future to make it easier.

I'm still waiting on my Catco direct-fit cats. I'll be putting a Flowmaster 3" American Thunder cat-back on it, with 3" dual outlets and a cutout on the I pipe for trips to the track.

 

Sounds like it was a cake walk??? :hail:

So how do you grind the steering shaft?

Did you consider a SLP exhaust or the car sound cats???

What is the coolant hard line?? Is is difficult to unbolt and move? Do you lose coolant?

What do you need to do to "cut the socket" ? Is the socket too long or need to be cut in a wedge or something?

Let me know how the rest goes.

Thanks.

 

With my 1 5/8 SLPs and angle plug heads I use a 5/8 wrench to loosen the #3 #5 plug. The other side I have a short 5/8 spark plug socket and 3/4 wrench to turn it on #6. The only one I have to go under the car for.
Great photos by the way.

 

I inquired about their performance guarantee since I can provide similar 60fts and my times were slower, their response was add an AFPR. Thing is on the scan tool Im at 924 mV so Im not lean and nowhere does it say buy these headers for $1k but in conjuction with other aftermarket parts you can gain the 20 HP at the wheels we claim. So far Ive wasted $ on the headers and runners, both made me slower. If they dont do right by me this will be the last $ they see from me, that and they dont make anything for 3rdgens anyway so its no big loss. The AFPR is on so now I have to see how I do but I know its not gonna run 13.3-low13.4x I expected at the least...

 

So will 13.4 be a better time for you.

Hope so. I plan on spending some $$$$ on these headers also and would like to see better performance.

Seems though that SLP vs most any other header will give similar gains (or losses). I like the idea that the SLP is made of stainless steel.

You must have some other tuning issues here.

Let us know how the adj. fuel press. regulator helps out.

What are you running for your cat back???

Anyone elae out there have lower performance problems after adding headers???

 

13.40 would be barely acceptable, I was hoping for 13.30 for my investment. I do have some tuning issues I believe but I still think I should have netted SOMETHING out of the headers. The AFPR is on and the 20th Ill be racing again so Ill let you know how I do. As for the catback I have Catco dual cats and Dynomax catback which sounded horrible so it now has a 2 chambered Flow once again....

 

ThirdGenZ28 92,

What is your current combo? Stock heads and cam, or aftermarket? N/A, Blower, NOS?

If you are expecting 13.30 on stock head/cam car, you may be a little unrealistic. If you have modded the motor, then it may be a tuning issue, as noted before.

 

Hi ThirdGenZ28 92,

Please let us know how things go.

Yea. So you put the flowmasters back on. They sound really sweet.

Hope things go well.

 

Current combo at the time of my 13.521 run is stock internal N/A L98, stock manifolds and rear w/ 3:23s and weighing in at aprox 3700 lbs with driver (I'm 230-235 lbs). Boltons are airfoil, crank pulley, 8.8 wires, MSD-6AL, MAT relocated, K&N in modified air box, Hypertech chip w 160 Tstat, rebuilt 700r4 w/ 2k stall, cooler and shift kit, alum DS, dual Catco cats and Dynomax Cat back but replaced with Flow 2 chamber which doesnt matter since I run thru a cut out after the cats at the track. Then its the usual SFCs, STB, LCAs and adj PHB and I run BFG Drag Radials 255.50/16s and thats it for anything remotely being performance besides the AFPR I just added and maybe new wires for this coming Sat. Maybe 13.30s are expecting too much but I figured if I got that far and I read about how restrictive manifolds can be I figured 13.35-13.40 were obtainable. After that run I removed the AC and added SLP 1 3/4s and went 13.608 on my only comparable run with no MPH change. There is a tuning issue though, it occurs as soon as I hit 3rd gear and it does this in NO other gear (you can hear this in my movies on my webpage if youre interested, kinda sounds like it bogs and recovers). Also the car developed a poor idle 3-4 YEARS ago which would take me two pages to explain all thats been replaced by me, certified mechanics and friends in an attempt to fix it and the car has never thrown ONE code in its life in 6 years that Ive had it. So yeah it has some minor issues, none too bad if it still mustered a 13.52 run but I think or HOPE I can squeeze a little more out of it thru tuning and an aftermarket intake waiting in the wings and maybe some prom work when I can devote some time to it....

 

13.52 is an excellent time with your current set up!! I am hoping to to the same with mine with stock heads/cam.

 

I too had the unexplainable stumble from third for awhile. I replaced my distributor with an MSD unit and all was right in the world. I later tracked it down to a bad pickup coil in the stock distributor. Hope this helps.

 

Thanks for the compliment and for my given knowledge of this hobby Im happy with the results so far but lately its been SLOW going.

A distrib. you say huh?? About 4-5 years ago I had some work done and at the time we came across corroded wires that came off the distrib and since it was a last minute thing we went with a Pep Boys Reman Lifetime Distrib cause its was all that was available and cheap instead of trying to fix and old weather beaten distrib. I thought all distributors were the same basically and since I have had the reman in place I have had the pick up wire AND control module replaced in an effort to fix the problem with no luck but this was some 2 years ago Im betting by now. I wonder if it wouldnt be worth it to go with an aftermarket distrib to can the cheesey Pep Boys one on there now, anyone know of a decent one for a fair price they can recommend, how much was the MSD if you dont mind me asking??

 

You can't go wrong upgrading the distributor. I recommend the Accell billet distributor. They are about $200-$250 from summit.

 

I think it was close to 300 dollars. It is a little pricey, but very good quality. It sounds as if you have gone through your distributor though. I have done some chip tuning on mine which seems to have helped with hesitations I experienced. If you don't mind me asking did you have your chip tuned to correlate with the stall converter. That may give you a slight hesitation if the ECM is trying to lock up coming into third gear. If you need some help tuning the chip I might be able to help.

 

Ive run both the stock chip and the Hypertech with the same results. I know sooner or later I have to bite the bullet and look into prom burning but Im not sure what Im experiencing now is realted to that but I do know its frustrating!!!