RunawayRadio

iTrader: (2)

Hi TGO,

I've been searching the forums for awhile on this one and haven't been able to turn up a definitive answer. Maybe I'm using the wrong terms.

I have an EBL Flash installed in my GTA and have been learning the basics of tuning (VE learns, recommended steps, reading guides, etc). I've seen that a lot of people over the years have been using tunerpro to not only scan their sensor/ECU outputs through the ALDL port in real time, but have been using tunerpro to emulate changes to the tune in real time to see the effects as the engine is running. Once they're satisfied with the tune, a new Prom chip is created and the previous one replaced in the ECU.

Is emulation possible with the EBL Flash over USB? The flash carries over a lot of the old hardware with some modern touches, so it seems like it should be. I'm convinced I'm missing something in the help articles and flash documentation I'm reading, so if it is, could someone point me in the right direction? I'm wondering if it's a simple as pointing tunerpro at the COM port the Flash WUD uses.

Thanks!

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Can't do real time emulation when the calibration is held in Flash memory. Need to take the chip away from running the ECM to flash it, even for a single byte.

RBob.

RunawayRadio

iTrader: (2)

Hmm, ok. There's no need to write new info during the emulation if the ECU is referencing the calibration in tunerpro directly and not the flash chip installed in the EBL. Does that mean that tunerpro will always have to run through the chip regardless on the EBL, which, by design would always have the calibration loaded in memory and preventing direct read access?



Ie., the ECU (EBL) would always reference the calibration written to the flash chip first, rather than tunerpro having direct access to supply alternate values in real time, like during an emulation with a stock prom ECU?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

When you emulate via TP5 there is the need for additional hardware. The ECM doesn't query TP5 for the calibration data, it needs to be there in the ECM ready for the next firmware access to that data.

This is what items such as the Ostrich is for. It replaces the chip with fast random access memory that can be written too while the ECM also reads from it.

RBob.

RunawayRadio

iTrader: (2)

Ok, now I understand. As always, thanks for the help.

For anyone else that turns this up in a thread search: due to its design, the EBL flash cannot support real time emulation for live tuning while the car is running. You will need to use a Moates Osterich or similar emulation hardware that physically replaces the prom chip in your stock ECU and physically write (burn) a new prom chip when the tuning is complete.

luvofjah

iTrader: (2)

The EBL has the 8 banks, where you can load 8 different programs, and quickly switch from one to another... Not quite "on the fly", but close....

Ghettobird52

Curious as to what benefit this would bring?

luvofjah

iTrader: (2)

So you added some hop up parts to your 350...
You want to advance the timing from stock to squeeze a bit more power out of the engine...

Let's say stock is 32....
Bank 1 = 33
Band 2 = 34
Band 3 = 35
Band 4 = 36
Band 5 = 37
Band 6 = 38
Band 7 = 39
Band 8 = 40

Start from bank 1, and run the car...
No knock / detonation? Up to the next bank...
You get to bank 7 and see a lot of knock / detonation...
Back to bank 6....

It's not quite "on the fly" as Ostrich, but very close...
Once you program the banks, you can switch from 1 to another on the fly....

Rafael

Ghettobird52

Ops sorry i meant the OP. but I think i understand what hes trying to do, have the tune change while driving

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

There's really no need for on the fly VE and SA tuning. I mean seriously, the engine takes in a given amount of air, and the density of the air will effect air/fuel, but the ECM has an O2 correction parameter to compensate. The flashed bin itself is as close to stoich as possible, but it still corrects if need be. On the fly changes, to me, is only necessary with boost, meaning if you want more or less, and a simple EBC takes care of that. I can't even find any reasoning to use the banks, as my changes take minutes, if not seconds, regardless.

RunawayRadio

iTrader: (2)

This. It's basically the same thing and ultimately what I'll be doing. I was trying to understand how the flash was built and if it was at all similar to how people were working with the stock GM ECU's. I'm on the right track now .

Ghettobird52

Makes complete sense, kind of why i was confused as i dont see a need either, although i didnt think about FI, which your points make complete sense.

Still think Ebl flash was the best thing i ever did to my third gen.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I run one too, I'm actually getting another one soon for my newest F-Body...

Ghettobird52

I actually bought it twice..... lol Once 6 years ago, then sold it as an idiot because i was a kid. Then i bought it again 2 years ago.... I have been enjoying it nonstop since!

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Emulation? Makes it much easier to dial in idle and part throttle. You can immediately watch your changes.

-- Joe

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

When you have nearly stock motor, and you are supplied a nearly stock bin then sure.

But heck, even on a slow 500hp motor when I've swapped intake manifolds I had to do a tremendous amount of VE tuning, and if I had to pull over and flash every change I'd have driven myself mad.

One of the best things I ever bought back in the day was an Ostrich when they first came out.

Having a driver and a realtime tuning system is very valuable IMO, at least when you have a hot build and change parts often.

-- Joe