Z28FAST1

Got bored of my 11 sec N/A set up and I've always wanted to go turbo.

Went from:

2001 LS1(under 30K miles)
Patriot stage 2 heads (Approx 11.1 compression)
TR 224/224 .563/.563 114
LS6 intake manifold
Pushing a little over 400rwhp/400rwtq

Sold SSW headers, y-pipe, cold air intake, 42 lb injectors, 85 mm maf, firecore50 spark plug wires, 1 bar map sensor.

Installed front facing headers, china turbo, tial 44 wastegate, china bov and intercooler, 80 lb injectors, msd custom length wires, gm 2 bar sensor, threaded IAT, vented catch can(10an), 2 bar OS on hp tuners running a blend of E85 and 91.

Currently on the 4~ lb spring til I install a walbro 450 and fuel pressure regulator.




I think it'll need a th400 to go 9s but for now I'll enjoy 8-10 lbs of boost with a 6 speed.

86CamaroDan

11.1:1 CR!?!?! 0_0

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Low boost on e85 with a cam, 11:1 isnt terrible


What turbo? Its nice to see a completed build lol looking forward to track times

Z28FAST1

It's the smaller 76/65 China turbo. I want to see what kind of power it makes at 12-14 psi on E85.
I'm doing my own tuning so baby steps.


I have a forged ls1 that I'll be building while I experiment.

I've been experimenting with E50(91 and e85 mixed). Running it richer seems to have slowed down spool compared to my 91 octane tune. What's an ideal afr to shoot for on low boost(6-8psi)?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Small turbine i bet that comes on quick! My 305 spooled a 70/65 on a rear mount fairly quick, i cant imagine a built ls1.

Good thing is if you decide to want more power when that maxes out, the billet 78/75 on3 has will drop in basically

Low boost like that intercooled with e85 mix i would go closer to 12:1. I've run leaner on gas that low but i had a boost built motor at 9:1 comp and air water cooling.
Normally if not pushing to the max i would stay high 11's afr on pump gas up to 15 ish psi. Lower 11's above that but all can depend

Z28FAST1

I've had my eye on that billet 78/75. They seem to make more power than my SBE LS can handle.

I kept getting feedback to run it richer but I agree with you on low 12's as a sweet spot. 11.6 seemed to drown the car out of boost and while spooling.

The walbro 255 is maxed out after 4800 rpm and start to go lean on E50. Here's a quick spool video taken by a buddy in his bolt-on 5th gen SS.


Low boost, shifting at 5k.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

6-8 psi isnt alot of boost and with low intake air temps you really dont need to go super rich yet.

I slowly ramp air fuel down as boost rises and keep timing in as much as i can until turbos start to really sing and make boost. The higher timing as it builds 1-3 psi helps light the turbos up

Z28FAST1

Added the walbro 450, turned up the manual boost controller.


Should I be concerned with the injector duty cycle at this low boost(deka 80 lbs)?



Fun to drive but I think the set-up might like 3.42s gears over the current 3.73s.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Lol naw it really isnt a problem til it reads over 100%

But you will need more when you give it more boost

Z28FAST1

Think they'll suffice for 12-14 psi?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Sneak up on it but on e50 blend, it might get 12 psi at 100% cycle duty

zz17iroc

iTrader: (4)

Don't forget about the timing! The timing looks to be a little on the high side even for 6.5 PSI on a stock LS1. LSX has very efficient 15 degree heads as you already know and does not need a lot of timing, on some stock and NA tunes I've seen anywhere from 24*-28* of timing. I good rule of thumb for timing is to remove 1.5*-2* of timing per 1lbs of boost to be on the safe side even on E85, 91 oct mix. Gen III LS1 pistons from 97' to 04' are a weaker design when compared to Gen IV LS2 and are known to break ring lands especially if you have factory ring gaps under boost. BE VERY CAREFULL just because you don't see or hear knock, that doesn't mean the cylinders are not getting to hot and rings are not butting together. You can melt a piston quick, especially those hypereutectic pistons.

Other than that I agree with Orr89Rocz and the car sounds amazing. Happy tuning my friend.

Z28FAST1

I read 1 degree per lb of boost? The general rule of thumb among the LS community has been 15 degrees at peak torque at 15 psi with crappy 91 octane.

My previously dyno tuned N/A set up was liking 26 degrees @ peak torque(4400-4800 rpm). I pulled 6 degrees even though I know the E85 blend(closer to e60) allowed for a little more timing. Need to read the plugs.





On a positive note. I was having a weird spooling issue. The turbo behaved like a big turbo, spooled for a few seconds then completely lit up like a 2 stroke. Thought it was the wastegate opening early or maybe the turbo.

Turns out the BOV springs was too weak and opening up under transition boost. I re-springed and now the car is a different animal. I have full boost before going WOT and spins the drag radials at 2,000 rpm in 2nd

zz17iroc

iTrader: (4)

Just be mindful of the stoke ring gap and ring butt. That boost can be very addicting, you'll always want more.

Jay_rich

iTrader: (4)

Im currently 13psi around 13-14 degree's zero issues. Was like this the last 2 seasons. Standard Pump 91 octane. Keeping it a tad on the save side for hot days. I may get a bit more greedy now that I switched to MS3-pro and should be getting a bit better traction with my new tire setup.

Nice setup, been one of my favorite TGO cars for some time.

Jay

Z28FAST1

Yeah I've found several builds boosting 20 lbs on 20 degrees while on E85.
From yellowbullet on E85, afr and timing:


Put 6 degrees in the main table.

Time the thing like it IS n/a when its not in boost... because it IS N/a....

Leave all the timing in till 6-7 psi..

Make sure youve got a 7 heat range plug in it gapped no bigger than. .024.

Initially target .74 lambda... then work the tune back to about .77.... i dont know what those are in afr numbers.

Dont bother pulling timing out with the IAT table till 140. E85 can take a little heat. Scale it up to pull 6 @ 200.

Set the wastegates to 10 psi and make some hits and work it up from there.

At that boost you could be running 28 degrees of timing and not hurt it... so start there.
-LJMS







Speaking of traction, what tire set up are you going with? My 305/35/18 nitto drags are not cutting it.

Blew the tires off at 50-60 mph in 3rd gear, then to my surprise, spun them again at around 100mph in 4th

zz17iroc

iTrader: (4)

It feels good to have that Beast mode don't it? LOL

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

My buddy's ls setup is around 22 deg on 22-23 psi on e85. Makes near 1400 wheel

You need to go to a 15" wheel with 275-315 sized radial for that power

Although mickey et street s/s in 18" sizes should do better than the nittos. You on 555r or nt05r? I ran the mickey 305/35/19 tires on my street wheels and they hook good to about 800 whp in high gear. High rolls. Slower 40 mph 2nd gear stuff, 700 whp is about it

Z28FAST1

Good to know my timing is pretty conservative. Having a harder time getting some consistent data with all the tire spin.



I'm looking the Toyo TQ drag radials to replace the 555R's in the same size. My brother runs them on his H/C LS Iroc pushing over 460-480 N/A. I know he still gets some wheels spin in 2nd gear so maybe I'll borrow them.


Also looking at the MT street S/S. If I get 7-10K miles out of the MT I'll go that route since I don't drive it in the rain.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Nt05r are also much better than the 555r. The new dodge demon i believe is on the nt05r

Z28FAST1

Making some progress. Increased trap by 5 mph with 6 lbs and some lazy shifting. No front runners and pretty much street weight(no weight removed)


1st run I dead hooked/bogged launching at 3500 rpm 2 lbs off the line.

2nd run bumped 2 step up to 4500 but spun. Ran it out granny shifting and still got kicked out. Didn't get a chance to turn it up.

I wanted 6.80s but I'll settle for a decent trap speed.

zz17iroc

iTrader: (4)

Looking good man, that joker is moving.

Z28FAST1

Went to the track again.

Drove it there in the summer heat, swapped the slicks, ran 6.9@101 got the boot and enjoyed the races the rest of the night. Only difference was a better 60 ft and more aggressive 1-2, 2-3 shifts.


Hoping that by upgrading to 28 inch slicks and clicking the boost to 10 lbs will get me 6.50s@105mph~

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Thats in the mid 10's so far. Or so. Getting down pretty good

Bullydawg

iTrader: (7)

I have a pretty similar NA build and wanted to do the LSA supercharger, but I am worried about the 11 to 1 compression with 91... Is E50/85 a must at this point?

Z28FAST1

LSA on an cathedral Ls1?

Regarding 11.1 boost and 91 octance. If you plan to run any decent amount of boost it would be smart to install meth or go e85.

91 octane would limit your timing advance. 1 degree might be worth 15-20 hp.

Bullydawg

iTrader: (7)

There is a company who makes an entire kit with square port to cathedral adapters, along with 6 rib pulley at proper length for $3500... then again I just want my car to run as hard as your NA setup. Your car was/is just nasty man. Watch your YouTube kills all the time.

Z28FAST1

That would be pretty sweet. Benefit of high compression is that it makes more power at lower boost levels. Which in turn also reduces the possibility of belt slip.

I can see 500+rwhp on 91 safely and 600+on e85.

Easy 10 sec car if you have the rear end, clutch and tires for it.

Z28FAST1

Right lane. Wanted 6.5@110 but lane waiting time was over 2 hrs.





I'll post slip in a bit

Z28FAST1

I think it would have gone 6.5s with more aggressive shifts but since I don't have a cage I only get one pass.


Swapping in forged rods and pistons, extra fuel pump, a larger turbo, and most likely a cage.


What cage can I go with while still being able to easily get in and out of the car?

Jay_rich

iTrader: (4)

Car is movin pretty good!

Jay

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Any 10 pt with swing outs would do

Z28FAST1

Thanks.

Not bad for being a less than ideal combo.


Been looking at Wolf and Midwest.




Also wondering how much more abuse my moser 12 bolt w/33 spline axels and truetrack can take. Will going from 26 to a 28 inch tire get me to a 1.3x 60 foot? Will I start breaking parts?


So tempting specially since they fill in the fenders so well on my brother's car:

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

As with anything, could break at anytime. Thats racing lol but to be honest thats the same rear i have been using and been many many 1.3 60's with a best of 1.28. At 3750 lbs. its held 1200 whp. But i am sure its on borrowed time. Axles likely twisted but i dont wanna check. My friend has a 7 sec trans am who ran a spool with 33 splines. He would go thru a ring gear every season it seemed like but he was doing 1.2's consistently. Axles did twist some but never broke

I like a 28" tire

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

That's how it is up here. Justin's track let's him run 8s in a car certified for 10s (by NHRA standards). That doesn't fly up here. 1 pass, you get thrown out until you rectify the safety. Do it again and you are banned for the year.

-- Joe

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Just an fyi they dont let this go anymore

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

So what's your plan moving forward?

-- Joe

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Same as its always been

Z28FAST1

Yup, have some decisions to make. I really like how the car performances for a full weight street car with a 6 speed driven to the track. Only complain is traction on street tires.




BTW, the Dodge Demon ran at my track. Would have been nice to line up with it. Would have been a good race.




Making it look easy. 91 octance tune.