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Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

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Old 12-03-2012, 09:21 PM
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Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

(car 1987 IROC 5.7L)

I bought these long tubes brand new for my car. They came coated, with gaskets and instructions etc.. They stayed in the box untouched for years Recently I began to install them and had nothing but problems. Fitment and clearance issues galore

After wasting 4 or 5 weekends working on this car I finally gave up and paid ($60) to have it towed to the local auto mechanic shop. My family has done business with this shop for years. They quoted me a price of $425 to put the car back together. 3 days later I get a call from the shop stating they couldn't get these headers to fit. I suggested putting a dimple in them so they could make them fit. They said they were familiar with that, but the clearance issue was way beyond that. When I asked what the solution would be, they said "buy some headers that will fit this car".

I contacted the company I thought them for. Their records only go back 2 years. So there is nothing they could do for me. I contacted Hedman.... this is where I lost all respect for this company

I told them the entire story. Including how my wife, kids, house and car are 75 miles from where i work/live. Im military and only see my family on the weekends. My time is valuable. I had already blown countless weekends working on my car. I spent all this time and money and their hedders didnt fit. They asked a bunch of questions. What year is the car, part number to headers, engine size, stock heads or after market, where are the headers hitting etc. I answered all that I could which was most then gave them the number to the shop.

When I talked to the shop afterwards. He said that Hedman asked them essentially the same questions they asked me. Then insinuated...this is what I find funny. That maybe these mechanics simply didn't know how to install the headers properly!

I gave them the part number to the headers. The part number comes back as the correct full length headers for my IROC. I told them i had the box and everything that came with it. They wanted the receipt. This, I can not locate as its been years

What made me mad was that Hedman suggests..."shorties" after all the back and forth conversations we had about the long tubes not fitting. My car is stock. So them suggesting that is like saying "well, sorry our headers don't work...wanna try another one of our products?"

No thank you. I ordered Hooker long tubes. I am now having to sell their headers on craigslist and will take a major loss on all of this. Don't deal with Hedman
Old 12-03-2012, 09:55 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Crappy lesson to learn.

But learn from this!
Keep reciepts! (I have reciepts for everything I buy, got reciepts from 10yrs ago)
Old 12-03-2012, 09:58 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Im sure if it wasnt over 2 years that they were purchased you would have had the return. Its not all on them.
Old 12-03-2012, 10:22 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

sounds like you need to find a better shop, unless the headers were a REALLY defective set. Any pictures of the issues?
Old 12-03-2012, 10:45 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I've had Hedman fit issues going back to the '70's.

'69 Mach 1 w/302; floorboard interference issues. After trying two different P/N's had to pound the bottom of the floor board into the interior to get them to fit. I didn't want to do this but my buddy insisted.

'68 Firebird w/350 (Pontiac) would not clear steering shaft/gear. Exchanged for Blackjacks (not owned by Dynomax) same issue.

'66 Mustang w/289; floorboard interference. Screw it.
Old 12-03-2012, 10:49 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I had Hedman LT's that didn't fit either. They hit the K-member. More than likely, it was because my motor mounts had over 200K on them. I'll never know, I got new motor mounts and shorty headers.
Old 12-15-2012, 06:18 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Hey Blackgloves. Unfortunately, ANY set of longtube headers for a 3rd gen f-body are a PITA to install. You're definitely on the right track by switching to Hookers though. I can understand why they recommended going to a set of "shorties", since almost all shorties are pretty much a direct bolt-in. The Hooker longtubes (part# 2210) are the most common ones you see on 3rd gens. However, even those sometimes require you to cut a small notch in certain parts of the k-member to get them to fit good. You'd probably be better off getting a set of shorties. I'd recommend either Hooker 2055's or a set of Dyno Don's 1-3/4" shorties. Quite honestly, you really don't need the longtubes unless you're getting up into the 450-500 horsepower area. I'm running the Hooker 2055's with a Super-rammed 355 w/AFR aluminum heads, and they easily flow more than enough on mine. Of course you need ot make sure and round out the exhaust combo with a good, aftermarket 3" catback exhaust system. The Hooker Aerochamber catback comes highly recommended. I'm running the Edelbrock 3" RPM series catback, and have been very happy with the flow and sound of it. But yeah, longtubes really only apply if you're putting together a 3rd gen to dominate the 1/4 mile with. Another headache with longtubes is your ground clearance is VERY minimal. If you're dead set on longtubes though, expect to do some minor cutting on the k-member, and possibly having to dent the header tube that runs right next to the steering box and brake lines. You're correct in wanting to ditch the Hedmans though. The Hookers, whether longtube or shorty style are FAR superior to Hedman. Also, stay away from Flowtech and Edelbrock headers. The Flowtechs have smaller primary tubes and a measly 2.5" collector. One of the downsides to the Edelbrock TES headers is they use a "donut" style gasket at the collector, which are notorious for blowing, or burning out. That's another BIG plus to the Hooker 2055's and Dyno Don's headers. The collector flange is a ball-socket type, which doesn't use ANY type of gasket at the collectors. You might want to jump over to the exhaust forum on here and read the stickies at the top of the page. There's an excellent article there that explains the pros and cons of just about every header made for our 3rd gens. Btw, if you decide on a good set of shorties, Dyno Don's 1-3/4" shorties are probably the best flowing. SLP made 1-3/4 shorties too, but they've been out of production for so long, it can be a chore locating a set of them. One other thing, do NOT order the Hooker 2460 shorties. They don't come with a matching y-pipe, so you have to get one fabricated at an exhaust shop. They also use the common, flat, 3 bolt collector flange, which means problems with burnt-out collector gaskets again.

Last edited by Pat Hall; 12-15-2012 at 06:23 AM.
Old 12-15-2012, 12:45 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

What part number were they?
Old 12-15-2012, 01:01 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Hooker 2460's do have a y pipe. # 16767 I use dead soft aluminum collector gaskets no leaks

Last edited by kauboy; 12-15-2012 at 01:07 PM.
Old 12-15-2012, 01:43 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I have hedman long tubes on my 82 Z28. It was a long time ago that I installed them but they did fit. If I remember correctly we put them at the same time we installed the engine (so removing the motor may be a requirement).
Old 12-15-2012, 01:45 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I love my hedman long tubes. From reading the Hooker 2210 install sticky, the Hedmans seem to go in a lot easier than the hookers do.

You have to trim a small piece off the A-arm perch, and dimple one primary near the steering box and that's pretty much it. The passenger side is super easy. Only thing about the passenger side is its a little tricky to figure out how it goes in there but once you get it, it's a piece of cake.

Did it with the engine in the car, just needed to pull the crossmember to raise and lower the angle of the engine. But it's about as painless as a long tube install can be as far as I can tell. Although I know those super nice stainless works LS swap headers truly do fit in with NO mods at all.
Old 12-15-2012, 02:44 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I bought a car with headman on it and they are long tube they took out the 305 and swapped it with a 350 but the headers are smashed a little bit near the drivers wheel Well don't know how or why and mine aren't coated they are rusted and I have been having problems with gasket leaks so I will be replacing as soon as I get the transmission fixed
Old 12-15-2012, 02:50 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

The Thing Is You Shouldn't Have To Trim,Cut ,Dimple,Dent Anything To Get The Headers To Fit,If The Header Manufacturers Can't Design Headers To Fit 3rd Gens Correctly ,They Shouldn't Make Them.
Old 12-15-2012, 02:55 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Originally Posted by gt4373
The Thing Is You Shouldn't Have To Trim,Cut ,Dimple,Dent Anything To Get The Headers To Fit,If The Header Manufacturers Can't Design Headers To Fit 3rd Gens Correctly ,They Shouldn't Make Them.
Not many headers out there for any car that doesn't take some dimpling to fit.

There is a lot a variation from car to car, esp when we are talking 20+ year old cars that manufactures can't account for.

Something as simple as the motor mounts can make or break a header install. New stock mounts, vs worn vs poly vs steel all can make the slightest change that can cause interference.

Try getting good fitting headers for a 1955 chevy with a big block, a combo thats been around for 40 years! Trust me, no one makes a great fit, I've tired about 5 different sets.
Old 12-15-2012, 05:04 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

BTW, I just got the Jegs Coated Shorties on my Camaro and they are very nice. Part #555-300105. Only $310. The O2 hole is even already drilled. They are the same design as the Dyno Don's as Jegs says to use the DD Y-pipe. I just made my own Y-pipe though.
Old 12-15-2012, 08:55 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I had to do a little dimpling on mine to make them fit. overall I wouldn't say that they fit terribly. I'm hoping that they don't take much further modification once I put my moroso engine mounts in
Old 12-15-2012, 11:41 PM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Originally Posted by gt4373
The Thing Is You Shouldn't Have To Trim,Cut ,Dimple,Dent Anything To Get The Headers To Fit,If The Header Manufacturers Can't Design Headers To Fit 3rd Gens Correctly ,They Shouldn't Make Them.
These headers are less than $200... for the money they're fantastic. Not the best option for ground clearance but if you gotta go long tubes and you dont need 1.75 inch primaries its hard to go wrong with the hedmans.

This is all in regards to the Hooker LT's. Looks like all the same issues to me.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/exha...oker-long.html

Installation Notes:
1) If the motor and tranny are in the car the headers will slip in from underneath the car. If the motor is out of the car then you will need to lay/tie the headers to the fenderwell as you drop the motor in. The motor will not drop in with the headers attached.
2) You'll need a ministarter or an LT1 starter.
3) I relocated the knock sensor to the driver's side because there is more clearance there.
4) I had to grind on the front driver's side part of the k-member where the a-arm attaches (front corner) to ensure I wouldn't get any rattles there. Very minor clearancing – probably not even necessary but I wanted to be sure. Click HERE to see the minor clearancing.
5) I had to grind on the passenger side of the k-member where the LT was touching. Primary tube #8 was touching the K-Member here. This had to be clearanced for my application. Click HERE to see the problem.

6) The driver's side header demands that you jack the engine up in order to slip the header in from the bottom. You’ll have to remove the oil sending unit and the filter.
7) The passenger side header slips in with no jacking of the motor (starter removed).
8) To install the headers you want to point the collectors STRAIGHT down at the ground and rotate into place.
9) You need to install the starter while installing the passenger header - it’s the only way. I was able to do this by myself but two people would have made it easier.
10) I used Permatex Copper RTV around the slip tube (ala MAFB).
11) You can't run the stock oil cooler with these headers - it needs to be removed or modified. Rick Lindstedt modified his and made it functional (Skweezn87).
12) You have 2 options with regard to the oxygen sensor. If you are getting a Mufflex Y-pipe then you can order it with O2 sensor bungs. Problem solved. If you have a custom Y-pipe or if you want to put it in the header then the oxygen sensor bung should go on the driver's side TOP of the collector - not the side. There’s more clearance on the top. Get it welded in before you get the headers coated. Definitely consider using a heated O2 sensor. Part numbers and info on this can be found by using the search. I’m using a ’92 Corvette ZR1 heated O2 (bosch 13077). Click HERE to see how the O2 sensor is installed.
13) If you are going to run the Mufflex TPI-Y pipe for the hooker 2210’s (Part Number TPI-Y or TPI-Y O2 available from Mufflex Performance) then be prepared that it will most likely not ‘bolt-in’. I have to take the car to a local speed shop to have them chop up and reweld it. The passenger side hit the passenger side frame rail. The driver’s side didn’t hit anything but tucked up way too close to the stock Torque Arm mount.
14) If you are mating a Mufflex Y to a 3" catback then you will need a 4"-to-3" adapter.
15) No matter what - do not expect to bolt-up the mufflex y-pipe to the I-pipe of your catback. You will need to separate your I-pipe from the converter (or from the bend that goes to the manifold y-pipe if you don't have a converter). You'll then need to either shorten or lengthen your I-pipe to the correct length to mate to the mufflex y-pipe. If you are using the 4"-to-3" adapter then you can expect to expand the entry into your I-pipe so that the y-pipe 4"-to-3" adapter can fit into it. My personal experience shows that a flowmaster force II catback for a dual cat car requires an extra section of 3" pipe since the Mufflex y-pipe is about a foot away from that system's I-pipe (because the after-cat special flowmaster y-pipe from this system is no longer used).
16) Consider Installing some ES poly engine mounts or new engine mounts before taking on this project. The last thing you want is to get everything installed and then replace your motor mounts at a later date and realize there are interference problems. It's easier to deal with these interference problems during the install. NOTE that my installation of the ES Poly engine mounts may have been why I had to do a little bit of extra clearancing. But, this only a possible explanation - it has not been proven.
17) I pulled all the wiring that wrapped around the bottom of the driver's side oil pan and reworked it - not necessary but this will ensure you don't toast any of the wires on the long tubes.
18) The 2210’s have great clearance with L98 angle plugs (my experience) and regular angle plugs (Rick Lindstedt's experience) when using 90 degree spark plug boots. Straight plugs will have a clearance problem with plug #7 (Phil87IROC's experience). To fix the problem with the #7 plug Phil made a shorty plug. To see Phil's pictures click HERE.
19) Be careful when running the positive battery cable to the starter. The passenger primary tubes tuck up pretty close. I used the stock bracket that bolts to the block to secure the cables and ordered some Fire Sleeve from Summit to ensure the wires are protected.
20) I used a Lokar engine dipstick (ED5001). Very expensive but works great for this application. With the LTs there is nowhere to mount the dipstick.
The small place you have to trim with the Hedmans is definitely not a big deal, and the dimple isnt a huge deal either to me. Very rare to find headers that fit perfect. The only ones Im aware of for thirdgens that fit perfect are the LS swap headers.
Old 12-16-2012, 03:51 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I used Hooker Longtubes and they went in, in 30 minutes. no cutting etc.
Old 12-16-2012, 09:00 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

My Hedman LTs slip in easy coming in from the bottom with the starter removed. This is also with new motor mounts tho. But I have experienced the wrong part in the right box from Hedman tho.
Old 12-16-2012, 09:24 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Mine went in with just a little trimming of the a-arm mount. Found it wasnt even necessary when i put in new motor mounts.
Old 12-19-2012, 12:16 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I had hedman long tubes, switched to hooker shorties, the fit was obviously better because they are shorties, but the hookers are just made better. thicker flanges, niether were coated and the hookers are still black not rust, and they pinch the tubes to make intsalling header bolts alot easier.
Old 12-19-2012, 01:33 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

I had hedman D-port long tubes in my car with an LT1, solid mounts, and tubular k-member and they fit perfectly. I guess I am the exception. I installed mine from the top as well but the starter had to be removed.

Edit to add: They didn't start rusting until winter came but I had sprayed them with high-temp paint.
Old 12-19-2012, 07:53 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

When I installed hedmen LTs on my tpi350 in my gta I made sure to order new polyurethane motor mounts and installed those before the headers and didn't have any problems. They were still a tight squeeze and with stock motor mounts you're going to have some trouble. They're decent performing headers and come ceramic coated which is nice, I think they get more hate than they really deserve.

Last edited by pg29; 12-19-2012 at 07:58 AM.
Old 12-19-2012, 09:28 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Out of all the brand names we used at the Chevy engine plant Tonn,NY dyno rm,Hedmen's was the only ones who didn't burn out.Hookers where the worst.
Old 12-19-2012, 09:52 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Still waiting for the OP to give us the part number of the ones he had problems with.
Old 12-23-2012, 06:46 AM
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Re: Hedman Hedders (dont buy)

Originally Posted by kauboy
Hooker 2460's do have a y pipe. # 16767 I use dead soft aluminum collector gaskets no leaks
Yeah, I knew there was actually a y-pipe made for them, but it can be hard to find, and I sure as heck couldn't remember the part# of the top of my head! Oh yeah, and you're totally on track with the "dead-soft" aluminum gaskets. Since I've got Hooker 2055's with the ball flange collectors, I don't need any gasket for the collectors, but for where the header meets up with the exhaust ports on the heads, I used the Percy's multi-layered aluminum gaskets on the head ports, and they're definitely the cat's meow! In fact, I just used standard header bolts instead of the Stage 8 locking ones, had them on for over 2 years now, and I haven't even had to re-tighten them a single time since the install. That's the first set of headers I've had on ANY car that I've been able to go this long without having to re-tighten the bolts!

Last edited by Pat Hall; 12-23-2012 at 06:50 AM.
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