BC GTA

This is addressed to everyone in British Columbia. Should ICBC be privatized? Do you have private auto insurance above the basic with ICBC? This could be a real issue after the next provincial election next May.

Apeiron

ICBC is a far better insurance company to deal with than any private company I've dealt with in Alberta.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Even though it's turning to **** with all the changes the current government has done, it's still better then having it privatized I think. My cousin lives in ontario and I see what he has to go threw.

BC GTA

I have a private insurance company (HSBC Canadian Direct) above the basic ICBC auto insurance. This private company has treated me very well and their rates for comparable insurance (collision and comprehensive) are slightly better than ICBC. However, there are suggestions that if we went to private auto insurance for basic our insurance rates in BC would sky rocket. By this time next year we will probably be hearing about it.

Apeiron

Have you ever tried to deal with another driver's insurance company when they were at fault for an accident? Considering it's in their best interest to deny responsibility, it's a nightmare getting anything out of them. When everyone is insured by the same provider, there's no finger-pointing, they have to pay out one way or the other and things are much more equitable.

BC GTA

Liability for accidents is often (but not always) determined by "rules of the road" and common practice in my experinence with accidents. But then I must admit I have had very few at fault accidents over the years. Although, I have had people hit me. The right hand rule and hitting someone from behind are two such examples of determining who is at fault. Then there are witness statements. The reports of police summoned to the scene will be another factor in determining liability. However, it does occur that in some cases some less than reputable insurance companies will attempt to weasle out of paying claims. The times when people have hit me I looked for witnesses, summoned the police, immediately record the paticulars of the accident, obtained the other drivers information etc. All this has helped later on to determine liability. I know emotions are running wild after an accident but the more you do to protect your interests the better off you will be.

Edmonchuck

Point taken, but in the accidents I've been in (thankfully not my fault), once the police rule, the insurance company has no choice but to pay out. Whether it be the Co-Operators, Wawanesa, Western Union, or whomever, I've got my money.

The private insurance debacle here in Alberta is more than just trying to get the companies to pay out, but to also start worrying about the litigations going on over whiplash and other soft tissue injuries, 1-800-rip-me-off crooks going after anything and everything just to pad their books (and even making up injuries along the way), the costs incurred by companies investigating fraud, and of course a general lack of regulation over this industry here in AB.

I do not argue private companies having the ability to sell me insurance, but if the government MANDATES that I need this coverage ($3,200 fine for no insurance), then they should ENSURE that all citizens can afford that basic coverage - aka regulate PLPD fees. ICBC in a way addresses this issue, but it could be argued that rates could be lower if there were competition – or at least similar under regulation and one could compete on service.

Apeiron

Perhaps, but the argument then would be that if your driving record is atrocious enough that you can't afford PLPD, then you shouldn't be driving anyway.

BC GTA

British Columbia has had public auto insurance since the early 1970's when the NDP government of the day nationalized auto insurance. By the 1980's the right wing governments began slowly to chip away at public auto insurance. Then in the 1990's it was decided to permit anything above basic to be provided by either ICBC or private auto insurance company. I have heard from people who work for ICBC the drivers with the best driving record go to private insurance for slightly lower rates which leaves ICBC with poor dirvers to insure. I am not aware with what has been happening in Alberta so I can not comment. I did work for two years in the BC Motor Vehicle Branch and heard Alberta privatized it's driver examiner function which has had some problems. Yes, usually competition is a good thing and usually reduces prices. However, private companies whole reason for being is to make money and the more the better. ICBC is mandated I believe to break even and it puts money but into road improvements and funds drunk driving road checks and other such initatives. I think your insurance rates should be a function of your driving record to make drivers with poor records pay more. I think in all provinces drivers must carry a basic amount of insurance or risk a criminal conviction. I think Quebec was the last province to have voluntary autoinsurance up until the early 1970's.

Edmonchuck

Interesting points BC GTA. When the driver's examiners offices were privatized, I actually found it EASIER to get things done here in Alberta. When I had to get my WA state DL, well, it was a PITA. So, in my humble experience, privatized = better. That is just MY experience.

I do believe that you are correct in saying that ALL provinces now have mandatory liability insurance coverage.

As for funding drunk driving checks and others, well, that is just thawing around funny money as far as an expense or a favor by the government is concerned. Cities, the provinces, and other levels of government fund this in every province. So a government-owned and run insurance company finding these initiatives is simply the government funding these initiatives through its revenue streams. I wouldn’t herald this as an added "bonus" of state-run insurance.

However, the comment about the “two-tiered” insurance system leaving ICBC with the “less” skilled drivers is a point that needs to be considered. If my public system is being drained by poor drivers, one must take a look at this and ask why.

Edmonchuck

I agree with driving being a privilege rather than a right, and if your driving record is so atrocious that you cannot afford PLPD then you are financially banned from driving is a possible solution....

HOWEVER... (you knew that was coming )

Alberta has a definite lack of good, frequent, mass transit options. Plus, our cities out here are designed around HAVING a car. This is what helps "justify" those with suspended licenses driving - they simply have no other option in their minds. Sure, some are selfish little a-holes that cannot see that their actions get them where they are and that they need to find other options as a result, but there are some that simply NEED a vehicle - especially outside Edmonton and Calgary - or if your job is outside these metros.

I would like to see drivers with that bad of a record taken off the road and told that they need to move to a place where they can get transit options, or told that they will have to ensure they have travel options because if they are caught, say bye bye ever driving again. However, I think that both you and I can already hear the whining uproar from that...

BC GTA

I cannot comment on whether privatized driver examiner services are better or not so I will take your word for it. I did hear about some fraud (i.e. private companies passing drivers for money who would not otherwise get their driver's license) in Alberta. However, I cannot comment if it was wide spread. I doubt it. Driving is a privilege not a right. If you have so many accidents that your insurance is prohibitive, then learn to drive safer for everyone’s sake. Often by that time your license is suspended or close to it. If you can afford a car then you should be able to afford the basic auto insurance and if you can’t then you simple cannot afford to own a vehicle. Insurance is just another cost of owning a car like maintenance, gas, etc. Philosophically, I do not believe governments should be in the automobile insurance business. However, I have heard rates are higher in the private sector, though I do not have any evidence to corroborate this. In BC we may find out if a state run monopoly mandated to break even could produce lower rates that the free market system with competition to keep rates down. I believe BC and Saskatchewan are the only provinces/states in North American to have public auto insurance. The money ICBC puts into road works and drunk driving initiatives is probably only a small percentage of the total funds spend on these programs. I understand private auto insures do this also, but probably less that what ICBC does, but I do not know this for a fact.