megaracerx

anyone know any site that shows you how to do it??

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

are you talking about your stock CC-qjet, non CC q-jet, or other?

megaracerx

ok, call me retarded....but what is the difference?


the carb i wanna try and tune is the original 4bb off a 1979 301 pontiac engine....

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

You are retarded. (you asked !)

Well I only know how to tune a non-cc qjet, others, Like holley would be different... Same basic idea, but the screws and whatnot are in different places... So i'll assume you don't know much about carbs, and we'll start from there ok?

This is most likely a non-cc q-jet I think...
It's being put on a thirdgen though right?

basically you set your idle speed on the drivers side with the screw, use the two screws in the base to set idle mixture (use needle nose pliers to turn those screws..), set for max vacuum, and on the left side is your fast idle.
I have a really great article on this written by a pro-corvette tuner, who goes right into jet/rod changes, effects etc... I can send it to you if you want.... -J

megaracerx

i know nothing about carbs...

and of course its going on my thirdgen

i think i might need to just replace the carb entirely..

send me that article through a PM, or email it to me

onemeanLG4@aol.com

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

There, I fired off 3 articles about the Q-jet...
Well if it's rebuildable, that's always a good idea, for under $50 you could have a really good carb... I'm a firm believer in the Q-jet (even after all the trouble i'm having rebuilding one now...)
But they are very customizable, and easy to find parts for, and quite underrated by the aftermarket carb crowd.

If you have any more questions, feel free to ask, i'm in the process of rebuilding my Q-jet right now, and trying to find a fuel leak.... -J

megaracerx

another question,

do you know of any diagrams shows the varios parts of a q-jet?

the problem i'm have is when the throttle is pushed the butter-fly doesnt move

would a rebuild do anything for that?

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

none of the butterflys move, or the primaries but not the secondaries?
*Just to clarify, you're talking the butterflies looking from the underside, not the top right?*
If none, then you'll have to see what part is broken, if just not the secondaries...
Look for the lockout tab, around #62 in that picture I sent you.
mine did that too, even without the lockout tab... It kinda self corrected, after I rebuilt it, something had stuck somewhere, I just kept twisting the throttle linkage, something clicked, and the secondaries started opening
no idea why.... -J

megaracerx

the carb is still on the car...so from the top is what i'm seeing..

i'll take the carb off tomorrow or during the weekend and fin out whats going on...


remember...i know nothing about carbs...so this is going to be a real learning experience..

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

oh ok. From the underside, the round flaps are called the butterflies. from the top they are air valves. Those shouldn't open with throttle, they go by vacuum.

Search some old posts, you'll learn a lot, maybe just searching by my name , maybe 90% of my 40 posts or so were related to Q-jets....

Yea it's definately a good learning experience, i'm on my 3rd rebuild or so, still trying to get it to work... (other circumstances though, it shouldn't take more than 1 or 2 to figure it out...) -J

megaracerx

i guess that what i get from listening to ppl who dont know anything...lol..


thanks for clarifying thing for me though..i'm sure i'll be bugging you all weekend..

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

ok, so if you're taking the carb off, i'll give you tips on my car, if yours is the same, awesome, otherwise, well it may help, and this is gonna be long, so hopefully this will help someone in the future too...

You will probably have the fuel line on the front side coming in from the passenger side. It's a 5/8" line nut, they say you need two wrenchs to avoid bending the fuel line, if it's tight, sure, I haven't lately... loosen that (paper towel below to avoid a bit of fuel leaking). Probably a few vacuum lines on the front there (masking tape and a sharpie will help you remember where they go later). on the back of the carb is another metal line, vacuum brake booster, also 5/8". Then the throttle return spring on the drivers side, and the throttle cable (needle nose pliers)

the bolts are 1/2". 4 of them, the back ones are easiest with a 6" extension. (*remember when putting it back on, don't tighten these hard at all, it'll warp your nice brass carb*)

may take a bit of prying to pop it off it's it's been on for a while...

set it on a nice open area, lots of lighting, preferably with no cracks/crevices (wooden table), very small pieces here... and you want lots of light...

You'll need
-4L of carb cleaner (some 'solvents' aren't strong enough)
*I use an old windshield washer bottle with the top cut off, it's good to soak the main 3 parts in... also disposable pie plates are good for little parts*

-a magnet (extendable ones are awesome)
- A torx T8, 20,25, flatblade screwdriver and phillips.
- some other stuff I can't remember right now...
*read my thread open right now, "non CC Q-jet rebuild" a few other tips in there.

Terminology: The carb is three 'slabs', top (air horn), middle (float bowl), bottom (throttle body), this is useful for asking questions later..

-There are 7 T25 screws holding the air horn to the float bowl. Make sure to get the other 2 (total of 9) in the primary venturi's, good to have the magnet now.
*don't go reefin' on it until you have those 9 off, you'll feel dumb if you do*
also before you take off the top plate:
-use your T8 and take off your secondary hanger/rods
-use your flatblade and remove the screw on the air horn (#11), you can remove that little tang (#12), and the rod it's holding (#13), don't worry about #49...
-also remove your choke pulloff (#7), 2 T20 screws holding that on, the vacuum line, and the rod, you'll have to rotate that to get it off...
- then the trickiest part, your accelerator arm (#9, 10) use the trick in my other thread with the nail to get the roll pin out, that way you can re-use it if you don't have another one...
Then you can take off #9, and remove the air horn...

*The only parts you really have to worry about keeping seperate are springs, remember which spring went where, it's hard to keep track of them, so be extra careful with those*


It just now occured to me that I know you are removing the carb, but I just assumed you were rebuilding it.... Rather than delete all this and just write bah-humbug, i'll leave it, but i'm tired and I'm not sure if i'm wasting my time. Let me know if you want to hear part 2 of the rebuild story..... -J

megaracerx

ok, i have the carb off...sadly though, the fuel line in thr front was rusted and snaped with almost no pressure...

ok...the butterflys open underneath, both the primaries and secondaries...

but neither airvalve opens, unless i push them with my fingers..
is the throttle body a seperate peice? cause i think i left that one the car...

i'm just glad this isnt on my dialy driver...i have NO idea what i'm getting into...

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

yea, those fuel lines are pretty weak, I think you can get a braided high pressure line from an autoparts store that can replace that, goes from your fuel pump, up to your carb, shouldn't be too pricey.
yea, like I say, the air valves open by vacuum, if you fiddle with the choke on the passenger side, you should be able to make the primary one flop open. that's normal.
nope, if you removed the 4 bolts and pulled the carb off, the throttle body is still on the carb, (espescially if you can see the round butterflies on the bottom, those are on the throttle body). The throttle body is attached to the float bowl via 3 T25 screws from the underside... but you take that apart after removing the air horn...

megaracerx

i'm gonna rip it apart over the weekend, and get a rebuild kit and just starts messing with it...thats how ya learn i guess...


i guess replacing the spings (for the throttle ect ect..) maybe that would help with opening the air valves??
i'm gonna spray all the liknages and stuff with like WD-40, or somthing....what do you recommend?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

If you're holding the carb in your hands, that's normal. The front butterfly on the top is the choke, and it is spring loaded to close when cold (not warmed up, anyway). The back set is the aforementioned air valves, and they remain closed until air flow is adequate to open them (keeps the engine from bogging with more air than it can use).

The throttle body is attached to the main body, and cannot be removed from the rest of the carb while the carb is attached to the intake manifold. It contains the throttle butterflies, sometimes referred to as the throttle blades or throttle valves.

Here's a link to a view of all the carb parts http://www.carburetion.com/Quads/E4MC.htm . It doesn't refer to some of these items by name because you don't take them off/apart for the typical rebuild. A rebuild kit will include a similar diagram.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Oh, get the kit before you "rip it apart". The instructions will tell you how to take it apart and in the proper order. Be prepared to be able to lay all of the parts out on a clean work area. I put a clean old towel down on the bench when I'm doing this kind of thing. And have the rest of the bench completely clean and cleared off.

megaracerx

i planned on getting the kit 1st, as i have not the slighest idea what i'm doing...lol...i'm gonna spread a towel on a card table and keep all the screws and stuff in little tupperwear containers.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Excellant.

I put the carb in the lower center of the towel, and as each piece comes off, start in the upper left corner and work my way to the right, left center and work to the right, etc. Then, when it goes back together, work backwards across the towel.

Some of the parts need to be soaked in carb cleaner. Just make sure you know where they need to go when you take them out.

megaracerx

can you buy like a bottle of carb cleaner? or just like aresol cans?

should i make a seperate container for peices neeeded to be soaked? or just take everything apart and clean as needed?


also, how hard is a typical rebuild, in your opinion?


BTW, thanks for the diagram.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Read through this one https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=273072

Basically the same idea. Personally, I buy a gallon of "real" carb cleaner and soak the parts in it - it has a basket in the can to put the pieces into for soaking. This should be done in a non-living, well ventilated area.

The typical rebuild isn't "hard", but it is intricate and some of the little things take some patience.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

yea, a good strong carb cleaner, and the compressed air...

and yes, the single best piece of advice there was:

'cuz I guarantee you'll forget which part goes back in, in what order at some point...

well if you've ever built a model car when you were young, this shouldn't be too bad... read all the instructions in the rebuild kit you get too, they'll probably mention a few things we missed here...

oh yea, and most rebuild kits (the niehoff ones i've gotten), are for a bunch of carbs, so you only actually use about 2/3 of the parts, so don't worry about having extra new pieces left over after (well, within reason..)

oh, and putting the new accelerator pump in the old spring with the old lock is a little tricky, but play with it, it'll work...

you don't usually get new springs in the rebuild kit, yours should be fine, you can get some extra hi-performance goodies from edelbrock, part # 1992, 1986, 1994, if you want, but probably not necessary... the spring that controls your air valve opening is discussed on the tech section of TGO, it's a very common mis-adjusted part...

megaracerx

ha, i just turned 17, so i'm still young

what kinda of rebuild kit did you use? niehoff? is that a brand?

i was just gonna go to pep boys and ask them..but if you recommend one, lemme know.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

I'm not the guy to ask about that, my experience is extremly recent, and fresh, but not extensive... In other words, i've only used one brand, and that's niehoff, but that's just 'cuz that's all they stock here...
I'm in Canada, so you kinda have to go with what's on the shelves, or order it, pay 3x the price, and wait 2 weeks....so...

Look at the # on the side of the carb, should be on the drivers side I think, something like: 1708429, or something like that. Then when you go buy a carb rebuild kit, use that #. (If you tell them it's from a '79 Camaro, but on an '86 Camaro they'll be kinda confused...)

Lo-tec

"Rochester Carburetors" by Doug Roe published by HP books is a decent reference with lots of pictures and detail about how it works. Get the 8-digit # off of the carb when you go to get the kit. And buy some JB Weld to epoxy up the plugs that always leak.

megaracerx

good idea....i found a "universal rebuild kit" at pep boys, it made by edlebrock so its shouldnt be to bad..

what all should i look for in a rebuild kit? like what it essential?

megaracerx

Thanks for the info,

BTW i noticed your from Gambrils maryand? my whole family is The Gambrils

Lo-tec

named the Gambrils? or in gambrills?

megaracerx

Named, lol.

Lo-tec

all the little parts you will lose...good luck with the rebuild!! And definitely get a gallon of carb cleaner from pep boys and let that thing soak for a day (may have to distort can to insert carb )

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

yea, you basically want passages cleaned, outsides are as clean as you want to be looking at them... so soak them for a few hours maybe, get a toothbrush (I use a detailing brush, nylon and a stainless one, and scrub it, then toss it back in the soak...
Edelbrock made one? cool, may have higher performance parts.. Out of curiosity, what was the price? I pay around $33CDN for one, so $26ish american...

*oh, and a little tip, be very careful with the needle, and the check ball (should be listed on that picture I sent you, or in the info included with the rebuild kit, they are VERY small, and very easy to lose, ie. the check ball is NON-magnetic, making it even more of a pain...)

megaracerx

thanks for the heads up with the check ball,

the eldebrock kit is $38 american. which isnt that bad concidering the holley kit was $80!

megaracerx

okay, my local pep boys didnt have any of the kits instock, so i'm ordering it online.

http://www.7453217467431.com/product...=1105218077406

here the link to the kit i'm getting...opinions please.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

haha, that's funny, that's virtually the same website Canadian tire uses to order stuff in for me here... Just the Canadian tire part was swapped with Pep-boys...
That link didn't show a part, just brought me to the home page, i'm assuming 1901 or something?

There should be a parts store in your town that has a quadrajet rebuild kit in stock, I don't think the edelbrock rebuild kit comes with anything fancy, same parts as most others, it's their addons (different metering rods, jets, etc) that are good from edelbrock...
but hey, if they can order one in for you in under 3 weeks (that's what it'd be for me), I guess go for it...

megaracerx

ok, what does that mean? whats a 1901? a part #?

if i order it tonight, it should be here in a week or 2

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

yea, that's one of edelbrocks carb rebuild kit part #'s.
hmm, ok, it's not your daily driver I take it then?

megaracerx

nope, just a winter project. my 86 T/a is the daily driver.