gpwasr10

SO, after a couple of years of thinking about what I want my next automotive venture to be (My last was a '79 Trans Am) and (after perusing your brainwashing website) have it down to a Second Gen F-Body. But I have a few questions for the experts here on this great website about codes and what to look for.

A '90/'91/'92 RS. I like the clean lines of this F-body and it's also a car you don't see a ton of people bringing back to life, and this is understanding seeing how this car wasn't known to be a monster. However, it will likely be getting a 5.7 swap of some type (L98, LS1, LT1) to address this shortcoming; I'll be looking for a 305/5 Speed car to make this swap more straight forward. Now I think I read someplace that some of the RS cars came with the same suspension as their Z-car siblings, was this the case with all the v8 Powered manual RS cars, or is there a RPO or VIN code I can look for? LOL, or is this even true?

The exact car I would be looking for would be a...
'92 RS 305 5-speed HDTP with the sports suspension package.


Any advice from RS owners when looking for "the Car" would be appreciated.

okfoz

No, The RS did not come with the same suspension as the Z28... The Z28 had the FE2 suspension and I believe that the RS had the FE1 level, which was softer, smaller sway bars, softer springs...

The GTA and Formula would have all come with the FE2 suspension (WS6), THE T/A was a hit or miss as the WS6 was an option, sometimes standard with certain engine/trans options.

John

Drew

iTrader: (58)

The base 91-92 RS suspension is FE1 (level I). F41 (level II) was optional with the V8 RS, most of them came with F41, they're easy to spot by the 16" Z28 style wheels. F41 was standard on the 91-92 Z28. FE2 (level III) was optional on the Z28, you can spot it by the 245/50ZR16 tires. Usually FE2 shows up when the car was ordered with G92.

So the difference between a fully loaded RS, and an entry level Z28 in 1991-92 is the badging, TPI vs TBI, hood blisters, and spoiler.

What'd you'd be looking for is a 91-92 RS with F41 suspension and 16" wheels. The top of the line Z28 (a 305 TPI 5spd or L98) would eat that RS for lunch stock vs stock, but they're somewhat similar. Most people would never know the difference, but it's a night and day difference behind the wheel or in a drag race.

If you want performance, and don't intend to modify everything, look for the top of the line car. You'll save money and have a more desirable car. If you plan to modify everything, take your pick, since most everyone who heavily modifies one of these cars removes all the parts that are better on a top of the line car vs an entry level car, anyway.

camaronewbie

Get a car with the body in good shape, with a V8 if that's what you want. ALL the rest is easy to change, and (as in suspension) probably needs it anyways. My car is an RS, but all the suspension has been swapped and upgraded to way beyond anything factory from any 3rd gen.

yo soy el warg

Your right Drew my 1992 RS has the 16" wheels and F41, 305 TBI, auto, on the RPO list and it is original. Here is a picture of it.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...70-post49.html

okfoz

I forgot about the F41... Thanks...

John

KMK454

I would recommend looking for a B4C. You will get all of the Z28 (and maybe even 1LE) stuff in RS packaging. This means disk brakes, FE2 suspension, TPI motors, etc. If you can only find an L98 B4C, then just do a T5 or T56 swap.

gpwasr10

So, with all that in mind would I be better off just going with a Z car Formula or TA? It seems price is about a wash...

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

Get yourself an RS if you want the extra clean styling.

gpwasr10

Yeah... You're right man.. The RS is just so damn sleak and I can always brace up the corners.

So, I would be looking for...
1990-1992 RS
5.0
5 Speed
RPO code F41 suspention
Hard Top (I'd settle for a T)

Any other things I should look for?

Also, I have seen some RS cars with body colored wheels, others with grey, what is the difference? Does this have to do with the suspention upgrade or lack thereof?

I was a second gen man for years, but as you can see I have much to learn about the third. Thanks for your time!

As I really start looking at more cars, you'll have to brace yourselves for more of this. LoL ;-)

gpwasr10

B4C? That's to police model right?

camaronewbie

All of the cars with the "colored" wheels will not have the suspension you seek. Those cars ALL have the 15inch wheels, so by default they aren't going to have the "beefier" stuff.

BUT - as mentioned - wheels, suspension, etc. are all very easily changed.

Again - get a good V8 body - that's priority. All the rest can be swapped/added.

My 1992 RS has 16inch wheels - but still had smaller sway bars and no wonderbar. But, time and cash fixed all that. My suspension now is much better than anything the factory offered.

I guess the point I'm trying to make as far as suspension goes .... in this generation car at least, everything is swappable. Doesn't matter what it had from the factory, you can easily add/swap the missing pieces or lower grade/smaller pieces with whatever you desire, and it's all very affordable (relatively speaking as nothing these days is very affordable).

You also want to find as good of an interior as you can - not so much upholstery wise, but plastic wise - it's getting harder to find interior plastics that are affordable. Like the dash pad - if you can find a car with a mint dashpad - that pad itself is worth it's weight in gold anymore (a mint pad runs about $400 now).

And, the nose cone/chin spoiler - only 1991 and 1992 had the "aero" ground effects. So chin spoilers are hard to find that haven't been beat up or broken, and the nose cones are getting really rare. 3 years ago, I bought the last new nose cone Hawks had, and I haven't seen them have another one since. Needless to say, anyone within 10 feet of my nose gets shot on sight!

Think of it as a 2nd gen car - forget the suspension, motor, etc. That;s all easily changed. Look for good body, pieces in good condition that are hard to replace. etc. The rest you'll want to change no matter what the factory RPO code (like adding SFC's, STB, better springs/shocks/struts, poly bushings, etc.).

Also, don't know where you are located, but the southeast is Camaro heaven! Rust free cars that sell cheap. I've not paid over $800 for a 3rd gen here. Granted, they have dents, dings, etc. - but it was my intention to totally restore and repaint anyway - all I was interested in was good main body, V8 car, good nose cone, and good interior pieces as I knew the rest would all get changed anyway. So - might be worth a peek in the southeast - $1000 car + $300 plane ticket is still way cheaper than the $2500+ prices I see/hear about in the north and west for rusty cars.

camaronewbie

Oh, some of this might answer some of your questions: www.thirdgen.org/faq

gpwasr10

Thanks for all the information! Well thought out responses from all of you and the help is appreciated.

I live in Colorado and have seen prices from 500 on up for the RS depending on package. I'll check on the areas you mention and see what prices look like there.

In my mind the aformentioned RS would be my pick, but should it be to hard to find a solid Z-28, IROC, Formula, Trans Am isn't out of the question.

Thanks!

KMK454

Yes. It is basically a 1991-1992 Z28 in RS body work, which seems to be exactly what you are after.

Here's my B4C. It has factory RS body work but the Z28 performance bits, specifically: LB9 305 TPI, FE2 suspension, 3.42 posi rear, J65 disc brakes, WC T5, engine oil cooler, radio delete, dual-converter exhaust. You can still find a few out there that were either never put in service or were well cared for during the course of their duty.

gpwasr10

THAT is sweet... Also basically EXACTLY what I would be looking for. Mind if I ask what you gave?

Also Puma, is that your blue RS in your sig? Cause if it is, that's a great looking car too.

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

Yep, and thanks.

Stevolwevol

iTrader: (1)

I am a little confused. My RS has the 16" wheels, and F41 RPO. Does that equal FE2?

okfoz

No, there were 3 levels From 91 & 92

Level I - FE1 15" wheels
Level II - F41 16" Wheels
Level III - FE2 16" Wheels 36mm sway bar in the front 24mm in rear

The options included with each is not exhaustive above.

John

Stevolwevol

iTrader: (1)

Ok, I get the picture. There is a noticable difference in handling between my 86 IROC, and my RS. The RS feels softer, or I should say smoother than my IROC. With the IROC, there is absolutely no tipping or nose diving when corning. The RS is no slouch either. It corners very well, but the IROC has the edge. My 86 IROC had the FE2 RPO. I am assuming it is the same as the 91-92's.

Drew

iTrader: (58)

On the RS, FE2 won't show up unless the car is a B4C. The easy way to spot a FE2 car is the tire decal in the door jam, it'll show 245/50ZR16's. F41 cars got 235's. FE1 cars got 15" wheels.

Basically, the FE1 cars (V6's mostly) got nothing for performance. F41 cars got larger sway bars, the better steering gear, stiffer bushings, stiffer springs, special shocks and struts, and 16" wheels. FE2 cars got all of that, plus even larger sway bars, even stiffer springs, and wider tires.

The Firebird couldn't be ordered with F41 unless it was ordered as a Trans Am. WS6 Firebirds carry the FE2 code.

The difference you feel is that F41 cars handle OK, more comfortable and easy to live with. FE2 is more aggressive, it grips the road better but with that you feel more bumps in the road.

okfoz

If I have done my research correctly

FE2 for Firebirds and Camaros ended up the same, but they were not always the same.

In 85 or 86 when the (WS6) FE2 Firebirds got the 36mm front sway bars, the IROC with FE2 got the wonderbar, and smaller sway bars. The Firebird WS6 (FE2) remained pretty much the same from 1986 - 1992, 1986 was the last year for rear Disc brakes with WS6.

I want to think this changed around 1988 to 1990 for the Camaro, when they got the larger Firebird 36mm/24mm swaybars , without looking it up right now, there was a change along the way.

So no, 1986 Camaro FE2 is not the same as a 1991/1992...

It has been noted by magazines who did comparisons side by side that a Camaros ride was noticeably more harsh than a Firebird sibling... So there was some differences, in-spite of their apparent similarities. When the 3rd gen began they were more different, however, as time went on (as mentioned above) the two slowly became more similar.

Stevolwevol

iTrader: (1)

So the harshness is probably due to stiffer springs. I'll measure both cars sway bars just to double check. Does the wonder bar make a noticable difference in handling? The IROC does corner remarkably better.

Drew

iTrader: (58)

As to why the FE2 Firebird rides better then a FE2 Camaro, my best guess would be the shocks and struts. The springs are the same. Sway bars really don't effect ride. Both cars got harder bushings, 16" wheels with narrow sidewall tires, etc. The only obvious difference is that Irocs came with stiffer struts and shocks.

The wonderbar makes a difference you can actually feel, but it's not a huge night and day difference.

What makes a FE2 Iroc handle better then a F41 RS is a total package approach to handling. The Iroc has wider tires, different shocks and struts, stiffer springs, larger sway bars, etc. The Iroc was designed to handle better, compromising comfort for performance. The F41 RS was designed to be somewhere in the middle between a comfortable ride and a harsh performance ride. Some of the performance is compromised to allow the car to be more comfortable.

Stevolwevol

iTrader: (1)

The IROC had the Bilstien shocks, and stiffer struts. So what you said makes sense. It corners great, but it's like driving a brick down the road.

Drew

iTrader: (58)

Sounds like an Iroc... Mine is like driving a lumber wagon on rails. It sticks to the road great, but it's a rattling, kidney busting, PITA.

Stevolwevol

iTrader: (1)

My rock will "pogo stick" on a bumpy highway sometimes. I have new shocks, and struts. they aren't the cause. Just the nature of the beast