SFX099

Since u guys seem to be the best car guys on the net, I decided to ask this here. I was just wandering what do the older crown vic police cars have unique? My uncle is gonna sell me the 5.0 from one of his. He also said I can take anything else I want, what do these cars have in them? Is there anything else that might be valuable driveshaft or anything?

Thanks

Coach Hawk

If it's like the 9C1 Caprice, it's basically a stock V8 car with a bit stiffer suspension. No magic "cop chip" or any other such nonsense. it may or may not have a limited slip diff.

ME Leigh

So its a Ford? If it is those are the absolute worst piles of crap ever. Nothing on them is worth a damn at all. Ford doesn't know how to build cars. All of their new models are Mazda's.

You could take the drivetrain and sell it. Maybe take the swaybars and sell those too. But most people that have Crown Vics don't have them for their power or handling prowess.

SFX099

the reason i am asking is that I am gonna do an engine swap on my '96 mustang so it will have a v-8. but while i am at it, if the springs, or sway bars will fit and are performance pieces as compared to mine, then I need to get everything from it. I might even get the rear end as well.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

i dont think its really anythin special but your better off tryin on a mustang site

Merlin

That's just like Ford. Start with a 4,000 pound slug of a sedan. Wedge in a couple of 400 pound officers and gear, then "power" it with a 300-ish inch engine. The only thing worse is the newer design, powered by a 260-ish inch engine. No wonder they start blowing oil at 40K miles.

On the up-side, at least you'll have a real engine for your 'Stang. The modular engines are probably best left to the Clown Dics, Grandma Queers, and salvage yards.

305q_ta86

iTrader: (1)

Man that bugs me. I remember my old truck, a '91 Exploder that was supposedly a joint venture with Mazda. What a pile.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Or the E-250 shop van where I work, 4.2 V6 with NO Low-speed torque, an Automatic, and Tall gears. It can barely hold 60 MPH on the Highway with the A/C on.

My stock 175 HP 305 Chevy Van could have made it a speck in the mirrors, rather quickly.

SFX099

Thanks for all ur help guys. In light of new evidence from stangnet, these police 5.0's are only 160hp. My v-6 almost has that, so thats still a waste of time. Im just gonna have to find a 5.0 from a mustang to continue my swap.

SSC

Just speaking of police cars in general including GM ones. The only things upgraded on them are the cooling system and suspension.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I don't know for sure on the ford, but on the 9C1 caprice. The following are changed speedometer, charging system, bigger cam, bigger injectors, different chip (GM Caprice) with NO Speed Limiter and improved HP, exhaust system, different tires, the transmission is setup to take the abuse and shift 3-4 @ WOT, a different gear ratio.

ljnowell

That would be why they outsell GM in almost every category.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

depending on the year of the motor, it's probably a roller block and whatnot. It is a low output version of the mustang motor (ie, not the 225HP version), that's mostly due to cam though.

but yea, you're asking about souping up a mustang on a camaro website Take a walk, go find a mustang website.
Actually my brother has a crown vic, go to crownvic.us and ask about the cop motor, haha...

ljnowell

Very sound advice. Face it, you are asking questions about the sworn enemy to most of the poeple here, and with good reason. Mustangs spanked thirdgens way too much for people here to like fords.

Vader

In addition to the 3.08 gearing, different PCM, the 9C1/SEO vehicles from GM included front brake cooling air deflectors, heavier front ball joints (5/8" stud Cadillac hearse units), taller springs with a different rate, heavy duty reinforced frame (same as used on the Impala SS), 140A alternator, steel plates in the backs of the seats (lacking in Fords - Much to the chagrin if most police departments that realize this), a fully unitized body ON TOP of a full perimeter frame (double strength), full steel bumper impact bar liners end to end (not just between the frame rails with styrofoam) considerably more torque and HP in the lower RPM ranges, longer life engine, lateral reinforcement between the B pillars (like a factory roll bar), full compliment of body mount bushings (lacking in the regular B-cars), and lots of little amenities that plain old B-Cars don't have, not to mention the Fords.

As for the original question, you're probably far better off using the 302 as a basis to build a stout engine as compared to the Romeo engines. You'll probably find a lot more help at www.corral.net Some of those guys are pretty decent.

Coach Hawk

Ok, NONE of these are true. I HAVE a '94 9C1 Caprice, and have done pleanty of research on the subject.

The ONLY difference in the Speedo is it has "certified" printed on it

ALL LT1 Caprices got the 140 amp alternator

With the exception of an external oil cooler, the engine and computer are EXACTLY the same as the non-cop caprice, with the exception of a 130 MPH speed limiter(yes, 130, NOT unlimited). No magic cop program that gives you 800 extra HP, no special cam, nothing.

the exhaust is EXACTLY the same as the LT1 Civi caprice

Ok, I'll give you the cop tires. they are speed rated, but that is the only difference, and even that was optional on the cop cars.

ALL Lt1 Caprices have the same trans, and all have the "Vette" servo

ALL Lt1 Caprices have 3.08 rear ends, NOT all have Posi, not even all Cop cars got posi

As far as the 9C1 VS the P71 Crown Vic, the caprice has better acceleration, and better braking, but the Vic handles and rides better.

Don't believe me? Ask these guys: http://www.impalassforum.com/cgi-bin...i?action=intro

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I think you need to do a little research on the TBI 9C1 caprice and the B4C Camaros. They have everything I mentioned.

The 9C1 frame is a full boxed frame that is unitized, very similar to my older G-Vans.

The 9C1 350 TBI car had the L98 cam, bigger injectors, dual exhaust, 3.42 rear end, a 700r4 that could do a 3-4 shift @ WOT, silicon hoses, the POLICE chip IS DIFFERENT than a civilian 350 car.

The cam, exhaust, and injectors are different so IT HAS TO BE DIFFERENT, NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.

I have read BOTH the standard civie L05 350 chip and the 9C1 350 chip, they ARE DIFFERENT. The L03 chip for the 9C1 is different than a regular L03 chip as well. I haven't looked into the LB4 4.3 chip, but it is probably different as well. On the TBI cars they got rid of the limiter.

I have seen the test results from the slalom on a P71, the caprice will out-slalom it. Hell I have test results from a 1976 G-Van that out slalomed a newer P71, as it was able to make almost 65 MPH in the handling test as they called it back then..

SFX099

No, apparently ur my enemy. Most people on these boards have no problem helping someone with another american car. Incase u missed the memo, imports are the enemy. I'm just trying to find info so I can take them out.

305q_ta86

iTrader: (1)

Ricers are the enemy.

sgt0704

they outsell, cause they're cheap. back in 02 why spend 22k or more on a new camaro when you can buy the ever common sh*t stang for 15?

rx7speed

thing is though if it is free even though it might only have the same as your V6 it's a better starting platform then your v6. do a mod here and a mod their it should respond a lot better hten your V6.

rx7speed

not to turn this itno a debate but there always has been a lot of problems between ford/chevy and ford do quite a bit of whooping back in the 80's or close to whooping.





and why am I the enemy?

Vader

I've done a little research, too. I am regularly in and around both of mine:



Except for the ball joints, brake coolers, B-Pillar crossbar (probably used as an attachment point for rear seat cages), different springs, heavier frame, more body supports, and other minor components. And don't forget that the 9C1 cars got the special round dome light farther forward, while the "regular guy" versions got the oval dome light in the normal location.

That is correct for the LT1 9C1 cars. However, not all 9C1 cars were equipped with the LT1. Many had the L99, especially in municipal police fleets. Those were equipped with either the 140A (10463338) or 105A (10479891) alternator. No one specified strictly LT1 (or even '94-later) SEO vehicles for the comparison.

Camshaft profiles in the 9C1s through 1993 were different. Camshaft profiles in 1994-96 were the same as any other B-Car P or W engine. The PCM is the same part number, but was flashed with different programming. Shift points, TCC, ignition advance, target idle, VE, A/C cutout, and several other parameters were different. In pre-1994 models, the injectors and throttle bodies were different.

For 1994-up.

Right. Just like tires were optional on all B-Cars. There were about four choices for domestic models, more for exports.

Again, no one specified strictly LT1 SEO vehicles, and '94 and later. There were a few optional gear ratios on pre-1994 9C1s. BTW - 1994-96 export LT1 B-Cars (including the "Caprice SS", not Impala SS for export) were available with a 2.73 rear gear. Domestic 9C1 vehicles were avialable with either, depending on whether the engine was a P or W.

And if you have a '94 SEO (or any 10-bolt) and haven't already done so, you might want to check the rear cover gasket. The factory installed a gasket with no outer oil return holes for the outboard bearings. FelPro makes a replacement with the correct cutouts. If you've eaten rear wheel bearings and wondered why, now you know.

The Ford does have what is reported to be a better ride (which is rather subjectove), but the older RWD 9C1 cars slalomed at 0.8G, while even the newest Clown Dics (even with the extra weight of the "Police Interceptor" badge glued to the rear fascia) only manage 0.74G. All while getting worse fuel mileage with the smaller engine and 450 pounds less mass.


I know all about those guys. Mr. Mueller and I got tired of correcting people there all the time as well. I prefer http://www.impalaclub.com/naisso/Forum2005/

Vader

I think he meant belligerent imports, which excludes you.

SFX099

ahh yes, sorry i meant ricers in general that could possibly exclude you. The motor is free, but to get it to the same power as the mustang 5.0, it would still take around the same amount of money as buying a used one. I'm gonna call around some junkyards here and try to find an explorer 5.0, with there heads and intake, it'll be a much better starting point.

Vader

Does the Explorer 302 have heavier mains? Are the heads better? If not, the free engine might be just as good a starting point. A decent cam, a little head work, and you sould have something. As I mentioned, check out the Corral.net. Some of the people over there know their stuff pretty well. I haven't played with Fords (other than repairing them for everyone else) since the '70s.

11 Flat

Then why did the 91-96 9c1 kick the living **** out of the ford until 97.....when gm didn’t offer the b-body anymore?

I think his point was...the ford police cars are nothing special

Guest

Where are those B-cars now?

People wonder why they went to Fords... well... thank GM for that, they decided they didnt need to sell the cars anymore.
Hey, we got this here unit-body front-driver 6 holer smaller car that'll do ya just as good, we promise!

Guess they weren't buyin that one.

There's a few 'special' Fords running around out there, but thats not what you are going to get or find. You are going to find a run of the mill 4.6 dog, thats what you will find. Exploder may not be a bad idea I suppose, going to build up the motor? Some of the crate motors dont look too bad if you ask me. There's a ton of selection, just ditch the cam, dont like any of them they offer.

Uhh... smaller? Ever seen a 4.sux? Damn thing is almost as big as a BBC. I still dont know how, or why, Ford did that. Huge engine, no displacement.

Man I'm bored, google in Ford Crown Bi...errr... Vic police interceptor. It'll kick ya from cvpi.com to fleet.ford.com to some button to click, but I found this funny:

"Government's 5-Star front crash test safety rating - Crown Victoria has received the government's highest 5-Star crash test safety rating for the driver and front passenger for 10 years in a row (1996-2005)"

Good thing they didnt test the rear. Oh wait...

"Tested in 75-mph rear-end crash - No other car in the world is tested to this standard!"

Doesnt say what happened. Maybe they did address it though:

"Industry-first optional Fire Suppression System"

Vader

Yes, as early as 1993. The company I worked for then did R&D on the cylinder/deck/case fasteners. They wanted nothing to do with the thing. I saw them assembled, disassembled, cut away on a band saw, rough castings, the whole boat. Yes, it's a rather BIG little POS.

Stick with the Windsor. Oh, wait - This is a GM board. Go ahead, go nuts with the modular engine. It'll hold together - Really.