scarr001

so i had a mobile mechanic frm craigslist come to see why my car would just stall every now and then-i thought it was the vats- he said distributor and i paid to have him change it out- then aftr a couple days the car overheats- so he finds the seam in the radiator separated abt an inch and says tht it all needs to be replaced- aftr abt an hour, car still overheats- now i find out that my wires have a nic in them and it is causing them to arc off the block, and, there is oil in the radiator that he just put in- anthr mechanic says a blown gasket.....can anyone tell me what might have gone on here??? he would have known blown gasket b4 he did distributor, right? so it wasnt blown b4 he touched it??? and since no overheating til aftr the distributor- a nic in the wires aftr the distributor b4 the radiator??? would the arc-ing off the block cause the overheating??? thats why when he replcd the radiator it still didnt resolve the issue???

1990z28

If you hae oil in your coolant you most likely have a blown head gasket or possibly a cracked head and if you were able to get oil in it you could have some blow by past the rings so your rings may need changed or what. And the overheating could just be the thermostat is bad or the water pump. Hope this helps any but dont trust the mobile mechanics of criagslist most the time is a spam to eget your money for bogus repairs take it to a good name shop and have them take a look.

scarr001

thnx- i appreciate ur response-
has anyone had any experience with this "steel seal"?

RazorN8

Hey. I have never used a craigslist mechanic, I don't even trust most shops. Sounds to me like the overheating and the stalling were two different unrelated problems. I doubt that a knicked wire caused your engine to over heat. What I do think may have happened is that the overheating caused the head to warp which would have caused the head gasket to fail. The head gasket would be my first guess if I saw oil in the coolant as well. At least that is the least worst problem that would cause oil in the coolant. Future reference, be careful who you trust to work on your car.

What would you use steel seal for? Sounds like one of those leak patch in a bottle deals. I personally would never use one of those quick fix products in my car.

BellaBird

I have and it worked great! It was so easy to do but you have to stay in the car for a whole hour holding the rpms at 1000 to ensure adhesion. It didnt work right away the first time so they gave me another application for my v6. Steel seal is the best because they guarantee it for life and they guarantee it will work.

Not to mention using steel seal means you will not have to remove the thermostat like you would have to with other head gasket sealer applications. Thermostat is under the intake manifold and such a witch to get at..lol hope i helped..Good Luck

scarr001

does anyone have an idea as to why aftr the distributor replcmnt the car would overheat- which it never did b4, and even a new rad,thermostat, hoses etc would not fix the overheating?

RazorN8

Could you post more about your car? engine, year, motor, etc. Does it have an electric radiator fan? My only guess is that the switch that operates the electric fam may have become detached from its wire. This would cause the fan to not come on to blow air across the radiator at a stop light or something. This would cause the engine to over heat. The other options are bad water pump, broken accessory belt, clog in the coolant passages somewhere. None of these are directly associated with the distributor though. Replacing the distributor incorrectly would either cause the engine to not start, or backfire, or possibly not get oil if the oil pump drive shaft was not lined up correctly. I don't think that the distributor had much or anything to do with over heating.

scarr001

Sorry it took so long to respond-my camaro is a '92 5.7 with a v8, its the 25th anniversary edition- i m not sure abt the fan...i m getting estimates frm $800- $1300 to do the gasket and the plugs etc...whew
i m still trying to figure out what he did wrong aftr the distributor to make it overheat? it never, never overheated b4 he messed with the distributor and threw the idle way off....

RazorN8

Make sure you check your timing. That would cause the car to idle differently. I'm not sure about that causing over heating. I'm almost positive that you have an electric radiator fan. The best way to tell is to open the hood and look at the front of the engine. If the fan blades are made of metal and mounted on the water pump, you have an old fashioned fan clutch and fan blades. If the fan is plastic (usually black) and mounted only on the radiator, you have an electric fan. Once you figure that out, we can move on to determining if the fan switch is hooked up (if you have an electric fan).

scarr001

thnx n8, ur right it is electric- black and mounted on the radiator-

RazorN8

Alright. The fan switch is mounted to the passenger side head. I think it is between cylinder 6 and 8 spark plugs. There should be a single wire that attaches to the sensor. If it's not attached, the fan won't turn on and car will over heat.
Have you noticed if the fan turns on once the car is warmed up? It will usually turn on and off while it and the thermostat are trying to keep the engine at optimum operating temperature.

scarr001

i will chk it right away! it doesnt say in the profiles but u need to know that i m a single mom and my 16 yr old has been "trying" to dirve the car. i had the hood painted to match the teal color, it only has 85k on it bcse it has been garaged- i m worried that if i take the "mobile mechanic" to court they will just give me kbb valu which is what, arnd 1600...that wont get him a car like this to drive ha ha

scarr001

ok i checked the fan swtch or that plug thing? and it all looks connected by the plugs except there is a wire frm the radiator area to the same group of wires on the passenger side that powers the hood lite and that is not connected to anything and to me it looks like it should...but it doesnt reach anything to connect it to? i will chk the haynes guide- but...i taped the two knicked wires that were arc-ing off the block and it idled the way it should so then i took it out and it overheated but it took a little longer and i can tell i need a new radiator cap- but the fan never came on...??at least now i can get a new radiator cap, fill the radiator correctly and drive again- or at least get it to a shop to see abt the fan. i have to say when i was driving it, there is no white smoke but when i floored it, it was going thru the gears really really slow, it didnt "miss" = but felt really sluggish???

RazorN8

The fan should be turning on. Try unpluging the fan switch wire and touching the wire to the engine block with the key in the run position, without the engine running. Those sensors are the variable resistance type. As the sensor heats up, the resistance drops, grounds the circuit, and turns the fan on. When you touch the wire to the block with the key in the run position, it tricks the computer into thinking that engine is overheating and forces the fan to turn on. If this works, the sensor is bad. If it doesn't work, there may be an issue somewhere else in the circuit or in the fan itself.

Could you maybe get some pictures of the wires that got knicked and the disconnected wire? It may help us to determine what they do.

scarr001

it will take me a bit to get the pix but i will try that to see if i can get the fan to come on- thanks for all the great info n8, i really was excited when it sounded so much better just aftr taping up the wires and i will get a new radiator cap too

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Having a bad case of blow by would not cause oil to enter the lubricating system. Blow by would cause you oil to become acidic which would be very bad for the rotating system. also if the mechanic did not adjust the timing correctly (6* with EST disconnected), that may be why your engine is over heating. Bad timing is a cause of overheating.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Follow this link to troubleshoot your overheating issues,,,, https://www.thirdgen.org/overheating

RazorN8

You make a good point with the ignition timing. That is the only thing on there that is related to the distributor. I'm still concerned that he clipped a wired that turns on the fan though.

scarr001

it was quite an ordeal creating and album and i actually have three pics of the fan swtch area- its the plug that has the red wire that isnt attached to anything, but then again- idk where it would attach?

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Because he's an ... well you get what Im trying to say. Gotta keep the boards clean of foul language. Personnally, the mech needs a .

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Here is what you can do. Its a win-win situation. Go to Autozone and buy the Haynes Underwear UUHHH,,, I meant the Haynes Camaro Repair Manual. Then take a picture of the electrical wiring diagram so that you can know the color scheme of the wires, then go back to AZ and tell them there must be a mistake because the wire colors dont match. Then they'll refund your money. I only know a site that has 86 IROC wiring diagram. Sorry bud. But if your really that desperate, go with my method and get the repair manual.

scarr001

thnx chevy 86- i have the repair manual, but i had some work done on the a/c and am thinking that they chngd the wiring arnd...well at least i know that by taping the knicked wires i can at least get it into a shop and they can tell me abt the blown head gasket, is loss of acceleration a symptom of a blown head gasket? i had it floored and it would only get up to 50...and it took forever

alexisgreene

Oil in radiator and your sluggish acceleration are sure signs of a blown head gasket. If you are able to remove your spark plugs, you can check for a blown head gasket using a compression tester. This is the cheapest and easiest way to check for a blown head gasket. All the people who have cars that I have fixed in my area were referred to me by someone who I have done work for before. It all started with me doing one electrical fix for a lady and she told a friend who had a problem, and so on. Word of mouth is the best advertisement... try using that instead of a random internet advertisement in the future. Sorry about you problems after the distributor.

RazorN8

They are correct that the head gasket is probably causing your sluggish acceleration and that a compression test would probably tell you if the gasket is bad. The issue with getting the gasket fixed now is that the car still over heats and you will be back in the shop for another gasket or new head in a matter of time. If you take it to the shop, be sure that they will diagnose and fix your overheating problem as well as the gaskets. Also be sure that they have the heads both checked for flatness and cracks (magnaflux etc) before they reinstall them. I would hate to see you pay for a full head gasket change only to find out that you also had a cracked head (another possible effect of overheating). This is probably going to cost a pretty substantial amount of money. I did head gaskets on my camaro a few months ago and I would guess it took at least 8 hours. At shop rates, you're talking around $1000 with parts I would guess. This is all assuming that your heads are good (they will run around $250-$400 for a remanned set). Maybe its time for you to get your 16 yr old to find some interest in auto-repair . I wouldn't say that its a job that is impossible for a DIY person (I did it), but its probably not so much a beginner type project.

Oh yeah, I have no idea what that wire is for. My 87 carbed camaro has a connector that looks kinda like that in the same area for connecting a diagnostic tool to and measuring the duty cycle of the mixture control solenoid (yours doesn't have this). I'm thinking it may be along the same lines. Since it is near the AC, it could be for that as well. I'm more interested in the knicked wires. Can we get the pick of those?

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

If you choose to replace the head gaskets, I would highly recommend,,, No, let me correct myself. Go buy a new set of Cylinderhead bolts. I had 2 break off flush and I was extremely lucky that I was able to tap em out with a punch and hammer.

RazorN8

Does the engine over heat while you are moving down the road? The reason I ask is that if you are moving more than 30mph, the radiator does not need assistance from the fan to cool the engine. If you are overheating while driving, we have a whole new set of issues to consider. Once again, I have to stress that the cooling problem needs to be addressed before the gaskets are fixed or you will continue to blow head gaskets.

Doom86

Why are we assuming that this guy was a hack job? Things break on cars that's what happens. Just because the guy was contacted through craigslist doesn't make him a fraud. The cracked radiator probably wasn't the cause of the overheating, but the effect of it. Just because it didn't fix it doesn't mean it wasn't bad.

When is it over heating, when you are moving or sitting still?

If it's happening when you are moving the first thing you check is for the air damn under the radiator. They get ripped off of there, it's the lowest "part" of the front end.

Do you know what a water pump looks like? If you look at the big hose coming out of the bottom of the radiator it connects to the water pump. It has a small hole on it called a "weep hole" and when it goes bad it leaks coolant out of this hole when it's running. A bad water pump usually sounds like a old freight train just getting moving because the bearings are grinding.

Once we know WHEN it's over heating it's easy to nail down. Anything else is just pissing into the wind.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Are there any troublecodes? Im not sure If I already asked you that. I had a busy day today here in the forums.

RazorN8

Doom, I think we are beyond blaming the "mechanic" at this point. Beyond that, I agree with you that we need to determine when the car overheats.
Iroc, I'm not sure that anything is going to cause a trouble code here. The computer doesn't know if the fan switch fails. Maybe that might turn up something though.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

Yeah. Your right. But anything helps, even a troublecode. So big question needs to be answered and so far Im glued to my monitor. Ok bro, when can you have the test done or the question answered?

RazorN8

You asking me or the single mom who owns the car? I don't mean to insult your intellegence or anything, I was just thinking that she might be confused by the trouble code comment. I'm pretty interested in this one too. I have a feeling that it will be something simple and I can't wait to find out what's going on.

Doom86

That wire is for testing the fuel pump circuit it doesn't connect to anything unless you are trying to prime the pump.

Chevy86 IROC-Z

iTrader: (17)

No. Im asking the member who is having the overheating issue. HaHaHa. yeah I cant wait to see the outcome. Its funny that a lot of us have one major issue and the fix is as easy as turning on the TV. Dont mean to hi-jack the thread but this is just an example of a problem that I had. IROC wouldnt rev over 2,000 RPM's, backfired from tail pipe. Ended up being a shattered pick-up coil. Then after re-installing the dizzy, she started to backfire from the intake (blew off every single vacuum line that was connected to the intake). Scared the heck out of me but it was funny seeing everyone who was there spill they're beer when they would get scared. The reason,,,,, I re-installed the dizzy with the rotor 180* out. Lifted the dizzy, spun the rotor 180* dropped her back in and

scarr001

single mom with the overheating '92 camaro here- u guys are SO HELPFUL! i really appreciate it, so i tried electrical taping the spark plug wires that were knicked and they melted against the engine block, so...i need to find a better tape ha ha- then i am going to work on the overheating thing bcse it sounds like i dont want to do anything abt the oil in the coolant until that is resolved...i am so hoping that discovering why the fan isnt coming on is as easy as turning on a tv- i did a thermostat test by putting it over/in heated water and it opened so the thermostat is good- i m going to chk the hoses, but nothing is being left on the garage floor- i so think that it is the fan swtch and there is a connection unplugged but i cant seem to find where to plug it in ha ha...and it looks like it comes frm the radiator- in the pic, u can see a shop did my a/c and looks like its been tweaked so i wonder if that connection doesnt need to be connected???hmmm

scarr001

well i chngd out a spark plug wire and now the car "tick tick tick's" and i am sure i have it in correctly! it chugs and when i try to back it up or drive it forward it dies! i think i am done...i better take it to a shop to find out how i messed up a spark plug wire and why the fan doesnt come on and then the blown head gasket...man am i going to be hating life when they tell me how much!

Doom86

Check your firing order again, use this diagram.



You didn't answer the "When question". It is very important to know when it is over heating. Driving or parked or both?

Does the fan come on when you turn on the AC?

The fan switch is on the passengers side head below and between #6 and #8 spark plugs.

scarr001

Thanks doom86- I just did the one wire so feel pretty confident that its in the right place,will the car run if I keep that wire off? Then maybe I can tell if I did it right... the overheating is aftr it runs (drives or idles) aftr abt 10 mins-

Doom86

Honestly I don't know how the ECM handles it when a plug is not firing with a Fuel Injected car. I know a carburetor car will run, it will run like crap, but it will run. Hopefully someone can chime in on that one. Double check wiring to be sure.

The "click click click" is usually a sign of a dead battery, or bad connection between the battery and the wires for it, they gotta be snug and clean where they contact. Trying to start a car repeatedly will do this, even more so if they have been sitting a good while (done this many times my self). Charge it up, jump it off another car, or have the battery tested at local parts store if you are unsure.

The ECM will turn the fan on if you turn on the AC. If it cannot the fan or wiring is bad.

The fan switch on the head is very hard to see you will need to feel around for it. It's right where I said though it has a rounded lip on it like a water bottle. The connector for the wire pops onto it and they come off on there own for what ever reason. The wires go from there down the passenger side in between the battery and the radiator.

Doom86

If it's overheating cruising down the highway and you have verified the air damn is still under the car and the thermostat is working then its almost certainly the water pump. The fan doesn't come on when you are cruising 55mph. The air should keep it well under fan temps.

Look under the front end of the car, just under the radiator. There should be a length of hard rubber just beneath the radiator hanging down a good 3-4 inches going from one end to the other. It's job is to director air to the radiator. Check this out.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

On a FI car, the ECM can still run the car if one of the spark plug wires is disconnected/missing. It will run like crap, missing and shaking and sputtering and have little power, but it will be driveable. I burned through a spark plug wire on my V6 once on my way to work and was still able to get there.

Turning the AC on is a good way to make sure the fan itself works, but you could still have a problem in the sensor wiring.

I have copies of wiring diagrams specific to your car if you still need them. Let me know and I'll post them up for you.

Doom - If I read that right, the ticking noise is when the car is running, not when she's trying to start the car. If that is the case its probably a loose or bad plug wire arcing to ground. To the OP - try and see if you can narrow down where the noise is. You can also try running the car at night away from any lights. You should be able to see a blue spark jumping from the plug wires if there is any arcing going on.

scarr001

92rs_ttop, thnx so much- and ya, ur right the stupid ticking is when it has already strtd and only strtd doing it aftr i took off the spark plug wire and replcd it-or thought i replcd it- i m thinking now that it is not in the right place, i m in the process of making sure i have 4 connected on the driver side block...and to chk the fan i can turn on the air and the fan should run right away?
thnx everyone- this is driving me crazy

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Yes, once you turn the AC on the fan should start up within a few seconds. I have the files on my desktop at work, I'll post them up when I get in tomorrow morning.

scarr001

Thnx 92rs_ttop- if u have a pic, I sure would like to c ur 92 t top? Mine is the anniversary edition with the t-tops in the teal color, maybe urs will give me enthusiasim again-cuz right now looking at mine it makes me sad!
I took a video of the ticking and then the engine stopping w/in 5 seconds on my bb, but can't seem to upload it to this site...

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Sorry it took me so long to get these up here, work has been crazy today. Anyways, here are the diagrams.

You have to upload the video to youtube, then post the link here. You can't load video directly to a thread as far as I know.

As for pics of my car, I used to have some in my profile but they are gone now. Not sure what happened. I'll post up one or two, but its a work in progress and looks like junk right now. Probably not much inspiration.

EDIT: Here is the only pic I have of it on my work computer. It looks miles better than it did when I brought it home 3 years ago spread across 2 trailers and 2 truck beds.

scarr001

Thnx 92rs_ttop, I was looking at the schematics in my haynes manual and its really confusing- but I did get good news- I pulled the dip stick and there is no water or coolant in it

ASE doc

First of all. Never hire a mechanic from craigslist. That was your first mistake. Are you sure the ticking noise isnt your injectors? It may also be another wire arcing to ground. Replace your plugs and wires. A blown head gasket on a cam in block motor will not cause oil in the coolant, period. There is no place between the head and block where there is pressurized oil. There is pressurized coolant, when the engine is hot, if the cooling system is properly sealed. Therefore it is possible to get coolant in the oil from an internal head gasket breach but not oil in the coolant.

99% of all head gasket failures are at a combustion chamber and will cause boiling in the coolant, even when cold, and severe overheating. You may also get steam at the exhaust. If you think you may have a head gasket failure, look for steady boiling in the coolant reservoir. Most likely the oil you see in the coolant could be from the trans cooler leaking. Check your trans fluid for water contamination. Water turns it milky white. It may also Bars Leak cooling system sealer. Bars Leak contains a small amount of water pump lubricant that can look a little like oil.

Ignition timing will cause the engine to run hot if it is too advanced.

ASE doc

Was just thinking of one vehicle I had in last month with severe oil contamination in the coolant. It was a water cooled VW with the oil to coolant heat exchanger(oil cooler). The TPIs use a heat exchanger similar to the VW. While I have not personaly seen an F-body with this type of failure, it is common on VWs. If you see alot of oil in your coolant, this might be something to look at. You can test the cooler by holding it under water and applying air pressure to the coolant side. Bubbles from the oil side mean its leaking.