Berlinetta101

iTrader: (7)

The seller had to know that these "NOS set of Recaro door handle emblems" were stuck to the packaging... How could you not tell!!!! I've bought NOS stuff like that and the sellers told me right off that they seem to be stuck to the package. So my 2 cents is that the seller had to know, because they hand these items in their hands while packing them up.

Manic Z

iTrader: (1)

I have to admit, between this very thread, and those ebay comments, the seller does sound like a douche. Not someone I`d like to deal with.
If you feel you`re right, as a seller, conduct yourself in a professional manner.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

this thread has been nothing but BS

ill side with the seller on this one

if you don't know how to play the ebay game(or buy NOS parts for that matter), stay off of ebay, they dont call it fleabay for nothing

as far as i see, the parts that were ruined were not actually ruined, some 2k+ grit sandpaper and a cup of water would have solved the one problem,

and have you looked at the plastics in a mint garage kept thirdgen? i have seen an iroc with less than 6k miles garage kept its whole life and their were blemishes(not easy to spot but if you look hard you can see them) on the plastics, these things are molded, not magically formed, of coarse they will have flaws in them from the factory

Manic Z

iTrader: (1)

You may have a point, but look at the seller`s demeanor. It`s brutal. I never talk to my customers that way.

The guy even resurrected a two week old thread to continue his bashing of the OP. Like, why bother? Both parties stated their case and points.

I will never buy from this seller.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

this i would assume is the main reason he is trying to defend himself(even coming off as a douche)

he knows TGO is big, and a good chunk of thirdgen owners belong to this site

that's his money walking away, because someone doesn't know how to purchase or the expectation of NOS parts

i agree maybe the seller came on too strong defending himself but you cant blame him for trying to save his rep on TGO

mantaguy

iTrader: (5)

When I buy NOS I expect it to mean what it says,New Old Stock,not New Old S#it.If you read the way the guy explains his products,their better than new.
http://api.viglink.com/api/click?for...13597538242762
Read It!!!

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

I have read his ad's, you guys obviously don't buy from auction sites or auctions themselves very often, you ever see someone try to polish a turd? that's pretty much what people do when they are trying to get top dollar for something

when i hear new old stock, i expect exactly that NEW items that are OLD<<<key word right there,

this isn't NEW NEW STOCK from gm for their 2014 models, this stuff is OLD, older than most members on this board

understand what you are buying before you buy it

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

what else do you expect from NOS items? they are better than New, he isnt selling broken pieces that are still in the package, he is selling INTACT pieces from 20+ years ago, STILL SEALED IN FACTORY PACKAGING, that in itself is amazing

if you aren't willing to put in a little elbow grease to make a part perfect you have no business restoring cars

Restrorob

iTrader: (7)

This guy is doing too much turd polishing...... It's beyond me how he can list "MINT" parts without laying eyes on them.

I bought a NOS part last night, Atleast this seller LOOKED at the part to assure it was in "MINT" shape and added pics with it sitting next to the GM box.....

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

A brand new in sealed package part is as "mint" as you are going to get, it's not the sellers fault that a buyer doesn't know how to clean and prep a part for installation

Manic Z

iTrader: (1)

But it is the seller's fault for calling a product he hasn't even seen as 'mint'. Really, he doesn't know, and shouldn't pretend to know.
Should just state sealed in package.

onthedownlow

iTrader: (4)

Couldn't agree more with that statement.

Restrorob

iTrader: (7)

That's only a guess at best, Perhaps you didn't read my other post.....


As I stated before, Buying NOS parts in sealed boxes is a risk.....

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

I read the post fine, and as I stated this seller didn't sell a broken or even faulty nos part, just an old nos part, if the Buyer isn't prepared to prep and polish an old part before its ready for the car, they shouldn't be buying nos parts, have you ever seen some of the nos parts car restorers buy? Sometimes they buy NOS chrome parts that are MINT with no physical damage, that need to be polished or even re chromed before they can be put on a show car,

It's the nature of the car game, if you aren't prepared to work on it, get out of the game

mantaguy

iTrader: (5)

Restrorob

iTrader: (7)

jas2730

iTrader: (7)

malcom2073

Maybe you and I have different definitions of what "MINT" means. Typically if an item is "MINT" in my mind, it does not need to be re-chromed, repainted, or in any other way restored.

Would you be angry if you bought a Camaro with only 10 miles on it, listed as "MINT" condition, only to find out that it needed a new paint job? "Oh, well it's 25 years old, what do you expect".

Manic Z

iTrader: (1)

That's a pretty good analogy.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

Buying a "mint" car, and a "sealed NOS part" are two totally different things, parts to a car can be refurbished, re painted, or finished and still be considered mint and original

But to answer your question

If I bought a "mint" 10 mile camaro where everything was perfect except it needed a paint job, I would be very happy, it's hard to find a thirdgen that only needs paint and that's it

Manic Z

iTrader: (1)

Sorry man, but i have to disagree with that mentality. We should never have to 'settle' or 'should be happy' because there are few vendors, or few parts or whatever.
If something is advertised as mint, it better be mint. Nevermind 'you shouldn't be restoring cars'. This is business.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

I guess I just dont understand how some plastic packaging stuck to a part makes it not mint

Or how some switch plates had "pitting" and "scratches" were refunded because a buyer doesn't know how to use some sand paper, and doesn't understand that even the smooth plastics in thirdgens were never 100% perfect even from the factory,

The parts he got sound like good quality MINT parts to me but he's still complaining

I guess pictures of the actual items would put a better perspective, but since he hasn't posted pics I can only side with the seller,

The description that the buyer in this case gave of the parts condition sound like how you would receive the parts from a GM parts counter, and like the package says on sealed parts, once it's open you are not returning it to gm, so why should a seller take a hit if GM wouldn't? GM knew when the vac sealed those parts what it would do after a few years, and I'm surprised someone who buys parts wouldn't know what to expect

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

Mint is mint - whether it is a day old or 30 yrs. old. If the part is not mint it should be described as such. Just an example - I bought a Formula hood block off plate and gasket from Jim. I do not remember if the ad described the part as mint or not - it was a while ago. But the block off plate had some scratches, and was not in the greatest of shape despite it being NOS. I only bought it for the gasket so the condition of the block off plate did not bother me so much. A member here was inquiring on the boards where to find a new Formula block off plate. I told him that I had an NOS one I could sell him. I took accurate pics of it, described the condition of the part accurately, and offered it to him at a price we both agreed on. He bought it and was happy with it despite the scratches.
I understand that NOS parts have been sitting around for years. But if the packaging was stuck to them and they were not packaged correctly to begin with the seller bears some responsibility for that. If I had bought them from a dealer and they had that issue I would have demanded a refund despite the little warning on the wrapper. In fact, I would have opened them at the dealership to make sure they were in good shape.

82tarecaro

iTrader: (4)

Here are a few pics. This is after working on them a bit with plastic polish. The material on this is way too soft to use sandpaper. These are applied using a process called liquid doming, and I doubt sandpaper would be kind to them. I had a bit of luck with the polish, but this is the best they will get.
The issue is over the whole face of them in spots but this is the best representation of the issue that I could find in one place. It shows up more when you see it in person.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

My wife makes those kinds of stickers for use with jewelry, very high grit sand paper and some water will clean those up nice, all you are trying to do is remove the layer of plastic stuck to the epoxy, then if needed go back with the plastic polish to shine it up

I guess we should rephrase the first post to say, only buy from this seller if you are in despite need of the item, and expect him to make the product sound 10x better than its true condition(kinda like a car salesman, ya know?)

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

Or even after placed on the car, use some rubbing compound on a polishing wheel, it will literally buff off

chazman

iTrader: (4)

I've read both sides here, and have bought a few items from this seller on ebay without issue.

You know, it is disappointing when you don't get what you expected. The seller does have a lot of neat stuff for sale, and he usually does gets top dollar for his items. If something has a defect, it doesn't necessarily mean you don't want it. You just don't want to pay top dollar for it. When I buy something that says "NOS", my expectation is that it is new. Otherwise, I'd buy a used piece for less and refinish it. The one above looks very salvageable though - but requires expended effort. Something you don't expect to have to do when you pay for NOS.


In the end, the seller and his consigners need to back what they sell. It's just good business practice.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

My wife said sometimes a little rubbing alcohol will clean up epoxy stickers, sometimes the bubble packaging gets stuck and leaves the same residue on her stickers

91 zeee

How it should have gone:

Vendor sells part to customer. Customer gets it and has a problem (yes, 30 years old or not, mint is mint; period)...customer calls vendor. Sends pics and has a discussion. If part is not mint vendor offers a new part, price concession, or refund. Both parties gave up a little (the customer gives up some time and hassle, vendor gives up some money) and everybody feels good about the transaction in the end; they made the best they could out of the situation.

John in RI

iTrader: (167)

That's about as wrong as you could possibly be.

If you took the factory finish off - it's NOT MINT and NOT original. NOTHING that has to be "refurbished, re painted, or finished" can EVER be called "mint and original". If a seller is calling a part in that condition mint rather than calling it "restored" or "restorable" you better be prepared for many very upset customers.

ANYTHING listed as MINT should be perfect, bolt on ready, & as if it just left the "MINT". If your stupid enough to call a part mint when trying to sell it (& trying to get top dollar ??) - that you better be smart enough to stand behind that part when it's found to be defective. Those Recaro Emblems are DEFECTIVE. NOS parts; Sure,... DEFECTIVE NOS parts. Regardless of how any seller might feel about how "mint" the part they are selling is, when the buyer finds something obviously wrong than it's not MINT.

MINT means MINT; PERIOD.

Analogy:
** Try bringing a "perfect" baseball card to a card dealer and tell him the huge gum stain doesn't prevent it from being a MINT card. You'd be lucky if he offers you 50% of "MINT" value for it.



Don't matter how convenient it is to call your suppliers "consignors that prefer not to deal with computers and the general public." People are buying parts based on YOUR descriptions, not your consignors. So; when you call it MINT and it does NOT look like it did when it left the MINT ( and people are bidding/paying for MINT ) you should be prepared for many pissed off customers. How you deal with pissed off customers.............

C-Titan

iTrader: (2)

Wow...

Just Wow...

Hey my car was Purple so I painted it Gray, it's Factory Original and my curbed wheels are Mint...

SMDH

knight72

with

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

Yes because a rewrapped steering wheel and a bubblegum stained baseball card are the same thing, good job there

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

No, your 20+ year old car that has had a factory color repaint, and those curbed wheels that have been turned and polished, being a car in outstanding condition and otherwise original and unmolested would be mint,

As stated parts can be refurbished, seats re upholstered, you name it

I'll go sell the set of black rally's I have, they haven't seen the road since being refinished, I'll call them mint and see who complains even though they have been refinished

mantaguy

iTrader: (5)

What do you work for this Ebay guy!!!!

jas2730

iTrader: (7)

He must! He's the only one sticking up for the seller. Listen if the original poster wanted parts that he had to refurbish he could go to the local bone yard and pick them for 1/10 of the price that douche on eBay is charging. But that's not the case he's looking for untouched MINT pieces which the seller advertised them to be!

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

Just happen to also be a seller, who sticks behind what he sells and has a 100% feedback on every selling site I am on


Re read what was said, from both me and the seller, I agreed this seller comes off as a douche

BUT he also made every transaction right without question, if a customer comes to you with a problem you offer a solution before just handing the money back, it is not the seller fault the buyer didn't say "no I would rather take a refund, or partial refund seeing as the parts are not new in package anymore"

This seller has done everything in his power to make the buyer happy yet this buyer wants to whine and complain on a forum about it

jas2730

iTrader: (7)

I think your the one that needs to read the entire post and tell me again what the seller did to make this right!

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

He offered a solution, the buyer did not escalate and let it go

On the second mentioned transaction the buyer got a full refund because he escalated it and did not accept a seller solution

That's pretty standard and acceptable

jas2730

iTrader: (7)

After the seller refused to take the item back. When seller was informed that he gave a false description of the item he should have given a full refund. No questions asked.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

re read and understand, buyer said "he said the seller wouldnt take them back"

which means "his consignment partner wouldn't take them back"

doesn't mean the actual ebay seller would not give a refund, infact if the buyer escalates through paypal the seller is forced into a refund even if they are being a douche, unless paypal decides the item matches the description(in this case apparently not)

know your rights as a buyer and a seller before doing transactions on an auction site

jas2730

iTrader: (7)

I've read and completely understand. And leave this fictional consignment partner out of it. Even if he does exist he has nothing to do with the transactions between the buyer and seller per eBay rules!

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

kymmee got it right here, everything boils down to the op being pissed off and thats it, so he blasted a good(douchebaggy) seller on a forum for it

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

yes and the buyer has every right to return items and get a refund, but even ebay states buyer is to pay return shipping within 14 days for refund

all standard policy

cIaRmOaCrZo

heard it all. i think the best route to go for ANYBODY, is to NEVER use the term mint,perfect,flawless,ect EVER. people take it too literally, so how about just never use those words or terms. i know i dont. it bit me once when selling a firebird dashpad to guy who drove 2 hours out to get it. it was just a wierd person in my book. but it taught me to never use those words no matter how nice the product is, because it will always never good enough for someone out there.

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

I would agree with you on that

John in RI

iTrader: (167)

You're right - but yet you still completely missed the point.

The Baseball card can still be called ORIGINAL, NOT mint. The Steering Wheel can be called MINT, but not original.


Maybe you did get the point,....... Would you - as a seller - call those rims mint, original (or NOS) parts ?? Would you expect your buyer to have to do any work to these "mint" parts; or are they bolt on ready REFURBISHED parts ? How 'bout if you store them in garbage bags and when the buyer comes to pick them up he pays for them ( based on your pics and description ) without ever opening the bag. When he gets home he pulls them out to find the freshly painted wheel stuck to the bag,.... still "mint" parts ?? Still going to keep his top dollar payment for "mint" parts 'cause they were "mint" when you put them in the bag ??

Chevy would not sell those emblems off the shelf, they would get auctioned off cheap in bulk or discarded as defective. (where do you think many "consignors" get their stuff ?? ). As a seller each part sold should be inspected and if your inspection fails to find defects - or clearly describe those defects -The customer will NOT be happy when they get their stuff particularly when paying top dollar ( as most will when they read "NOS PARTS" )

I clearly understand both sides of the argument, If the return policy is fully described than it should be followed. If not than your S-O-O-L. I also understand that as a seller I would have found - and FULLY DESCRIBED - the fact that the package was stuck to the emblem before shipping it too. Even if it wasn't noticed when sold, it should have been found when it was handled & packaged for shipping.

I'll say it again: "If your stupid enough to call a part mint when trying to sell it (& trying to get top dollar ??) - than you better be smart enough to stand behind that part when it's found to be defective."


BINGO !!

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

i guess we are all in agreements that nobody should use any descriptive words when selling because everybody will find one flaw they are not happy with

Caveman305

iTrader: (8)

i would call them Mint, i would expect the buyer to be competent enough to do any work needed to make them work for them, repaint the rims? No, but make them shine after being in storage, i would hope they would do that without issue, like i said, this buyer was just PO'd that he got banned so he decided to take it to the forums

i would have been more than happy to receive a set of NOS stickers(i wouldn't be surprised if after 30 years the backing has ruined the sticky side) in that condition regardless of price,as i know how to polish epoxy back to new or better, and make a sticker sticky again

i guess I'm just a little less picky when it comes to buying parts

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Using the baseball card analogy.


If you buy a pack of sealed basecball cards, paying the premium price for the fact that they are UNOPENED.

Then YOU open the pack and find the bubblegum stick stuck to a card, whose fault is it?