Spiers

iTrader: (7)

Wow, I found this on High Performance Pontiac's website. Anyone else ever seen anything like it? Not my cup of tea, but I think it's pretty awesome...different....

luvofjah

iTrader: (2)

Bass Wagon

I've seen another pic before too... I'll stick with my notchback

Raf

Klortho

From the GTA source page

The GTA Kammback wagon grew out of a styling exercise by Pontiac; in attempting to gauge the possible public response to a Firebird-based sport wagon, Pontiac was considering a way to broaden the Firebird's customer base. Unfortunately, it was never committed to production due to the increased cost it would add to the GTA's sticker price.


The idea originated in 1978, with the construction of a second-generation Trans Am that made the rounds on the show circuits. That car was later updated with the new-for-1979 styling and eventually was retired to Pontiac's own historical museum. The idea again took flight on a 1985 Trans Am, and then later was transferred to the GTA Kammback wagon. The one example owned by Pontiac still is a regular sight at major car shows around the U.S.

89N10GTA

iTrader: (1)

it's different alright

OneManArmy

iTrader: (1)

Very odd looking but I would love own it.

18inchboyds

it wouldnt be a big deal since all it is , is a hatch glass replacement , not like the 70s version where it was a total metal redo on the back end.

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

I think it's neat. I can see why it went nowhere in the 80s, but with the current popularity of powerful wagons like the Magnum and the Audi S4 Avant, I could see that type of a vehicle finding a niche market.

xgtharo86x

iTrader: (1)

ugly....but differnet i kinda like it

blackbird615

iTrader: (1)

that looks so much like the magnum... jeez. i actually like it, quite a bit.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

They thought about it again with the 4th gens...

If somebody would fab the hatch, I'd get one for my GTA. I like them, like the new Dodge Magnums.

92RS(real slow)

call me crazy but I kinda like it

OkanaganIroc

Intresting. GM has always had a thing for sport wagons it seems, starting with the 1955 Nomad. I've got a camaro book that has GM styling photos of full size 1st and second Generation Camaro wagon Clay models. Both look neat (I like wagons myself) but they weren't considered marketable so the projects weren't carried through.
I do wonder about the aerodynamics of a Third Gen wagon though, there would possibly be a large air void in the back at higher speeds.

MNformula350

iTrader: (2)

Here's apic of one I came across, I also have an old 86 Car Mag with another pic of one I need to scan yet.

Jay

iTrader: (2)

Problem with the 3rd and 4th gens is the floor in the cargo area due to the gas tank location. Would make a wagon back rather useless. Trying to get anything in and out of it would be a pain... there's no tailgate.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Reshape the tank, move it towards the rear, an I bet you could lower the floor to where the bottom of the tank was, and the tank could take up the area, that used to be the rear well. Or just leave the floor height, where it is.

No tailgate, yes. Lower/deeper floor overall, yes. I guess no tail gate could make loading & unloading a bit more of a challenge if it was lower overall, but *I* wouldn't care.

EDIT: Scratch that...You'd have the springs & shocks to deal with, if you lowered the floor.

RITTER

iTrader: (5)

kind of neat, I would drive one.

Spiers

iTrader: (7)

Interesting, I didn't know it was actually a design by GM, I just thought it was a total custom job. Learn something new everyday. Wish I had one!

JeremyNYR

iTrader: (2)

i'd love to see someone get one of those hatches and completely reshape the rear section. Put a gas tank behind the rear axle and build a flat floor in the rear similar to how the C4 vette's floor is behind the seats. It won't be very low, but just leveling it out would make the space much more usable.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

With all this wagon talk, why can I see somebody doing it soon? If not commercially, then personally.

85 T/A WS6

The 85 3rd gen kammback just sold for 66k.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Where? I didn't know there was one for sale? GM never publicly sold a Kammback.

L69norm

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/hist...ack-sells.html

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Ugly as sin compared to a normal TA... but I'd drive that long before I drove a Magnum or Subaru wagon around.

Unfortunately, I have a feeling the hatch area is absolutely useless and you'd have no advantage whatsoever over a hatch. So it's pointless except as a styling exercise, and like I said, I'd take that over hte looks of a normal stationwagon on a looks standpoint, but never over a hatchback thirdgen, so it's just the ultimate in sheer pointlessness, IMO.

Still cool!

badpontiac

either the vice president or the presedent of gm owned one of the 2nd gen wagons he had like four of them made or something like that there was a show on the speed channel about them like a year ago or somethin

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Why would it be useless? It looks like a simple hatch replacement, and increasing the interior volume.

Jessman

I'd sport one, looks different, and in my opinion better than the notchback design.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

There have been VERY few times where I've thought "man, I wish that hatch glass wasnt so low, then I could fit [whatever] in there!". Once was trying to cart around my speaker cabinet (Im a guitarist, and they're big).

Interior space is useful, but I liken this to raising the celing in your house 2 feet. Yeah, it's more interior space, but it's not useful space unless you're carrying around really oddly shaped objects. Im betting they're unable to make the floor in the hatch any lower (For reasons already discussed) and they cant put extra seats in because there are no doors. There would be no way for anyone to sit back there even if the floor WAS lower. So you cant seat more passengers, and you dont really have any more usable cargo space unless you've got somethin that's tall enough to explore the expanded area and not too tall to be able to fit between the floor of the hatch and the roof and it also has to be long enough or wide enough that you cant just scoot it forward.

It's a camaro wagon, not a U-Haul truck, you know? It's just not useful.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

If you wanted deeper floor space, you could always put a new gas tank that fit that rear well space, instead of up higher, effectively lowering the rear floor. Make sense? Then youcould lower the rear floor, increasing the distance to the glass.

Not saying it would be easy, and it would require a lot of custom work, but it could be done, even with the stock rear hatch.

theimpaler68

iTrader: (1)

you see sport wagons EVERYWHERE!!!!!!!!!!!!! and the third gen one i think was the best looking of the ones i saw. i would drive it around... it sure would be a head turner and about the interior... leave it the way it is cause the extra space would be enough. i can think of countless times that a box allllllmmmmooosssttt fit. just not enough with the window. nice find though guys looks great

87CIZ

iTrader: (8)

the red 3rd and 4th those pictures were taken at the trans am nationals ive been the last 8 years but missed one show 4 years back.... but they've always been there. and have definately become more popular since the other sport wagons came onto the market.

Iroctopless

I totally agree.
Others here have compared this Sport Wagon concept to other wagons made today (Magnums, etc). And that this concept might fly today and be very useful. Except for one thing, most of the wagons made today that are practical and useful is because they are 4 doors.

UNCLE TOM

iTrader: (1)

VOLVO had a sport type wagon back in the 60's [ damn i am old ! ] P-1800 , or something like that . sold well in europe and so , so in the U.S. .

Iroctopless

It is an interesting concept. And surprisingly, I find it looks better than what I thought it would.

xlwhellraiser

iTrader: (1)

Thank you, I am reading this thread and I keep thinking, Hey a wagon usually has 4 doors.
Not only is this wagon usless, but its impractical, and how are you going to fit people into the car, even if the floor was modified??? Open the hatch, but there is no tail gate, so people will have to hop into this. Sorry, this is nothing more than a mere afterthought and not such a good one at that.

I would drive a magnum over that one any day. However, I would drive my vert over any magnum or car any day...

BlueZee28

iTrader: (30)

The 4th gen wagon that you attached to your post looks really bad. It looks more like a hearst. The 3rd gen wagon actually looks kind of cool though,

thirdgenSS

iTrader: (1)

looks better than the notchbacks..... IMO

karl's-92'-z28

iTrader: (5)

Im assuming they are jus a bolt on item?

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Yeah, but nobody has ever made any, other than the handful on GM prototypes. I'd be interested in getting one, if the aftermarket made one.

If I had a spare back half of a car to use as a model, I'd try to fab my own.

imaking

iTrader: (2)

well stephen, if you're ever near Vegas I'll give you an IROC you can cut up/fab up

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

And I'd take you up on that. I HAD that 89 GTA shell, but no way to store it At the end of this month, I'm moving, and I'll have all the room I'd need, so I'll keep my eyes open for another shell to use.

I kinda figure, it might be easiest to start with a S10-sized camper, then cut & trim it down from there, instead of 100% fabbing one.

iansane

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't support this idea even with someone else's money but Chevy's nomads were 2 doors and most hatchback style sport compacts are 2 doors (mostly for packaging restraints though). If you're going to the work of smoothing the floor back there by sliding the gas tank back I doubt it'd be difficult to hinge the rear tail section like any truck out there to give it a tailgate. Or even attach the tailights to the hatch/back piece itself so it gives you a lower insert height.

FYRCHKN

I love it!!!

I'm going to try to fab one up this summer....time permitting.

GTAfanatic

iTrader: (3)

there only 1 gta wagon it red and GM owns it
here the pic i have ones the 3rd gen and the 4 gen hurst

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

If you steal my plans, you'll be building 2!
----------


......for now......

89transam*pearl

iTrader: (1)

U.G.L.Y. that car ain't got no alibi, it's ugly !!!

88 350 tpi formula

iTrader: (9)

no worse than a notch back. I thoght those were ugly at first now days I find it kinda neat. I would like one to save weight. the wagons I remeber seen a 88 ver. as well out of a formula and thought it was ugly at the time but now I kinda like it. the rear was more like a wagon though. these just look like modded P/U truck toppers


just think if gm added one of these to the gm dealer accessories they would have sold a few hundred at least. given the product was already made I find it hard to belive the production of such a part would be at a loss

simo

Pontiac built a red and a white one, the white one did not have Recaro's.
The white one was part of the John McMullen Collection.
The car can be seen here along with a Second Gen version wagon and other low mileage Trans Am's and Indy Fiero. His DT500 (Lot 280) with 30 miles went for $26,400.00.

RM Auctions John McMullen Collection

RM Auctions
1985 Pontiac Trans Am Experimental Kammback

LOT: 265
Estimate:
$60,000-$80,000 US
Chassis No. 0000EX4796
Offered Without Reserve
AUCTION RESULTS: Lot was Sold at a price of $66,000

This experimental 1985 Trans Am with its “Kammback” rear section is a genuine former General Motors test platform, equipped with the 190hp 305 cubic inch HO (high output) V8 option and a four-speed manual transmission. From the 36,210 miles on the odometer, it is evident the car was used as a test “mule” for some time before being recruited for special body treatment by GM designers.

The station-wagon-like Kammback concept supposedly originated in Europe and almost made it into production for the 1970 Firebird and Camaro. The squared-off back end actually performs well in wind-tunnel tests, providing functional airflow efficiency for reduced drag, translating into higher speed or better fuel economy at highway speeds. And, had it ever become available to the public, an American Kammback would have been quite distinctive from other cars on the road. While not adopted for 1970, the idea stayed around GM Tech Center design and engineering circles, with a 1979 Trans Am version being crafted as a show car. Twin experimental ‘85 Trans Am Kammbacks are recalled as being featured on a Motor Trend cover.

As designed, it was a slick arrangement, because the squared-off Kammback bolted right on in place of the all-glass hatchback of the production Trans Am, including the latching. Again, the concept failed to advance after 1985 and this particular car was stored at GM for 13 years until local Pontiac dealer and collector John McMullen was able to acquire it. Generally, experimental cars go the crusher when their use is over, but this one, by the good graces of Pontiac, escaped.

The car has been professionally restored in meticulous detail by Scott Tiemann of Supercar Specialities, Portland, Mich. The pure white exterior is graced by dove gray leather interior trim, and even the floor pan bottoms of the undercarriage are painted white. This 1985 Trans Am is judged to be in new-car showroom condition throughout – paint, interior and engine compartment. Because it has an “EX” coded VIN, this Trans Am may not be titled or driven in most states and is being sold here on bill of sale only.
Addendum

Please note that this vehicle is sold on a Bill of Sale only.

smokefan

i kind of like the look of it.

karl's-92'-z28

iTrader: (5)

I wanna see 1 on a 3rd gen camaro, just to see what it looks like.

We'reNotWorthy

I kinda like the Thirdgen one. I would get rid of the side windows though.