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Hello all, longtime lurker first time poster. I've recently come across a 1988 GTA for sale locally, and have a few questions for the experts. It looked good from the road but when I went to examine it, a few items seem inconsistent. I want to know if its fake. Long read ahead...
It started up in the bitter cold on the third try after sitting for who knows how long. Idle was a touch uneven, but it sounds beast. No issues there.
First, the body. Overall its nice, but the doors were misaligned, and the rear hatch hangs over the fenders by at least half an inch. Yet carfax states it was never hit. Was the initial build quality really that shoddy? The rubstrips on the doors are missing, and the GTA badges are not in the correct spots, they are off by an inch or so, leading me to believe the car had an el cheapo paint job at some point.
Next, the mileage and interior don't add up. Seller states 64,000 miles but the interior is thrashed. Im thinking it might have been rolled back. Console is split, inside handles are cracked, all weather stripping is shot, trim pieces are falling off, print worn off buttons, etc. Yet the dash isn't cracked and the seats aren't completely worn through. Seats are cloth, should they be leather for a GTA?
The steering column has some up/down play, the power locks work but don't catch, but the windows and mirrors work.
The gauges are standard analog, but the wheel looks like '82-'84 style, no duplicate radio controls.
The headlights work, the gas struts hold both the hood and hatch up w/o issue, and I didn't notice any leaks.
Thank you for reading, I want the car but don't want to buy an unrepairable money pit, esp if fakery is involved. I can tinker, but have no real mechanical experience. Big work would have to be done by a shop.
It looks pretty nice to me. The wheels are correct. The GTA could come with cloth. The console splitting like that is very common. I have had several cars where the hatch doesn't seem to line up the right way for some reason. If it doesn't feel like the car you think it should be, especially for that money, pass. If you think you can handle the small things and replace them as you go pick it up. Good luck!
Trashed weatherstripping sounds suspicious for a car with 64K on it. Have a closer look at the brake pedal, gas pedal and that general area. If not in average condition then use that as another clue. there are easy 64K miles and there are hard 64K miles. Its possible its just been thru some hard miles. I don't like the fact the hatch is hanging an entire inch. That sounds like someone didn't put it back together correctly. Looks like the spoiler was replaced from what I can see in photos. The interior didn't look too bad, but hard to see from those photos. Take a closer look under the car, it appears the car has been repainted. look for over spray under and also in door jams. If you look close you may see a change in color. this will tell you how good the repaint was. For the money they are asking, they should allow you to pop off the panels in the trunk area, they come off easy. That will give you some more exposure to what is really going on with that car. The spare tire should be accessible and give you a few clues. I'll post a few photos of my 90 so you can see what an original car looks like back there.
Not a bad car but not worth asking price IMO. If you can get at least 1000 off to cover the cost of new weatherstripping all around, new console parts, carpet, and whatever other minor issues are wrong it would be worth it. It does look like an original 64k car to me though. Console splitting is common, the misaligned hatch is very common on almost every third gen I've ever seen. How do the doors close? If they shut like new with no sag that's a good indication of low miles or easy use.
The car actually looks like it's in very good shape, based on the photos, anyway. It looks like a real GTA to me. When people make clones of these cars, they fail to replace two badges that most people overlook on the '87 - '90 models. On Trans Ams, the 'PONTIAC' badge on the left headlight and the screaming chicken on the filler panel between the tail lights are silver in color. On GTAs, those badges are gold.
The steering wheel from that car is from an '87 model. There's a possibility that particular car was ordered without the stereo that came with the redundant stereo controls on the steering wheel. This is the plain steering wheel that might have originally been in that car:
On the other hand, the car could have came with the steering wheel with the redundant stereo controls and the previous owner swapped it after the aftermarket stereo was put in. If the car looks and runs sound, try talking the price down $1,000 or $500.
definitely resprayed at some point, the vents on the hood give it away as well as the vibrant color in the paint. that would explain the misaligned badges. center console looks like it was taken off and put back in due to how it aligns. possibly a new carpet? cant really tell from the pictures. I would talk him down due to the weather stripping for sure, the kits for these cars don't come too cheap by my standards. see if he can send you a pic of the RPO codes and then search each code up on this site to see what they are and see if the car actually has that feature.
with the mileage rolling back at 100,000 you are taking a risk if its actually 60,000 or 160,000, take a good hard look underneath and judge if it has 160,000 miles of wear underneath or 60,000 miles of wear. I would love to know why GM decided to have the odometer rolling back at 100,000, it makes zero sense to me.
All in all that car does look solid, if you could get $1000 off that would be amazing due to its condition.
with the mileage rolling back at 100,000 you are taking a risk if its actually 60,000 or 160,000, take a good hard look underneath and judge if it has 160,000 miles of wear underneath or 60,000 miles of wear. I would love to know why GM decided to have the odometer rolling back at 100,000, it makes zero sense to me.
All in all that car does look solid, if you could get $1000 off that would be amazing due to its condition.
In 85 or 86' the odometer changed to 7 digit readings. If that is the original cluster and it was never disconnected then it is likely a 60k+ car. As someone said, if it was a hard 60k it could look like a 160k car or worse.
Last edited by CharcoalBird; Jan 25, 2016 at 07:03 AM.
Also, that mileage indicator rolls over and starts at 0 after 100,000 miles.
That's why you need to look for some of the things mentioned above when someone says " its only got ''''''' miles on it".
are you sure? that just doesn't seem right. you're saying that the 100K value ticker only has a zero and a one, and that car's odometer can never read "200,000?" not saying you're wrong, just seeking clarification because that seems a bit daft.
Thank you all very much for your detailed and very helpful replies. I knew I came to the right place.
I'm still struggling a bit with this one. I have the angel and devil on my shoulders playing tug of war with my wallet.
I agree that it was resprayed, and most likely has 164K based on all the wear. I forgot to mention the guy said it had 5 owners across two states. No way its only 64K. Certainly not worth $8,000. I'm just excited because its the only one I've ever seen for sale locally with the options I'm after. But after looking closely and doing research, I can't shake the disturbance in the Force I'm getting from it. I think I am going to pass on this one and keep looking.
It may be a 64k car, but it wasn't babied no where near my 69,000 mile car! Looks like an inexpensive body shop repainted it and didn't care where the badges were to go. I'd be interested to look underneath the car - that would tell a LOT.
IMO, not worth the asking price. You can find a better car. Listen to your doubts. And not all accidents show up in Carfax.
That's the interior of a babied car : no dash cracks, no upholstery stains or tears, console like new - no splitting (and no paint wear by the gear selector like that car has).
Last edited by MintWS6FORMULA; Jan 26, 2016 at 07:01 PM.
It may be a 64k car, but it wasn't babied no where near my 69,000 mile car! Looks like an inexpensive body shop repainted it and didn't care where the badges were to go. I'd be interested to look underneath the car - that would tell a LOT.
IMO, not worth the asking price. You can find a better car. Listen to your doubts. And not all accidents show up in Carfax.
That's the interior of a babied car : no dash cracks, no upholstery stains or tears, console like new - no splitting (and no paint wear by the gear selector like that car has).
You're quite correct in your assessment...as tempted as I was, I managed to kick the devil off my shoulder and give this car a pass. I'd be buying a headache far beyond my capabilities of dealing with. It's obvious it's been through a lot and hasn't been properly cared for, clean Carfax or not. I'd end up pouring thousands into a frame-off restoration, or at the very least completely gutting that rotten interior. The bums selling this one didn't even bother to clean it! I need to look for one in better shape due to my own admitted lack of mechanical aptitude, not to mention lack of time.
The hunt continues, I'll find my white whale some day. In the meantime, I will return to lurking and admiring everyone else's fine rides here. Thanks again for offering this stranger your guidance everyone.
All too often we get emotionally involved with cars and end up paying more for them and then more to fix them than is realistic. The difference between a crap car and a spectacular one is still small these days with third gens. Buy the absolute best one you can for the money before they go up.
Here's your benchmark, personally, the red car is asking too much $, by the time you got it into decent condition, you'd have spent what you would on this one:
Here's your benchmark, personally, the red car is asking too much $, by the time you got it into decent condition, you'd have spent what you would on this one:
That '87 is fantastic. That's the kind of car I'd like to find someday. Not the POS in my original post hehe. And I agree it is underpriced based on pics. If I was on that coast I'd be on my way to the bank instead of typing!
but love this car. 