I picked up this 89 Firebird around a week ago, and it's got a little rust in the rear wheel area.

I've done almost no body work, and I don't have a tonne of money. What would be the best way to fix this? Fibreglass? Sheet metal (I do have a 220V mig welder)? Or are we looking at whole new panels?

 

best way? cut it all out and weld in patch panels. Not something to try without some good bodywork experience, of you can make things worse and warp the panels to hell.

quick easy dirty, grind all the loose crap out, seal the rust, 'glass over, sand, fill, smooth,and paint. Its a hackjob at best, but with some paint will look presentable. This can, however, trap moisture and create more rust later down the road.

or dont touch it and leave it be. what are the plans for the car? keeper, DD/beater untill it blows up? longterm project car?

looks pretty bad. whats the underside of the car look like? how bout the spare tire well in the trunk, passengerside

 

The car is currently going to be a winter beater. I haven't looked under the carpet, or car itself yet. I don't have a good feeling though, as when I climbed in the rear passenger seat to change the rear shock, I could feel and hear the floor bend under my weight.

 

Ignoring a problem won't make it go away.

Thats a safety hazard and needs to be fixed.

 

Replacing a quarter panel is probably the toughest body panel to do on these cars and that's a compound curve right there at the wheel arch where it goes around the circular wheel opening but also flares out so making a patch could be tricky as well.

It doesn't look like yours is too bad YET. Unfortunately, there's a good chance at this point that you have rust inside the panel and that area is likely to be tough to get at. I would sand it down to bare metal and eliminate the rust now before it becomes a bigger issue. Hit it with some etching primer and coat it with some paint even if it's just temporary until you can afford a paint job. Otherwise you're going to get into a bigger problem later. Also, it would be a PITA, but I'd gut the interior back there and see if I could get behind the panel and look for rust.

As far as the floor goes... You need to get under there and see how bad it is. Floors are a structural part on a unibody car. A few holes here and there won't hurt anything, but if you start getting major parts of the floor out you're going to see body flex.

The only way to get rid of rust is to remove it. Either by sanding or cutting it out.

And no, fiberglass is not the correct way to repair anything on these cars. AFAIK there are no fiberglass parts on them from the factory except _maybe_ some of the headlight bars on the camaros. I'm not sure what they're made of. Could just be plastic.

Metal should be repaired with metal.

Mathius

 

Looks like what i'd consider a 'parts' car. But it can be fixed.

I'd consider other options before fixing it. I've seen some pretty clean straight thirdgens on craigslist lately for about what it cost in time and materials to fix that.. We're not talking low mile mint Z28s and firehawks, but just straight clean TBI cars. Given the choice, I'd take a straight clean car and 'bolt on' my options, over something that needs a lot of rot repair.

http://worcester.craigslist.org/cto/1913782477.html
http://providence.craigslist.org/cto/1909850507.html
http://nh.craigslist.org/ctd/1893592976.html

Any one of those birds under 1k with clean (appears) bodies.

-- Joe

 

The side GFX on camaros are made of fiberglass.

 

It sounds like sanding, priming, and some paint might be the best solution for the time being. I'll make sure to avoid fiberglass with this car.

I plan on crawling under the car sometime this week to see how it looks underneath.

Sadly, I'm in Canada. There's not a lot of choices for cheap cars that are in great shape and affordable where I am. Even within a 4 hour driving distance from where I am, there's not much. If possible, I'd like to make this one safely drivable for the winter.

 

That first ad with the keychain is priceless!! Instead, next time take pics of the engine and interior!

 

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure those are plastic. The ones on my '92 sure didn't seem to have the rigidity I'm used to associating with fiberglass.

Mathius

 

Well, one of mine is broken, and there are fiberglass shards where it sheared. The front chin/rear bumper arent, just the sides, and rear smaller pieces.

 

Actually I believe the lower door mouldings are SMC. Doesn't contain any glass or polyester resin. The stringy stuff is actually plastic. Sure looks and feels like fiberglass though. Stuff has been used for years in a lot of cars.

 

That's what it looks like to me. As long as you don't have any holes, or areas thin enough where you're going to get a hole, there's no reason to worry about replacing metal yet. You need to take care of it before it gets to that point. Even small holes can be welded closed without doing any major panel replacement or even major patching.

Mathius

 

Honestly, the best thing to do here is nothing. No doubt, the car has other hidden rot, as you already suspect. Upon digging into this thing, you will need outer wheelhouses as well as quarter panels, just for starters. If the rest of the structure has rust like that, and it probably does, you will have major surgery on your hands that will have no end. Frankly, the car needs pro attention to do a proper repair, and it is not worth the $ to do so. Do not screw with trying to patch the quarters you have already. Right now, you have two rotten quarters with obvious rust. Throwing fiberglass, bondo, etc. into the mix gives you two rotten quarters with obvious rust damage, plus a few hundred dollars in wasted materials, plus hours of wasted time--all covered in the spray can primer of your choice. Neither choice is worth a damn, but you are dollars and time ahead of the game by just leaving it alone. Get another car and use this one as parts car, or just keep winter driving it until it breaks in half or you just junk it. Rudy.

 

Dude. Get a life. You don't just trash a car just because you get a little rust, and you certainly don't do it just by ASSUMING the rust is worse than it appears. And you SURE as hell don't fix a car with bondo. Bondo is used as a skim coat only when used properly. Steel is repaired with steel.

Grow some ***** and pick up a welder and learn something.

We've seen countless threads here on cars that were way worse and saved.

Mathius

 

Hey, Mathius, I hear you. You are entitled to an opinion, just like everyone else. My ***** and I have been around the auto business a LONG time, and I am just calling it like we see it. If YOU believe that this car only has the rust you see in the photos, then good for you, but I am very confident that the rust is far more entrenched than you think. I have had (and still own) several rusty cars. My 72 GS 455 has just a few minor blisters on the wheel lips, but it has rotten inner and outer wheelhouses, as well as trunk floor, too. I know EXACTLY what kind of work it takes to fix something like this. I am not in any way a smart man, but I see cars like this Firebird and my IROC stacked 4 high in local salvage yards with clean, rust free bodies all the time--most towed from a back yard or lawn as owners give up on them. These just need MECHANICAL work, and are still junked for $50 or $100 a pop. I am just offering MY opinion to a fellow 3rd gen owner that this car is better left alone and driven as it is, rather than tying up extra money and time that really won't generate a better car for the owner. Rudy.

 

How many rust free third generation f-bodies do you think he's going to find for $50-$100 a pop in British Columbia?

Regardless, people like you are the reason you can't find any mid 70's cars anymore. They've all been crushed unless they were corvettes, mustangs, camaros, etc. Having "saved" my '76 Malibu from a field in NY, I can happily say it was worth the meager $850 I paid for it with 39k original miles. If I'd have taken your advice and junked it, I wouldn't have near the satisfaction I have with it now.

I see typical rust coming up from underneath the paint, possibly from a bad sealing job. He's not going to know how bad it is until he hits it with a sanding pad. Scrapping the car without peeling the paint to see what you've got is the epitome of ignorance.

Rajin: Don't listen to this crap. See what you've got. One of my biggest regrets is getting rid of my '92 because I didn't think I could put the work into it. I miss that car. 4 welding certs and 8 years experience later and I think I could have done something special with it.

Mathius

 

Hey, Mathius, my ignorant *** just told you that I HAVE a 72 BUICK in my garage that I am working on. I am the guy stopping it from going to the scrap yard. You can't get too much more non sporting than an old Skylark, my friend, so don't blame me if you can't find old iron out there. As far as salvage cars for low $'s in scrap yards, I hope he can find something he can use, because he will need to cut good quarters from somewhere. He states that he has little experience in paint and body, so I don't think he has an English wheel or anything else to fab up body panels from scratch to fix this thing. Once again, I am not trying to ruin his day. I am just saying that there are better cars to work with given a tight budget and limited skills. Nothing more, nothing less. Rudy.

 

As one old timer to another I have to agree with you. Having been there many times I can see in my mind whats he's going to find when he starts poking around that car. And as a trained autobody professional it's the breaking in half part that really worries me. Rusty cars don't hold up well in accidents. And as much as I hate to see another one go ... sometimes it's best.

 

Again, your statement is completely ignorant. You're talking about him needing to cut out replacement quarter panels without even knowing the extent of the damage.

And as far as his experience goes, everyone has to start somewhere and an english wheel is a luxury, not a necessity.

Mathius

 

Looks like there is already a couple inches of the right quarter missing in front of the wheel.

 

Not enough to warrant replacing a quarter panel, or even a large patch section.

Mathius

 

If you do replace with a quarter skin use panel bond, dont waste your time or take the risk of warping the metal. Panel bonding has been around for quite sometime now and is how some factory repair manuals say to use when replacing panels.

Take a look at 3M panel bond. I used it when I replaced the passanger side quarter on my car.