I have come to find Pontiac had 1984 Firebird done factory, but then some where done by a company called C&C!

Apparently there is enough difference between the way they both cut it that I cant just buy any friggin seal on Ebay for it!

PLEASE someone explain throughly how to figire this out!\

Someone did say that reg Ts were 31.5 inches and the C&C was 28....but from what point to what point? I cant find pics anywhere online on where exactly these are being mesaured from!

Really driving me crazy, im going to a body shop today so they can look at it, I dont see seals having any issues, the interior part is bone dry, yet it seems like the Tbar in the middle has a hole on both sides in the exact same spot, which really makes no sence!

PLEASE someone tell me they got a pic on how to tell because I need to get it fixed im facing huge storms for the next 7 days and I gotta wear ties so I cant afford to destroy my cloths and car lol

thanks

Greg

 

factory tops have pins, C&C tops have hooks

 

The 31.5" is approximate and measured down the middle at the T-Bar. I read this measure and just took a tape measure to mine and that was the only outside measure that was close. I am not sure but I think I read somewhere that the corners of the C&C are more rounded. Most T-Tops are not C&C from what I have seen. Hope this helps some.

 

Okay, pins and hooks.....where? LOL I have no idea what that means, I took off the tops last night (first time no friggin rain) and say...nothing that looked like hooks or pins.

Where would these pins or hooks be?

Also would it be safer to just seal the Ts down? I dont give a crap to take them off I just dont want water all over my interior lol its really beginning to **** me off.

 

Well the only place im finding these seals cheap is Ebay, this is a quote from one of the listings on how to measure, I just read it and dont understand still where I start and end lol


" determine which top style you have, remove one of the tops and measure the side the tucks into the center support section of the roof. Factory, or Fisher, tops will be 30 1/4" while the C&C tops will only be 28" long. AM Auto does NOT stock or carry the replacement C&C weatherstripping."

wtf is a tuck? the part in the center where the glass sits underneath it? Okay, so measure from there to where? Or is it saying from the left of the tuck to the right? Neither brings a meserment near enough to either to make me think one way or the other.

I wrote the seller but never got a friggin reply! If they want to sell a $379 item you would think they would want to answer.

 

you want to measure the t-top side that tucks underneath the actual t bar. if you're still unsure, shoot some photos of the latch/locking side, we can definitely help ya there

 

The pins are in the tops themselves, at the outer edge, each corner. There are holes in the car that they slide into.

Those holes can be adjusted - maybe you just need an adjustment to stop the leaking. Remove the screws that hold the top of the A-pillar and B-pillar plastic trim, and carefullly pull down on that trim, you'll see the little bolt heads around the holes that can be loosened and adjusted so that the top gets secured to the car tighter/better.

 

Actually that is incorrect. Factory T-top 83 cars I know had a "hook" type T-tops. My car originally had "hook" type T-tops in it, but they were stolen and regular "pin" style T-tops replaced them. They fit the same, you just have to get all the newer style brackets.

The best way to figure it out is measurement.

Leaking T-top seals can be a pain to fix. I have a thread in the history section that covers my journey into leaking T-tops. I am still have to put the weather stripping in. Just replaced a bunch of sheet metal.

 

Okay, big A$$ waste of time, moron that was supposed to meet me at shop A was at shop C 30 miles from shop A! So wasted my whole lunch for nothing at all and nothing got solved, one of the techs there checked the seals and said same as I did, they really dont look bad.

I tried to take pics but this crap *** 3mp looks like garbage I cant make out what I just snapped 30 seconds prior.

These are not hooks, when you turn the lever on the tops a solid thick bolt goes in and out.

I dont care to have TTops anymore, someone tell me the way to seal this POS so I can stop having rain all over, I dont even open them to care if they are sealed or not. And at this point the next few weeks of serious rain has been wanting to sell this car and let it be someone elses prob, hell ide trade down to a hardtop so I have less issues.

If someone could, please tell me in great detail lol how to seal my tops so they never leak again! Even if it means they will never open again, didnt want to go this rout but im dead outta time.

Hell, if anyone lives in Tampa, FL and would take a look even better, if you know how to fix give me a price and we could go from there.

thanks

greg

 

Okay, just spoke with the guy that was supposed to be there to meet me to check out my Ts, his son was massivly sick and went to pick up meds, so now im the A$$ lol so on his behalf I opologize!

He said that (what someone said earlier) that though my seals look perfect they could be pushed down from weight over all th eyears, said to tighten them down and see, of course ive never owned Ts before so I really dont know how lol

If someone could give me a rundown and when I go out for my last break ill adjust the crap out them.

 

From post 7:

Relax man - it's just water - it dries. In another month you'll be begging for rain!

Also, you have the most popular t-top type (the pin tops), so there are alot of replacements available, and weatherstripping is abundant.

Hell, might not even be the t-tops that leak, these cars can leak in alot of places. The rear hatch is another spot that can leak alot of water.

Might not be a top issue at all - maybe your windows need adjusted inwards to seal better with the t-top.

If you don't want a T-top car, why did you buy one? If you still don't want a T-top car, then get rid of it and get a hardtop car.

But I can tell you my 1990 hardtop leaked alot more than my 1992 T-top car ever has - because of the window alignment and rear hatch.

Biggest thing is chill - this is life, roll with it - having a stroke before you reach 40 won't stop the rain.

 

my cars n concepts have pins perhaps they made both pins and hooked type. and dont say im wrong i had to track down the last surviving vendor that bought out the remainder of the C&C t-tops parts and bought new old stock to replace everything on my car. exact same parts but brand new.

but just saying my car is C&C and has pins on my 1987 camaro

 

Here is a link. I bought a GM T-Top leak manual and scanned it. Another member here is hosting the PDF. It is real straight forward and should help.

http://www.kt-s.net/media/T-Top%20Wa...k%20Manual.pdf

Hope it helps.

 

here is my experience from t-tops leaking (cuz im now the nj KING of leaking t-tops with how much ive dealt with these lol)

#1. Easy fix, corners: adjust them by use of the screw in the corner of the windows

#2. Harder to fix, Center bar: First time i dealt with this issue, i was dumb and young lol, so i took a can of expanding foam and pumped it all through my A pillar and B pillars (atleast my car is insulated lol) but it kept leaking, after pulling apart my seals in dispair i found that the silicone for the center bar had been defeated by old age. after regluing it down and adjusting the seals, it didnt leak.........for a while lol

#3. Hardest yet, Center bar....again: now that im repainting parts of my car i went over the whole thing tooth and nail and found a paint chip on the roof....poked at it and it was rust. figured i had to repaint the roof might as well do it right and take off the seals and there on the corner no the roof and the "gutter" of the seals i found a dime sized rust hole. and then another. welded them up and hopefully that'll fix my issue (yes it started leaking through the center again prior to this fix)....the car has yet to be painted and taken outside so i couldnt tell ya if its been fixed yet or not. but so far this is the most time consuming and difficult fix for the seals yet.


GOOD LUCK!!!

 

The answer is simple, but nobody ever wants to do a proper fix.

If your T-Tops are leaking, buy new weatherstripping. Eat the cost, because that's the right way to do it.

You need to determine if they are C&C or factory tops though, by measuring the edge that tucks into the T-Top bar--the edge opposite the side with the locking mechanism/etc, 31.25" and they are factory T-Tops. Otherwise they are C&C.

If they are C&C, you will have trouble finding good seals. If they are factory T-Tops, GM weatherstripping is still available.

Don't seal them down to the car with caulk or whatever, it'll just be another piece of **** thirdgen running around town if you start going down that repair road like so many others have.

Fix it right, get new seals.

 

agreed...i almost threw my hands up and gave up a couple times but it should be perfectly fine now. as for the seals, yeah the cost sucked for them but it was worth it to keep water off my 4th gen interior lol

 

If your t-tops are locking & use the door key to unlock they are factory units.
Locking, but use a differnt key! aftermarket, most were C&C.

If the header bar (between windshield/t-tops) is about 2in wide, factory.
About 4in wide.....C&C.

If your visors are narrow (bout 3in wide), factory t-tops.
Wider (actually hard top visors), C&C.

If your door jambs have that little wedge thingy, factory
No wedge, C&C. (this has exceptions, so no quoting).

Most C&C tops have/had a little C&C logo on the outer Rr corner.
Some C&Cs pop open to vent.
There are no C&C seals (new) available currently.
C&C/OEM parts are not interchangeable.This includes seals, headliners, plastic trim.

 

Holy sh-t... a post about C&C tops went this far ?