i'm getting ready to paint my firebird ( you may have seen my previous thread) and the guy i bought it from decided he didn't like the way it looked because he put different colored ground effects on it. well, he used spray can primer to do the whole car. he wet sanded the existing paint, washed and degreased the whole car first. my question is will the primer i spray on stick to the stuff thats on there? i really don't want to sand it all off and go to the underlying paint. if the stuff thats on there now is adhered well to the factory paint, can i just go ahead and put the new stuff over top? thanx.

 

NOT what you want to hear, BUT I would take it all off. Your primer should be compatable with the paint you're going to use. How do you know how well that primer is adhered to the original paint? I wouldn't take the chance. That can primer will sand off real easy. Get some 400 grit wet paper and go to town. Your new paint job will only look as good as your prep work. Use a block to sand with and sand in the longest strokes you can, and the overlap those strokes. You don't need primer as long as the base is sanded well and sealed. What kind of paint are you going to use? If it's base/clear, then your sanding is just begun. Good luck.

 

I second that motion. take the time to sand the spray can primer off. It can counter act with what ever brand of paint you are using. Im assuming you are going base/clear . The spray can primer could cause fish eye, cracks in the paint or could cause a lot of orange peel. I use to work in a auto supply store mixing and selling paint so I ran across this often. Most of the spray can primer you find will be laquer based primer. stay away from them.

A little tip on the bumper covers. use a adhesive promotor, and the paint will stick better. I always liked to use ureathane primer and sealer on my cars.



hope this helps

P.S. You are going to do a lot of sanding to turn out a slick ride
but it will be worth it when you see the results.

Good luck

 

cool. that helps alot. now onto the base/clear coat. after i get all of the rattle-can primer off, i need to wash all the dust off and let it dry. then shoot a coat ( or 2?) of a good primer. after that's cured, wet sand it, wash and dry again, then shoot the base coat? how many coats of paint do i need to put on and if i am correct, i need to wetsand in between coats, right? after the base coats are applied, its time for the clear coat. how much should be applied and do i need to sand between coats as well? one last thing. i understand it needs to be buffed out after the clear coat in order to get the shine. how long should i wait to do this and how do i do it. Thank you guys ALOT for all the help. this is my first time doing anything like this.

 

First how many coats of paint are on there right now? If its been painted before you may run into problems I'd take all the primer off etc. If there is a dent or any imperfections fix them and see how many coats of paint there are on the car. If its two I'd take a DA with 220 and remove the top base clear or single stage. If there is too much paint thikness I think 22 mills is the max or something like that call a body shop for verification you may get checking which will make all this time useless and you'll waste money fixing something that you should check. I'd take 220 wet to cut the rattle can primer off (220 fills easily with any good primer). Two good coats of primer maybe three. Then use 400 and the paint will adhere nicely and you won't see scartches. Get some solvent to wash off the residue such as prep sol. Get 1 gallon of paint and additives that you need and you'll you'll have extra. Just make sure that you get good coverage. You don't have to wet sand inbetween coats wait till the first coat is palm slick and apply another till coverage is reached. You can wet sand the color but if you spray clear within 12-16 hrs the clear will chemically bite into the new paint. If it is metalic I wouldn't color sand you may end up with hallows. Clear should have 3 to 4 good coats 2 is enough though. Another thing is base clear the base doesn't have to be applied real wet. The clear is what makes it shiny the base will look dull but its suppose to. Wet sand with 1000 then 1500 and buff the longer you wait the harder it is to sand. Talk to the supply store to see what type of catalyst that you can get depending on the heat ange your in that will determine tha ammount of time to wait for wetsanding clear (usually 24 hrs is enough @70 F) but the shop should be able to get you the catalyst that will make it dry appropriatly. Good luck if you have any ? E-mail me if you want.

 

First how many coats of paint are on there right now? If its been painted before you may run into problems I'd take all the primer off etc. If there is a dent or any imperfections fix them and see how many coats of paint there are on the car. If its two I'd take a DA with 220 and remove the top base clear or single stage. If there is too much paint thikness I think 22 mills is the max or something like that call a body shop for verification you may get checking which will make all this time useless and you'll waste money fixing something that you should check. I'd take 220 wet to cut the rattle can primer off (220 fills easily with any good primer). Two good coats of primer maybe three. Then use 400 and the paint will adhere nicely and you won't see scartches. Get some solvent to wash off the residue such as prep sol. Get 1 gallon of paint and additives that you need and you'll you'll have extra. Just make sure that you get good coverage. You don't have to wet sand inbetween coats wait till the first coat is palm slick and apply another till coverage is reached. You can wet sand the color but if you spray clear within 12-16 hrs the clear will chemically bite into the new paint. If it is metalic I wouldn't color sand you may end up with hallows. Clear should have 3 to 4 good coats 2 is enough though. Another thing is base clear the base doesn't have to be applied real wet. The clear is what makes it shiny the base will look dull but its suppose to. Wet sand with 1000 then 1500 and buff the longer you wait the harder it is to sand. Talk to the supply store to see what type of catalyst that you can get depending on the heat ange your in that will determine tha ammount of time to wait for wetsanding clear (usually 24 hrs is enough @70 F). Good luck if you have any ? E-mail me if you want.

 

well, i got started on the project last night. all the crappy rattle can primer came off no problem. I'm going to pick up the primer tomorrow and go ahead and shoot a coat or two then. habe you got any tips or tricks on masking off the body?also,will the primer need to be thinned out and about how much will it take to get a good coat on the car. thanx again

 

There's some more ? that need addressed. Is the paint on the car now original? Rust? Dents? What kind of paint are you going to use now? I use ppg and you don't have to primer, if the orininal paint was still covering good. Just sand untill smooth, shoot a sealer, and shoot the color. Clean with your brand of cleaner[ for the paint you're going to use] and shoot the clear. Everybodys shoots paint differant, I shoot pretty wet, make sure to let it flash like the directions say, and shoot your 2nd coat. I start out sanding the roughest spots with 600, then 1000, then 2000. Polish, any spots that need can be sanded again. I've found that when applying more clear,it needs sanded with 400, otherwise it may adhere real good. Ask your supplier for the instruction sheets for the paint you're going to use.

 

yes. i'm down to the factory white paint. no rust, no dings, no nothing. perfectly straight body. i will probably be using DuPont because thats what my shop carries. the existing paint seems to be adhered really well. no flaking or peeling.

 

Then I'd just sand it with 360 / 400 grit wet paper. I use a little dish soap when sanding, then wash it, clean it with your cleaner and seal. The more paint and primer you put on the deeper your chips and scratches will be. I also removed all gfx and bumpers when I did mine. Use a flex agent on your bumpers even if it don't call for it. Cracked bumpers later will be a mess. Good luck!

 

make sure you use a wax and grease remover like "prep sol" like 82 trans man said before you spray the primer or sealer. It will help reduce the chances of fish Eyes. If the body is straight. A coat of or two of primer shouldnt hurt if it has factory paint. But check the mills " thickness" any way. but it is good advice to spray sealer before you paint. about 2 to 3 coats of color and 3 to 4 coats of clear. you can use 600 to sand before you paint for a slick surface. but if you are inexperienced at painting you will proably run the clear so use 400.

by using the sealer after the 400 grit. it will cut down on sand scratches.

On the buffing. If you can lay the clear down wet enough without running it and with not alot of orange peel or dirt you can get away without buffing it. makes for a shiny clear.

but in most cases you will have to buff.



P.S. if you get dirt in the color coat you can sand it out before you clear. but remember that the more sanding you do after you start spraying the more dust that will be in the air. Make sure you use a tack rag before the sealer , before the color, and before the clear. and remember that finger prints will show up if you touch the car before you spray color or clear.

good luck!!!!

didnt mean to be so long but this is a big step!

 

hey, thanx for the info. will it make a cosmetic difference if i use the 400 or 600 grit before the clear? what your saying is to add a coat of sealer before i shoot the first color? thanks alot for all your info. it's really helping alot

 

proper bodyshop painting is ...

3 base coats
and
2 clear coats

no sanding inbetween

and only primer if your at bare metal...

and if you have primer than you should dp it before a base coat...

 

You should use the 400 to wet sand the factory paint. The 600 will show less sand marks but will make it eazy for the paint and clear to run.

then spray the DP sealer "made by ppg" but you can get a different brand. You said that you may use dupont, choose a sealer that works with the brand paint you are going to use.

Ask the guy that mixed your paint about a white sealer. If the paint chips then you will show white and not gray or black.

This white sealer will give you better coverage when you spray the color.

As for the clear, I bought a gallon of clear, a gallon of reducer, and a quart of hardner.

I mixed it up a cup "the cup on the spray gun" at a time, I ended up with about 3 good coats of clear.

The reason for 3 coats of clear is that by the time you sand and buff the car you will have gone throug about 1 coat leaving a good 2 coat coverage.


Good luck!!

 

well, i got the primer on yesterday. took two coats to get good coverage. all the sanding scratches are gone, and the drips from the first coat ( b/c it was my first time shooting anything!) were covered up by the second. i think i'll wait till early spring when the weather gets nice until i get some color on there. i'm still not sure what color i want. i'm thinking a metallic silver, sort of a metallic dark red, or bright red. everyone has a red or black firebird though. i want something different. any ideas would be appreciated, and pics are even better, so if you have 'em, let me see 'em. but i'll start another thread for that. thanx alot guys

tony

 

no not really, if you put two good coats on thats all you need...

 

Two coats would be fine if he had experience painting and buffing.

But he said he was new to this, and If he has not buffed alot I would like to have a piece of mind with the extra coat of clear.

It is possable to sand then buff and end up through the clear!!!
Im not an expert but I have seen guys make a mistake when they are new to paint work, and this can be one of them.

Like I said 3 coats of clear for a piece of mind.

My car has Two gallon of mixed clear inside and out, I had to jam it out because of changing from red to blue. The paint is 6 year old and looks as good now as it did when it rolled out of the paint booth. And has never been waxed.

Good clear makes a difference! I used PPG DBU 2020. It is a little had to buff if you let it set for a while. I buffed like within 24 to 48 hours. It is slick as glass.