I'm lookin' at the Track 13" kit for the fronts, and the Touring 12" kit for the rears at Thunder Racing. Would they clear some 17" Cragar SS Rims? Kandied said he had to go 18's for his, b/c of clearance on his 17's...but that was w/ a diff. rim.

Any suggestions or know how?

Thanks

 

IIRC, Baer has a fitment template on their website to see if the brakes will fit the wheels.


Ed

 

Yeah, I know about that, but I was just seeing if someone knew it offhand. I don't have the rims yet, so I don't know how it will fit even if I get the template.

 

Its a tough call cause all the wheel manufacturers do things differently. One 17 may fit just fine, another 17 may not. Have you called Baer yet to see what they think?

 

That's what I was thinking of doing. I have to give them a call and see what they say. Hopefully they know what's up.

 

well i have an 18 at the shop and it clears just fine.....sorry no 17 though.

 

I have the 13 inch track kit with 17 inch snypers. I don't see how you could have any problem with a 17 inch wheels of anykind. Anyway here is the fitment notes from Baer for the track kit.

Most 16" one peice wheels. SPECIFICALLY WILL NOT FIT OE 16" pontiac or buick mesh wheels reproduction rally. Tourque thurst or most reproduction wheels. verify all with template.

 

Superman: You have a lot of clearance w/ your Snypers? Baer basically says most 16" won't fit? Am I reading your quote right?

I like how they say Verify w/ the template, like everyone has the rims beforehand...lol

Problem here is, no one around me has those rims. They would have to be special order. So, you can pretty much stick your template...lol

 

they will send you a free template that can help you determine the proper backspacing....which is the whole point. that way you know what you are getting into when you order.

 

I thought Baer had one on their site, that you just print out? I already know the backspacing. It's 4.5"...which should be good. I thought the template was to determine diameter clearance for the calipers?

 

Well as far as 13" front brake kits go, the kit I manufacture clears sock 16" IROC wheels easily. I'm sure if it clears a 16" wheels, it would easily clear a 17".


http://www.spohn.net/product.cfm?productid=1453

 

Yes, I saw that kit. It's pretty much out of my price range, as to why I went w/ Baer...plus, to get the same ones front and back...same company at least...If yours clear's 16's easy, I don't see why Baer would be so much more different.

 

caliper design. the PBR caliper has alot more that sticks out past the end of the rotor, the wilwoods are a much better design, and very low profile.

 

But the Wilwood's don't have anything for the rear, or do they? That 13" kit at Spohn is only for the fronts...where would I get the rears? Price?

 

Oh yeah, another thing...the Baer kits, they give you the modified Spindles and everything right off the bat. And you get $150 when you send back your old ones. Wilwood, you gotta cut your up and stuff...or do they do the same type of deal?

 

spohn has a deal for getting pre-modified spindles.

i know that rears are in the works. not sure on the timeline, but alloy is running with the factory drums out back, and it is working fne.

 

The thing is, I have a new 9 Bolt that I am fixing up on the bench, and I want to get new parts on it before I bolt it up to the car. So, I was going w/ Baer b/c they have the rear kit for the 9-bolt. The way it stands now, it doesn't have the PBR brakes, just stock Calipers that are pretty much shot.

How about Brembo?

 

Why do you not take the template to a wheel dealer to check or send the template to the wheel manufacturer?
S-D

 

Swerve: That's what I was thinking, but if there is better that is a sure fire bet, I'd rather not screw around, and just order the stuff. I'll do the template as last resort I guess.

 

as far as i know, there are no brembo kits what so ever for our cars.

you could always use the baer rear kit, with the spohn front kit.

 

Dewey: That would work for the fronts, but then the same thing comes up w/..."Does the Baer rear kit clear the Cragar SS 17's?"

Would it clear easily b/c it's a single piston, pbr design?

 

it should just fine, all the baer rear kits are only 12" IIRC

 

So, the Baer rear kit w/ the Spohn 13" Front Kit? That will clear basically any 17" rim, correct?

Is the extra $500 or so for the Spohn worth it? What makes it so much more expensive? They look Slotted and Cross Drilled, but are they Zinc washed? $1600 seems pretty steep for a front kit to me. Is it the added 4 piston calipers, as opposed to the 2 on the Baer Kit?

 

it is the 4 piston solid mounted calipers vs. 2 piston floating. there is a HUGE diffrence between then. IMHO slotted and cross drilled is not needed. but that is a personal preferance.

 

I know it's not needed, but I like the cosmetic look of it. What is the diff. between floating and solid mount calipers? Are the stock fronts solid or floating? I think solid, b/c there are bolts holding them, right? I don't know, I'm just guessing.

 

the stockers are floating. a floating caliper is like i sounds, it floats. all the pistons are on one side, that presses against the rotor, and the caliper actulay moves to put pressure on the other side too.

a fixed caliper, like the wilwoods, has pistons on both sides of the caliper. they each press in. it makes the brakes react faster, and can give you more pressure.

there is really no comparison between the PBR style, and the wilwoods, its apples and oranges... it like comparing a ferrari to a pento.

 

So, w/ a Wilwood Proportioning Vavle, and the Baer in the back (floating), would I notice better braking from the rear too? It seems as though the fronts will do everything, if the floating design is so poor. Would I notice a difference over my other diff. w/ Drums?

 

yes, the disks in rear are an upgrade. the fronts do a HUGE majority of the braking anyway, that is where you want the stopping power.

 

Sounds like that may be the way to go. Only thing I don't like is, I have to send my spindles to Spohn so they can do the mods...they won't send me modded ones already, and I can give them my old ones as a core.

 

sounds like that may be a good option for you, eh

 

I know the $1500 will hurt initially, but, if it is WAY better than Baer, that may be for the best. Any idea on how long it takes for them to do the spindles and get them back?

 

Sweet, pardon me butting in here, but you should do more research before you go and shell out your cash to Baer. You can upgrade your rear brakes to the good PBRs for less than $400 if you shop around, which is what the Baers are, just more expensive. There are better setups than their fronts also, the Wilood kit being one of them.


Good luck!

Ed

 

The kit comes packaged with one of andyz28's 1LE CD's with a pictorial giude to modifying your own spindles. If you are experience enough to feel comfortable enough in your mechinical skills to install a kit like this on your car, then you really shouldn't have any problem modding your own spindles. It requires a hacksaw, a drill, a tap, and patience. Go slowly, and it will take maybe 1/2 hour per spindle while they are still on the car. If you run into problems, either myself or Steve Spohn will be glad to help you.

 

Yeah, I've looked, and the Baer is basically the stock PBR setup from GM. They are basically charging you $500 more for the Baer name on it! I don't really want a junkyard setup. I'd rather go new. And the 1LE setup at Spohn is $850. So, looks like used is the only way to make out on the deal. For $400 or so that is.

Alloy: Thanks for the info. Seems as if that setup is the preferred one.

 

i have 12" PBR's on my car.

alloy lives about 20min from my house, i have been to his shop many a times, and in fact the PBR's on my car, started life on his car

the wilwood is far and away a better setup.

(yes he beats me by a good 3 seconds everytime we auto-x too)
(but watch out alloy...i'm coming on race rubber this year )

 

Damn, just about $2500 on brakes...am I nuts, or, am I crazy nuts? lol

 

nope, your an enthusiast. just like the rest of us

don't think abotu what you are spending... you'll be happier that way

 

Dream on buddy!

 

we'll see

btw, looks like mike wants to run the whole season too. should be a fun one for us

 

was able to throw a 17" version in a 4thgen offset with a 2" adapter and it worked just fine....you shouldn't have a problem.

at half the price i'd much rather have baer....however for looks a 4 piston is definately cooler.

 

lol, $600 or so more for a "cool" look...hmm

 

that's about it on the street.........at a track it's a different story.

 

Guys, you just aren't getting the idea of the Wilwood kits purpose. Dewey touched on this earlier and I thought his point was very clear about a 4 piston fixed caliper verses a floating stock style. There is so much more to a 4 piston caliper than just looks. As Dewey said, you are literally comparing a farrari to a pinto when it comes to the difference in performance, and yes a ferrari does cost more than a pinto does.

The Wilwood calipers have more application pressure for the same amount of force applied by the master cylinder, considerably more even and equal pad application force, along with even pad wear, faster brake reaction time in both applying and releasing, much better brake feel and the ability to easily brake right on the edge of tire adhesion, much better cooling since the top of the caliper is open allowing heat to rise out of the pads and rotor (heat rises), and extremely quick pad changes are just a few things to consider. And did I forget to mention just by using the 13" rotors over stock you gain and additional 379 foot pounds of braking force per wheel by increasing the lever arm length of the rotor? That's 758 more foot pounds of front braking force by the way. Then add the 4 piston calipers benefits to that.

My primary reason of designing this kit was performance. I had the C4 front brakes on my car, and they weren't enough for my intended use of the car and my very aggressive driving style. (huh Dewey...poor guy actually rode me me a couple of times while autocrossing-he probably won't ever do that again) Anyway, as Dewey said, my old brakes are on his car, and he's very happy with them. He actually credits them and me for saving his butt, and maybe even life a couple of times as I recall. They perform well, but as I've said before, they just weren't the eye opening difference I was looking for. The Wilwood kit is.

The LS1, C4, or C5 kits won't even come close to the performance of the 4 piston wilwood setup. The $2375 baer kit will, but that's $780 more. It basically comes down to, speed costs money. How fast do you want to go (or stop).

 

Alloy: I see what you mean. Very good description by the way. Kandied mentioned it was overkill for the street, is it really? I'd say if it brakes like a dream, then, it's not really overkill...more of a "protection" type deal. How is it w/ pedal feel? Do you just barely touch it, and it's jerking you from the force? Do you get full pedal movement as you do w/ stock ones, just a more firm feel?

It's somethin' how a clearance issue basically started changing my whole plan on what to get

 

overkill is complete relative. what is overkill for kandied, may or may not be overkill for you, and my definition is diffrent.

by design a fixed caliper is far better in design and function. it comes down to what you want. and what you want to pay for. IMHO paying for a baer kit is a waste. period. you can get the SAME kit from spohn for cheaper (1le kit), if you want more brake from baer, you can upgrade to the alcon kit. (mulitple pistons fixed caliper, much like the wilwoods) and shell out very large ammounts of money. for just a little more than the PBR baer kit, you can get the wilwood kit for baer.

 

Yeah, I'm thinking Wilwood is the way to go. Hey, for changing the pads, how is it w/ the Wilwood? I remember on my friends Probe a long while back, his was the easiest to change. You just slide out one bolt, and the whole caliper lifts up...but it stayed attached to the other bolt...and you just slide the new pads in, and swing the caliper back down.

 

even easier than that.

you take one bolt out on top of the caliper, then the pads slide out.

you don't even have to bother with unbolting the caliper. at all.

 

Damn, that sounds awesome. Then, the only pain would be changing the Baer's in the back...it sucks that no one made anything different for the rears...

 

give alloy some time.

i predict that in not too long there will be a matching wilwood rear kit.

 

I wish I had the time. I give it or month or two before I actually start putting my rear end back together. If he can whip one out in that time, NOW we are gettin' somewhere...lol