I completed the front 1LE brake set-up last summer, so I had already swapped out the M/C and combo valve. For more info about that, check the following site: http://www.ws6transam.org/1LEbrake.html#1LEfront

Everything concerning the rear swap was straightforward. (I decided on the swap quite simply because the later brakes are better). Note the size difference in the rotors and then the design of the calipers and backing plates compared with the next picture. By the way, check farther below for a comparision of the 9- and 10-bolt PBR backing plates.

JamesC

Reman loaded calipers were hit and miss. I first ordered from CarQuest, but several parts were missing. I finally successfully ordered from Advance Auto (P/N 164345 and 164346), who matched CarQuest's price. The calipers were complete right down to the carriers as the link shows: http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDeta...tNumber=164345

Check this link for what Ed Miller says about 93-97 calipers and carriers:
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=250516

I ordered the four shims, two approx. .62 and two approx. 1.18 mm, from AndyZ28 at http://www.andyz28.com/ The shims are used to center the carrier over the rotor. I only employed one, a .62, on the pass side. Without it, the rotor would have hung up on the carrier.

Note the 10-bolt backing plates, available from GM (P/N 10136853 and 10136854).

JamesC

I ordered the hard lines from Fine Lines at http://www.finelinesinc.com/ (P/N FRA89010M). The pass side line and bracket is the same as on the original disc brakes.

JamesC

The driver's side line is different. The original went to the front of the axel and didn't require a hose. Note: The bracket here has been discontinuted by GM, but Classic Tube has a univeral that will fit, I think: http://www.classictube.com/ Go to Braided Hoses and then to the bottom of the page. Classic Industries also carries brake line brackets, P/N 393737. http://www.classicindustries.com/
For a better view of the above, see p. 628 of the Classic Industries Cat. The brackets are L-shaped and include horseshoe clips.

The e-brake cables are from CarQuest (P/N BRK 8788, 1st design, 1434 mm). The original GM cable is discontinued (GM P/N 10164125). I had to use a Dremel to slightly enlarge the retangular slot on the caliper end of the cable to make it fit the parking brake lever. Two minutes work.

JamesC

The e-brake guides are available from GM (P/N 10285819 R and 10285818 L). They route the cables away from problems such as exhaust.

JamesC

The rotors are from CarQuest (P/N 55022). Carrier to caliper bolts are from GM (P/N 10164181). I used grade-8 bolts from CarQuest--check the first link above for appropriate sizes. The braided steel flex lines are from Earl's (P/N 28A190). Check the link:

http://www.spohn.net/category.cfm?categoryid=1095

Classic Industries sells the rubber version if price is a consideration, BH38603 LH and BH38602 RH (1989-92 w/perf. pkg., 4 whl disc). http://www.classicindustries.com/

Everything works great.

JamesC

Now I have the set. By the way, I also swapped out the GM c-clips (P/N 344171) and bearings. I replaced with off-set bearings from CarQuest (BGS RP5707). If the cross shaft bolt head is rounded, consider replacement from GM (P/N 14056196). A 5/16" six-point socket and a quarter-inch breaker bar works wonders. The new bolt will have a dab of red Loctite on it.

JamesC

And fronts.

JamesC

That's some pretty nice brakes you have. Where is Belleview KS? How does it stop now?

You know that is kinda funny cause im about to do the same thing . Im just waiting on my other rear caliper to come in. I work at napa so i ordered both sides 1 came with everything and the other came with nothing. The one that came with everything was from the manufactorer so i ordered the other side from there waiting on it should be here tuesday. I am doing mine on a 9 bolt rear tho i hope i dont need any shims i will also get the earl flex line and paint my calipers red. My 1 caliper i got from the manufactorer is real nice even came with the e-brake bracket and spring. I just wish i could buy a aluminum cover for my 9 bolt like your 10 bolt. I wanna know tho how does it stop cause i figured my rear and the rubber hoses was really holdin me back plus i think i still have some air in the lines. I am goin to buy a 1 man bleeder tho and silicone fluid and flush it all out this time. Also am buying new rear SS hard lines that are pre bent. Any get back to me and Nice brakes!!

Gladstone, Belleville is in the middle of the state, straight north of Salina, thirteen miles from the Nebraska line--man, I'm in the boondocks! With both the front and rear brakes in place along with the Earl's lines, you can imagine that the car stops pretty quickly. Spdfrk, I've read (but have no personal experience) that 9-bolts don't require the shim. I think you'll be as I'm pleased with the outcome as I am.

JamesC

Yeh i heard that rumor about the no shim with the 9 bolt also i cant wait to get mine ill take pix. I dunno how soon ill have it all done cause i might drop the tank also and get a new pump for the new engine while im at it.

Wos, thats crazy. I just got done doing a similar project, except my car had the PBR's to being with. I rebuilt them myself after hearing how easy it is from EBmiller , I also added drilled slotted rotors.
I actually did run into the problem of the carrir hitting the rotors on both sides. But my problem was not that the rotor has to be moved, it was the carrier itself that had to be recentered. A couple of very thin washer, I forgot the size, worked perfectly and gave it the necessary clearance


Great job man, I image the swap from one type to another must have been trickier than what I encountered!

Will

The rotor doesn't move (though there is a bit of endplay that needs to be taken into consideration). You're correct: the shim simply adjusts the carrier over the rotor.

JamesC

Ive had a hella time getting the rear calipers complete i finially got them from a local store called smyth. They have the raybestas loaded calipers.

What is the first and second design cables all about anyway.

I just ordered the cables for my year camaro and had no trouble. Got them directly from GM. And I know everyone thinks NEW is better, as far as calipers go, but in reality, there is nothing wrong with your originals. Now keep in mind like $20 each for the cast iron fronts, sure, you might as well, but when rears are going in excess of 140 each, at dealer prices, why not just rebuild? The kits ran me less than 20 for both I believe and I have ZERO complaints. It could not have been more straightforward and I saved about 300 in the process. Not to mention I got the chance to take the apart fully, beadblast them, and paint them, with everything off, so nthing gets ruined. IMHO its just the way to go. I can think of alot of places to spend 300 bucks, rather than on brake calipers

Will

Yeh o well i got them at 98 i have an account. I could of got the rebuild kit somewhere but i couldnt find one with everything and these calipers came off ebay i just wanted new ones. As far as the cables go for my year there are 2 different ones looks like every1 uses the first design.

The first and second designs were different lengths (for all I know there were other differences as well). At any rate the first design, the 1434 mm cable, is what you'll need. As I mention above, the GM cables are no longer available.

Rebuild from AutoZone (P/N 60196) or Advance Auto (P/N D352746) is cool if you already have calipers. Check the following link for a pic of the parts included in the latter kit:

http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDeta...Number=D352746

In the above pic, you can see the caliper bleeder screw cap. If your calipers don't have this piece, they're still available from GM (P/N 14089150).

If you don't have the calipers to rebuild, the only route is new, reman at the prices GM or other vendors demand or the bone yards. I was lucky enough to find a 9-bolt with a bent axel tube. I bought everything from the flanges out as well as the hardlines and all brackets for a $100, then sold the 9-bolt backing plates and hardlines for $65, so I came up with what I needed at dirt cheap prices--had I rebuilt the calipers as well, my project would have been super cheap. Still, I'm very happy, not only with the outcome of the project, but also the overall cost.

JamesC

Side by side the 9- and 10-bolt backing plates look very similiar. The new is the 10-bolt plate. The nine-bolt plate can be sourced through Ed Miller and perhaps AndyZ28:

http://www.andyz28.com/

JamesC

Note the bolt-pattern difference.

JamesC

Im painting my rear calipers right now . Waiting on the paint to dry.

Here it is kinda looks orangy from all the light but its not.

1 more question where did you guys get your prebent lines. Ive seen them and i think they had said somethin like 86-92 disc all. Well dont some run a hard line strait to the caliper i dont want that.

I give the web site and P/N above (89-91 W/J65 Rear Disc Option (Requires hose at Left and Right). This product is a perfect fit. They're pictured above. Here are direct links, first for OEM material, then stainless steel:

http://finelinesinc.com/catalog/prod...oducts_id=3003

http://finelinesinc.com/catalog/prod...oducts_id=3004

JamesC

Ok so i was going to get the lines from classic industries cause my dad had to order some stuff from there. All there catalog says tho is 86-91 all rea disc then they also have a heavy duty BW option. So is the borg warner T in a different spot or somethin and i dont even know if they are 2 hose. I called they didnt know lol. If i order the ones you got think they would find on the 9 bolt fine?

Yes, they will fit. I compared the old 9-bolt lines to the ones I ordered from Fine Lines, and they were a perfect match. As a matter of fact, the only difference in the 9- and 10-bolt rear ends, where PBR brakes are concerned, is the backing plates.

JamesC

Thanx James ill just get them from fine lines and nice write up youve done. All this stuff helps and alot of people dont take the time.

Thats pretty slick

Above, you were referring to the difference in the bolt-pattern between the 9-bolt and the 10-bolt backing plates. Can you still modify a 10-bolt drum axle using the 9-bolt backing plate and the procedure shown in the tech article?

https://www.thirdgen.org/newdesign/t...reardisc.shtml

It looks to me like the 9-bolt backing plate would be better, having more metal between the bolt holes and the large center hole (not like it probably matters but also because all I have to work with is the 9-bolt backing plates that I have now)

Thanks!

The ten-bolt backing plates are still available from GM at a very modest price--$10 or $15 per, IIRC. Rather than modify both axel flange and 9-bolt backing-plate, buying the 10-bolt plates seems more reasonable, IMO. I doubt that strength is a problem.

JamesC

Since what I have is a 9 bolt rear end, will the rest of my brake equipment work with the 10 bolt backing plates?

I'm assuming I should tell GM that I need the 10 bolt backing plates for an '86 10 bolt rear end since I have any '86?? Or is there a difference in the plates between the years?

Thanks!

The only difference between the 9- and 10-bolt PBRs is the backing plates. You'll need plates from an 89-92 10-bolt rear. I give the part numbers above for all you should need.

JamesC

According to the web site in your original post http://www.ws6transam.org/1LEbrake.html#1LEfront these are the correct GM parking brake cables, and they are still available from GM.

Is this info correct?


GM PART # 10164125
CATEGORY: Parking Brake Cable
PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $29.69
OUR PRICE: $16.92
DESCRIPTION: CABLE ASM

At the time Mr. Burke wrote his article, the GM cables you mention were apparently still available. Since that time, however, they've been discontinued. The CarQuest P/N is still available to the best of my knowledge.

JamesC

Double post.

JamesC

No, I just got that info from GM Parts Direct. They ARE aparently still available from GM.

I just phoned my local dealership for verification and was told that the 10164125 1st design cables WERE discontinued. The parts man also checked his locator and could find none at any other dealerships. If you're in doubt and wish to have the GM cables, you might try ordering some and then relaying the outcome. Who knows? This is GM after all. At any rate, the CarQuest cables are replacements--and cheaper IIRC.

JamesC

so, I just tried to order the e-brake cables from carquest in NJ using the listed part number (P/N BRK 8784). It seems that either they changed the part number, or it's wrong(and expensive!!). Might be a swapping of the sequence in numbers? At any rate, I will have to take them back and try to get the right ones, I did find that rockauto lists ACdelco replacements for around $17 if anyone is looking for them. I may have to go that route, but shipping is like 12 weeks!

Just a heads up for anyone looking for these cables!!

My bad. The part number is BRK 8788 (I've changed the number above). The cable was $17.95 per. Thanks for the heads-up.

JamesC

I know this is a dumb question but you did the conversion on a drum rear,correct?Couldnt see where you said what rear you converted.

Nevermind,helps if I read the post first.But will this setup work on a drum rear while Im at it.Sorry cant find exact swap in "search".

With some axle flange mods, yes it will work.

Ed