Fast305

What do you do with the injection setups you pull off? Do you throw them away or what? Do they just sit in your garages or shops. I have looked for a cheap tbi or tpi system for several years. Anyone have an idea where I can find a complete system and have it shipped to me. I have checked ebay ($300.00-500.00) and various junkyards refuse to email me back after requesting a complete TBI setup! What is the deal? This 10 mpg q-jet is getting old.

305sbc

iTrader: (3)

perhaps you should fix it?

Fast305

I have tried everything I know to do!!! I posted in the general tech section under Horrible Gas mileage. Got some new ideas but none seemed to be the problem. I also want the TBI for quicker starting, better running when cold, etc.

305sbc

iTrader: (3)

Did you try rebuilding or replacing the carb?

SSC

Some people trash the setups some sell them. You would be better off buying another car to drive or pull the setup off with harness.

Alot of old carbs cannot be rebuilt there too far gone. I'd suggest you get another carb, even an edelcrap can get good fuel economy in stock form compared to a craped q-jet.

dennis6

TBI sucks, I sold mine on ebay not too long ago for about 100 bucks complete. You don't want it.

Get a new holley or edelbrock and a VAC advance distributor. A little tuning and you should be good to go. BTW since you have a different cam and heads than a TBI or TPI engine you will have to burn a chip, you are not doing yourself any favours by going FI.

MrDude_1

short of massive corrosion, you can pretty much rebuild/replace everything in it.....



athough, if it is screwed up, id spend the $10 at a junkyard for another carb (because of Q-jets bad rap, they're pretty cheap)

then spend a lil on a rebuild kit ($30-50 id guess, i dont remember off the top of my head) and rebuild the carb on the workbench....

much cheaper....


athough if you still want EFI, be prepared to spend the $300-$800 for it on ebay... plus the new fuelpump and your time..

Fast305

I disagree with TBI sucks. It is lame for top end horsepower and drag racing but it is great for low and mid range torque, throttle response, gas mileage, and quick cold starts and warmups and emissions (what GM intended it for). I don't like carbs and have an even greater dislike for terrible performing Q-jets. I have spent more hours on this dang q-jet than I would if I had just swapped to TBI. I am looking at edelbrock 1406s on ebay though and am thinking about swapping to one. Maybe not the best for HP but should let me get good mileage (for a carb).

dennis6

I had TBI, and it does suck. It didn't have great low end torque or horespower. Its a carb with injectors thrown ontop that restrict airflow.

My TBI 305 got about 16mpg. A carb could do that.

xeroxed

if you want a tbi i got the throttle body and intake for the 87 and newer style heads. it came off an 87 350 id be willing to let it go fairly cheap.

MrDude_1

i have one sitting in my garage.... at some point soon, i'll probly be using it, so i cant sell it, but its a good choice. i dont care what alot of people say about em, they're good street carbs, and great with electric chokes... cold starts are no prob.

dennis6

Fast305, I might know where you can get an edelbrock 1406 cheap. http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/036728-3.html

Bandit5

I have the entire LO3 in my garage waiting for me to rebuild it. It is all complete minus fuel lines and computer. I was thinking about turning it into a carbed motor, but I just MIGHT now keep the TBI system with some nice mods.

slammnmini

buy a demon carb :hail:

2slowcamaro

I had a edelbrock 1406 and it worked great. Didn't have much for fuel mileage but ran good for me. I belive i was getting about 15 to 17 mpg. if this helps.

Stekman

Edelbrocks are great for people who arent big fans of tuning carbs and want a good out-of-the-box performer. Holley and Demons need tuning to run just right. Ive had a Edel. 600 cfm elec. choke, Holley 600 DP, 650 DP and a Speed Demon. For performance the Demon takes the cake. For reliability and ease of use, id go with Edel. But, like it was stated, rebuilding a q-jet is probably the easiest route. Besides, they can be tuned for performance. They have HUGE secondaries and are rated at like 750 cfm or so. Theres a tech article about it. I always wanted to try it and see how it stacked up against the Edelbrock, Holleys, and Demon.

camaronewbie

Hi. New to the carb boards, right now I'm TBI. I'm here scouting info to maybe swap to carb. You can see my mods in my sig. 9 months later, she rots away in the driveway - won't run - needs custom chip tuning. Problem is, even if I did have the time, knowledge, & patience to do my own chips, there is no guarantee that a chip can be made to work. I don't have faith that I can do it myself. I can't seem to find anyone else that can, or will, even attempt chips for under $300 - all with no guarantees. I've been through 3 different "tuners" - all anyone did was take my cash, and then you hear nothing from them. So I'm thinking carb. Motors ran fine with carbs for how many years now? What's FI gonna get me? So far, just rotting in the driveway.

If you are already carb - keep it! Fix it, replace it, tune it, whatever. The FI guys are out here dying, because the smog police won't let us carb, and we can't make the mods work with the damn computer. OK - there are some exceptions - those that have lots of cash to flush, and nothing better to do than tweak - for them, it's a hobby, have at it. For me, spring is here, I wanna spend my days running 75mph on the Jet Ski, and my nights driving my RS.

Uncle Sam, the wife, the job, the kids - all control enough of my life already! Last thing I want is some chip controlling the rest of my life! Wanna play with FI? Trade cars with me! But bring a tow dolly - 'cause the TBI ain't lettin' mine go anywhere on it's own!

SSC

What mods? I see no sig!

Actually I'd rather use a TBI base if I had to use fuel injection on a built engine. It's easyer to tune then TPI and Holley makes some nice controllers, stand alone tuneable management systems that support some decent power.

camaronewbie

Ha Ha - sorry - thought sig just magically appeared.

1990 LO3 TBI Auto. 416 heads, ported/polished, 1.94 in & 1.5 ex valves, 1.6 rollertips, LT1 cam, Weiand 8000 intake, TBI adapter, Hedman headers, hiflo cat, VaFPR, 3.08 posi, dual snorkel, stock TBI, stock injectors.

I'm really really thinking about switching to carb. The smog guys won't know the difference here - as long as it passes the sniffer. And I actually get something for my cash - something that I can install and tweak with a screwdriver.

Charged350

iTrader: (1)

ill sell ya a complete TPI system of my 87 iroc i took off today, i got teh whole intake throttle body fuel rails and injectors, plastic air intakes with bottom gutted, and the computer, the wiring harness, well you have to find that one yourself, it got hacked up during my motor swap...

treeohfive

i have a complete tbi set up if you want it

i have a tpi setup too off of a 86 iroc....minues harness ecm and distributor.....everything else is there though...every single sensor.....all that good stuff

camaronewbie, your setup was damn near the exact same as mine cept i have 3.73s and moded the hell out of my stock tbi before i switched to carb......

camaronewbie

Well treeohfive, it was alot of work, with little pay off. Not much difference in her than stock - probably need more chip work done. But I've since found out that in Jan 2006, we lose the emissions on OBD1. So until then, I'll tinker with everything except motor (like 3.73's), and just get a real motor in 2006. I never had a rod as a teen - I was always the responsible one. Now, at 39, I've got mid-life crisis, and thus the NEED FOR SPEED!!!!

treeohfive

what did you end up doing to it? i think i failed to notice what you decided on.....i have a bad habid of just skimming through posts heheh

camaronewbie

I ended up with the TBI unit - I found a local guy to burn a chip, but I think it needs more chip tuning. Like I said, it runs, but not much more power than before. It seems to be sluggish at lower rpm's. But without a custom chip, it wouldn't run at all - way too rich at idle. I suppose if I had the patience to learn, I could do my own chips and get it optimal in a few months, but that's all way to complicated for me. Mechanical I can do, computer I need to stay away from. Besides, I already have enough damned chips running my life, last thing I want in my car is another. I want something I can see, touch, and hit with a hammer! LOL So when my emissions are gone, so are the limits, and I can get back into something I know how to fix.

Damon

I'll also jump on the bandwagon and suggest that you should be able to do much better with mileage if the Qjet and other critical engine components are in good working order. Many (most) QJets have been fiddled with to the point they no longer run right. You need to find someone who knows what they're doing with them. I do a lot of Qjet work for board memebers here and elsewhere if you wanted to drop me an email and talk it over.

Also, I just this weekend took a complete TBI engine out of my wife's 92 Camaro to be replaced with a carbureted motor. I, therefore, have a complete, known-good TBI setup that I'd let go for cheap. Includes the distributor, too, but not the ECM and wiring harness (which the carbureted motor will still utilize parts of to keep various things working like the fuel pump and speedo).

treeohfive

its always tricky going from a carbed engine to a used FI deal. the only *hassle free* job woulda been a brand new FI system with a brand new wiring harness and a programmable ecm... $$$$

thats not to say you CANT get the tbi to work, its just not going to be hassle free.....

i think its in the fuel map of the chip.....the tbi system is designed for less fuel delivery on start up due to the swirl port heads they were made to work with.....now the non swirl port heads are demanding more fuel due to more area within the intake ports in the head.. i dont think its running rich, i think its running lean as hell.....unless the o2 sensor is out of what and telling your engine to run super lean.... in any event, its chip tuning.... IAC step metering and adjusting the idle screw til you are at about 8-12 steps at start up.....buuut that takes a scanner ....starting at 150 bucks......which isnt a bad investment if you plan on dealing with FI setups..........

anyways....it shouldnt act boggish, it should act more torquey than the q-jet......better throttle response......do you have any idea of what psi your fuel pressure is at? might help to check it.....

camaronewbie

Well - it was always FI - I just did the heads/intake/headers/cam work, and replaced the TBI. I understand what your saying about the fuel, and the chip tuning, and scanner, and such. I just don't have the patience for all that. All the **** & git I've ever known/seen/tinkered with was carb - I guess I'm just an old dog and can't get the new tricks. But, the old tricks still work, and when I get back under the hood, I'll probably return to what I know - good old fashioned mechanical contraptions.

treeohfive

i just said to hell with it and went carb....tbi kept giving me MASS problems .......and i wondered why i had all these problems .....have wondered for an entire year....then today...i found out.

ill start the story here

2 weeks ago i discovered a small hole in the bottom of my gas tank. tried to patch it twice, neither time worked.

so i very unhappily snatched the tank out of the car to replace it.
It seems as though my in tank fuel pump had been replaced. But the morons didnt replace the strainer. i assume that the impeller on the old pump got ate up, and when this happened , 100 pieces of plastic flew into the inside of the strainer. i come to this theory due to the screen on the pump.....being slam filled to the brim full of plastic pieces, crud, crap, etc. so the #1 cause of all my tbi problems....clogged fuel pump. so i guess all the lil pieces of the old impeller left behind in the strainer got sucked up into the new pump and the screen in the pump prevented it from going IN the pump. so...YAY crappy mechanics.

so the hole in my tank turns out to be a blessing in disguise. i must have been running so lean it was sick. i remember when i changed my fuel filter and gained 15 hp (no joke) so wtf will i gain NOW. i was wondering why my car lacked a great deal of power. no power gains from a cam swap, none from a port and polish on 416 castings vrs the L03 heads that were on it.

i have a 86 tank that has a hole in the TOP of the tank where some moron tried to ground an amp wire in the back cargo area , drilled into the body, right into the tank.

should be a great deal easier for a patch to hold on the top of the tank vrs the bottom where gravity works against it.

The End.

camaronewbie

LOL grounding amp! That's where my 416 heads and new doors came from - I bought an '85 that had a massive under-hood fire because of amp grounding (or lack thereof). This girl's boyfriend ran a huge 12 guage wire for the amp through the pass door - not through the firewall, just thru the door hinge. When the door closed the last time, it shorted, and literally blew up the battery, and ensured a major fire. So I bought it for cheap as a door donor - my driver door is bashed in.

treeohfive

weird napa mishap

awhile ago the 305 in my 86 died. oil pump clogged....bye bye engine

anyways, got a reman 350 from napa ....i didnt know anything about cars then, i thought just cause it was a 350 it was fast....didnt even know wtf a cam shaft was.....was when i was 15 by the way.

anyways.....so i put the engine in...8k later it starts running like ***.....i mean horrible, so i gave up on the car, bought my 92.

years later.....i finally got into cars real big and started researching everything there was to know about camaros.

so i for the hell of it look up the casting numbers on the 350 in the 86 ......turns out the heads on the 350 were 305 heads...416 castings to be exact....and the 350 was a old old 70's high nickle content 4 bolt main 350 block.....dunno wtf the reman company was thinking...but hey ...thanks! years later a worthless engine in a worthless car turned out to be a pot of gold

anyways, how did the engine start running like ***? well it turns out...ALL that was wrong, was a rocker arm stud had pulled up out of the head.....2 dollar fix.....so i damn near threw away a 350 that was perfectly flawless....over 2 dollars.....thank *** i got way into cars.....i have a great 350 block to build on and in the mean time i ported and polished the 41s and stuck em on my car

the end hahah