baker440ex

Hey just picked up an 84 Camaro, 350/5speed. It's got an Edelbrock carburetor. This car had a big piece of the carb/intake gasket missing, so it had a real erratic, high idle, but it seemed to have a lot of power, I had to drive it a short distance home, the throttle was extremely sensitive to say the least...Well this afternoon I replaced the gasket and sure enough a huge section from the front was gone. Anyways, I changed the gasket, and also added a quart of oil because it was pretty low. After that, it fired right up, no more erratic idle, just idling very high. Anyways the car was pretty much bailing exhaust smoke, very white, (its about 25 degrees out if that matters) then when it was warming up it started to run kinda crappy, and the idle went down..Well when I got it into the garage I took the breather off and noticed the carb was covered with oil, mostly in the secondaries and on the butterfly valves, and it looked like the fresh oil I just added. I also noticed the choke (mechanical) was all screwy and I don't think it's working, a pic of that would help if anyone has one...Might be missing a piece...So Idk if the carb is my problem or something else?

89rs454

Tbo from what i just read, i would start thinking about a motor swap, If it's a real 350 and carbed and a stock 5 speed chances are it's blown a head gasket, and needs new gaskets or a whole new power plant. My advisse to you is drive it and drive it hard until the Lt1 or ls1 is ready to drop in, oh and up grade your tranny... it's going to need it.

pancherj

Could be valve seals leaking (although I kind of doubt it). Could be the ring seal going away. Do you have a breather and/or PCV valve? Or, it could be a leaking intake gasket (between the intake and the cylinder head). I had that issue with mine right after I switched to my carb manifold. It was pulling into the intake right at cylinders 6 and 8.

I would do some diagnostic work before throwing in the towel. First, pull the carb and see what is in the manifold. Next, tell us about the breather/pcv system (a picture would be good). Lastly, do a leakdown test.

baker440ex

K there is a Pcv valve (I believe) it goes from the top of the valve cover to the back of the carb. I was told to try to block this off, which I'm gonna try tomorrw. A second opinion wouldn't hurt either. I'm hoping the motor isn't gone/going but like I said it seemed to have lots of power so my gut instinct would be that if it was going or had low compression it wouldn't fire right up and run as good as it does considering the issues.

I definitely want to do some diagnostic work before throwing in the towel. What is this leakdown test and how do I do it??? Will this expose a leaking intake gasket? How can I tell if the gaskets are good or not? For the record it does not seem to be consuming coolant although I could be wrong, I only checked it once but It was topped right off.

baker440ex

Btw thanks for the responses guys. and 89rs454 believe me, If I had the loot it would be getting an Lt-1 for sure.

TreeFiddy

Jeez way to freak the guy out, how bout a bit of basic logic and diagnosis first? Not every engine problem is an automatic blown head gasket! Even if it was, that requires new gaskets and maybe machining, and solving the problem, not a new engine.

Like parcherj said, look at pvc system and intake gaskets. Assume you didn't have oil everywhere before you worked on the carb, so it stands to reason it was something you did then. Spill some oil maybe? If it was running with plenty of power and no smoke before the carb work, sounds like you've still got a problem with that.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

LT1 and LT-1 are different engines. Just be aware when you're looking.

Also, Im thinking the white smoke is just condensation in the exhaust if it was that cold out. It will run like crap as it gets warmer if the choke doesnt open all the way - is that what happened? The oil all over the carb is a bit strange... Not really sure how oil could even get there except through the pcv system but even then it should be going into the engine, not all over the top of the carb. At most that would suggest a broken pcv valve or something. Not a head gasket.

baker440ex

I just got off work, its 10 degrees out and Im gonna go work on the car..lol. Well first I'm gonna pick up a breather for the valve cover and block off the pcv valve, also flush that oil down into the motor with some carb cleaner...
Just to clear things up I'm not in the market for a new motor, even if this one is totally trashed I would probably find another 350, Im a fulltime student and I dont have a lot of money. But yes I think there is a good possibility the 'smoke' is actually just condensation..at any rate my first concern would be the oil in the carb. Like I said earlier, the choke is screwy. Actually it doesn't even engage, but the light on the dash does come on before the car stalls out. With the bad base gasket Id have to stay there to keep the car going, then when it started to warm up it would idle. When I replaced the gasket it fired right up and idled (high) then when it warmed back up it didn't want to hold an idle, this is when I found the oil in the carb.

baker440ex

And is the Pcv valve anything special or is it literally just a line that goes from the breather to the back of the carb?

Apeiron

It's something special

baker440ex

Lol, K.... Nice description. My last car didn't have this at all, just a breather, so whats so special about it?

TreeFiddy

The pcv valve regulates the flow of crank vapours from the valve cover to the carb. If you just have a hose there, the carb will just suck oil vapours straight in. Might be your problem.

baker440ex

Ty. Im not sure whats on it, trying to gather info before I venture out into the cold, haha. Also debating on whether to try a conventional breather or get a new pcv valve, But I think I should eliminate the pcv first to see if that helps. Also one big thing, the dipstick tube is broke in half, and it stays on there because of the stick, but would that cause irregular pressure??

baker440ex

Correction Pcv line goes into the front of the carb. So my two questions are:

1. Is the broken dipstick tube messing with my vacuum pressure??
2. Does not having a functioning choke have anything to do with this, or is it simply for cold starts?

pancherj

Sorry it took me a while to jump back in here. The dipstick shouldn't be affecting anything up at the carb. The PCV valve is a one-way valve that allows crankcase vapors (at a certain vacuum signal) to be pulled into the intake tract (below the carb). You don't want that pressure building up in the crankcase and it also help remove moisture. A breather in the valve cover works, but not as good. You should have a breather on one valve cover (to let air in) and a PCV valve in the other (to pull the vapors out).

Either the PCV system or the intake gaskets can be the culprit here and those are the things I would check first (verify these and then move on to a leakdown test). I am not sure there is anyway to check the intake gaskets without pulling the intake (maybe someone else has a trick up their sleeve??). If oil is being sucked into the intake at the gasket, normal reversion waves can push the oil up to the carb. If the PCV valve is stuck open, it will pull oil in and the same thing will happen.

Apeiron

No

Only for cold starts.

TreeFiddy

The only way I can think of for oil to appear above the throttle blades, is for the valve cover to be plumbed straight to the air cleaner, with no pcv valve. How is your system connected?

Apeiron

One side is from the factory.

baker440ex

K guys making some headway now....Had to run all around town to find K1 for the silent glow. Also I got a lot of pics I will post here in a few.

First off the pcv system had all kinds of oil in it, Also the rubber line that they used looked like one of those high pressure collapsible lines, actually one end looked normal and the other looked like a clogging artery. Also got some before and after shots of the carb with the oil in it, so you can definitely see the buildup, and the puddles on the butterfly valves. I have to run back to store because I think the car is out of gas so I'll be back at it in a minute...

One quick question, what are the two screws on the front of the carb for and what should they be adjusted at? (The ones that face diagonally upward from the base, side by side, spring tension adjustment screws)

Also the cam for the choke..nothing is hitting it. (this is on the same side as the throttle linkage right?) I have some pics of this aswell...Idk about posting pics so I think I'm gonna just make a photobucket account and then post the link to that.

TreeFiddy

If this is the only connection and the pcv side has been omitted, oil can get sucked thru. A couple of my first pos cars plumbed this way did this - admittedly not as quickly as the op's seems to have done though.

baker440ex

Be more specific...Are you saying that since I removed the pcv valve and capped the end on the carb oil can still get sucked thru?

baker440ex

Oh and just to clarify my other question:

Im guessing I turn the adjustment screws all the way in and then back them both out an even amount..How many turns out from being bottomed out do they need

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

Well he said his PCV goes to the "front of the carb"... I iwll assume that means into the base of the carb and not the air filter.

So do you even have a pcv valve in the vacuum line?

And Im having a hard time making sense of what you're saying about the choke so I will explain how it works briefly so you can figure out on your own what to do about it. A cold engine requires a much richer (read more fuel in the air/fuel mixture) air fuel ratio than a warm engine. This is heavily simplified, but the choke plate closes off the throttle body and what this does is reduce the air flowing through that side of the carb, and you get more fuel in relation to the air flowing in than you would with teh choke completely open.

So for it to work properly, it needs to be partially closed when cold, and COMPLETELY open when warm. If it is not completely open, your engine is going to be somewhat starved for air but more importantly it will see a VERY rich air fuel mixture and will generally run like crap. Do whatever you need tod o to make sure the choke butterfly stays open when its warm or it'll run like crap.

TreeFiddy

So you are plumbed: No pcv valve, carb pcv port blocked, and one valve cover plumbed to the air cleaner? Yep, will suck oil. Put the pcv valve and hose back.

baker440ex

K thanks for the choke explanation I will make sure it is completely open for now. Yes your assumption was correct it goes to the base of the carb, not the air filter. I believe the pcv valve was the 90' plastic piece that comes directly off the valve cover..looked to have parts inside it...Then there was a line that went from that to the carb, which looked collapsed on one end unless that was from someone shoving it on the fitting.

baker440ex

No pcv valve, carb pcv port blocked, NO plumbing to the air cleaner. The valve cover that had the pcv valve in it now has its own breather.

TreeFiddy

Ah ok, then this won't be the oil source. Why lose the pcv valve?

baker440ex

Umm well I was trying to weigh that option earlier, and nobody chimed in so I decided to get the breather. My other car had one and it seemed to work fine.

baker440ex

Where should my adjustment screws be so i can do this when i get back

baker440ex

Ok...Well its running good no more oil issue. Still lots of white smoke Im thinking more than normal, Its pretty thick. But the car fires right up and runs good, there's no way its a cracked block. It got real cold last night too and I checked the coolant first thing and it wasn't even slushy. Anyways if I am losing coolant how can I tell?

baker440ex

Well I went ahead and bottomed the screws out..The left one was 4 1/8 out and the right one was 4 3/8 out, currently they are both 2 full turns out. When I started it...No smoke whatsoever. As it warmed up it came back but looks normal now..I didn't let it warm up completely. Thoughts??

TreeFiddy

Sorry baker, had been up over 24 hrs and had to go sleep. What did the oil problem turn out to be?

I have no experience with Eddy carbs, but if those are idle mix screws it sounds like they have the same effect as on a Holley. As you range between lean-rich you can get various funky white/grey/black smoking when the mix is incorrect.

When you are doing any adjustments to mix or timing, always make sure that the engine is warmed up completely, and the choke is fully off. A cold or halfway warm motor behaves very differently, usually for the worse, and you'll end up second-guessing yourself, especially with a carb.

baker440ex

Haha, no problem, I have those days as well. The oil issue turned out to be the pcv valve although I do not know a lot about them and decided not to research. i simply removed it and bought a little breather insert for the valve cover. I plan on checking it periodically for oil but for now everything seems to be fine. Also thanks for the heads up on the carb tuning. It was 28 below here last night so I decided not to work on the car, maybe on Tuesday.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

You need to replace the PCV. It's there for a reason, doesnt hurt your performance or gas mileage any, and helps clean out the inside of your engine, and keeps your engine bay from getting stinky and dirty like a breather will.

TreeFiddy

It's a cheap part, no reason not to do it. And a new hose of course.