I have just recently purchased this 1985 Trans Am and am working on a complete resto. The carb is a POS quadrajet.
I'm looking to go 650 Holley DP?
-It has a mild crane cam (not too sure how mild)
-Accel Coil pack

Also looking for suggestions on Headers, heads, Manifolds, and intakes.
Any suggestion and explanation will be greatly appreciated!
Trying to get the most bang for the buck.

NOTE i'm only 18 and working a full time job. My birds are my pride and joy and would like to get the most out of them.

 

It would help to have an idea what you want to do with the car (daily driver, race only, etc.) and a budget for engine mods. Remember, the transfer and suspension will most likely need work too.

 

I forgot to mention that. I have a 91 v6 3.1 that's my DD . This car is going to be my drag car.

 

From the top, Holley 750dp, rpm intake, pro-filer 195 heads, comp 292s solid, harland sharp or scorpian 1.6 roller rockers, stock crank and rods, summit racing rebuild kit, 30 over flat tops, arp throughout, 3500 lock up, 373 gear, slicks, skinnies, go run 11's cheap, spray it to bottom 11's with a conservitive hit and it will live forever. Cheapish, fast, fun.....done
Forgot, long tubes, custom 3" Y pipe, 3" to the back, single dynomax bullet. There....now done.....as for chassis.....admittedly I know jack about third Gen stuff yet lol....that will make the power, someone else can tell you how to put it down.

 

Lighten it up! spare tire out, ac delete, battery in rear. Good Torque arm is a must also.

 

with long tubes won't it need some tweaking due to the length? I was think headman shortys, edelbrock victor jr or performer intake. Also, the 750 wouldn't be too much for the current motor without all the bolt ons? The car currently runs great but when I turn it off it "putts" as if it's suckimg in air. Possible vaccuum leak?

 

You mentioned this was going to be your "drag car"....if so, a couple assumptions have to be made without having enough info. If its not lowered, then long tubes can be made to work fairly easily. Without knowing what cam or pistons are in it currently you can't possibly know what gear, what converter, what carb etc to use. Hence the list of parts I gave you above. If you can figure out what cam is in it currently, and if the rotating assembly is stock, we can look at other options. As for your deiseling problem, I would start with timing. A vacuum leak would usually show idle issues among other problems, where's the timing at now? Has the motor been apart? Dist out? Has anyone verified true tdc?

 

Well as you probably know they only came with a 305 in them that year. The guy I bought itoff put thr 350 in it. The motorbhasba punch of disconnected hoses. Most i'm assuming where to.the heater since that's the component.it's coming off of. I'm not too sure if it's a true 350 or noy.because I can'tnhet.to.thr casting number.

Forgotnto.mention the car does have the ws6 perfmance suspension.

 

NEVER go with Hedman headers. I've seen more of them with problems than ones that work properly. The previous owner of my car installed Hedman longtubes and they leak like crazy. New gaskets on both sides and they still leak. Never have had a problem with Hooker headers, I'd give them a try.

 

I'm using Doug's Longtubes and magnaflow xpipe with true 3 "duals and dynomax bullets, I personally love the way they sound. And before anyone replies they hang too low...they don't and my car is slightly lowered.

The rest of my combo:
Brodix IK 200 heads 360" 060 over 350
Probe 11.5:1 5.7 rods
Comp solid roller 254@.050 .630 lift
3800 tci super street fighter th350
4:11 moser 12bolt edelbrock torque arm w/ lca relocators.
S&W anti roll bar.
Ran high 10's at 123, and 6.96 at 99 mph

 

Start out slow and work your way up. Assuming the current engine is a 350 and is in good shape, start buying parts that will make it faster and be useable for when you really step it up. Long Tube headers and a good single exhaust (I use Hooker Super Comps into a single 3" back to a Dynomax Muffler). Put a Performer RPM Air Gap intake and a 650 Double Pumper. I higher stall converter, shift kit in the 700R4 and 3.73 gears in the rear. This should run pretty good with stock heads. When you save up enough for new aluminum heads, that is also the time to switch the cam.

 

If you are really going to be making a drag car out of it - do you plan to drive it or trailer it to the strip? If it's driven to the strip then I've got to assume you want to still run pump gas and get somewhat decent MPG - if it's going to be trailered to the track then all bets are off and you can build for a LOT more HP and a LOT less drivability....

That said - for a strong street/strip car I would start by pulling the engine out, tearing it down and determining what you have - worst case it's a great base to build from and the rings/bearings/oil pump, etc will support your power goals and it costs a $40-80 gasket set to put it back together. I'm going to guess it's just a stock low compression, low performance, dished piston 350 engine - which I wouldn't waste my time throwing a lot of expensive parts at as the stock cast dished pistons sitting around .025-.030" in the hole don't build much compression even with some of the 49cc heads out there. I would (at minimum) figure out an aluminum headed combo that will put you around 8.25:1 DCR with a cam that's got a good strong mid-range (3000-6500 RPM power band) that should still run on the best pump gas and be somewhat streetable with a high stall converter...

 

yea it will be driven to the track so somewhat good gas mileage is needed. Basically my goal is to get the car running on the loe 12's or possibly high 11's. That'll be fine with me. Now that you said something I do remember my biddy having a ton pf gasket issues with his hedman headers. Now as for aluminum heads which would be best? Should I buy a complete set or build it up myself?

 

Being that you are looking at drag racing only you want to get rid of the WS6 suspension stuff up front. Get some V6 springs in the front and remove the sway bar since it's just added weight and you are more concerned with going straight.

For what you have on the car now the 750 is way too much. A 650 DP will be a little better for what you have in the car now even with exhaust mods.

Hooker headers are my choice over Headman. I'd also get them non-coated and then send them out for a good coating like HPC or JetHot. I've had a set of Hooker coated headers on our 67 race car. Never driven in the rain although we got rained on a few times while at the track. The car was never street driven and it was garage kept and the headers had quite a bit of rust just after one season of racing (May-Oct). It seemed to be really thin compared to other headers that had coatings from other companies that our race friends had.

Make sure you have a good ignition system which includes wires, rotor button, dist. cap, ignition module, ect. GM HEI (non-ECM for you) distributors are one of the best out there but they are quite old too now. A weakness to the HEI's is cheap aftermarket caps and the rotor buttons installed in them. The button will have high resistance and the cheap plastic can lead to spark scatter later down the road.

If you decide to remove all the ECM wiring (it's got some weight to it) then you might have to make one mod. I'm not sure if 85 T/A's have the electronic speedo or not. Removing the ECM harness you lose the ground to the electronic speed controller and the wires going to the speed sensor on the transmission. You will have to cut the yellow and purple wires (ones going to the rear of the trans) out of the harness and splice them together and then run a ground to the connector to the control module that is mounted right next to the ECM. I had to do this with my 86 T/A.

 

85s have the mechanical speedo. 86 was the first year for the electric speedometer in our cars.
Makes it a pain because I can't just throw in a 140MPH cluster in mine.

 

For a carb - on the street I - depending on the combo I'd go with a 600 vac secondary for under 300 HP and a 750 vac. secondary for over 300 HP as they're a little more forgiving on the tuning and easier to setup to run lean at cruise and slightly rich for max power. I would only run a DP for a 'max effort' race car since I've seen too many guys either spend time trying to dial in the transition circuit on the street for good drivability, suffer with poor economy or have a 'flat spot' in the mid throttle... Not that it can't be done but it does take some time/effort to get it setup 'perfect' for your combo.

 

There are plenty of TGO members who have used Hedman longtubes in our cars. None have reported having leak or fitment problems that I recall from the Exhaust forum. At least one was a member who had a 305 running in the 11's - driven to the track. So I'll have to raise the here.

Unless you're willing to apply your entire take-home pay on this car, not likely you're going to get through bygddy's list anytime soon. But, without knowing what exactly what you've got, it's hard to make recommendations.

As for whether or not it's a 350 - you may not need to see the full casting #. Often the last 3 digits are cast in large numbers on the side of the block. Get under the car and look - you may get lucky.

Heads - 90% of factory production 350 heads from 1968-1995 are performance junk. Pull the valve covers and get the casting #'s. If you don't know what the heads are after getting the numbers, post them here, or look at the casting number sticky in the Engine Swap forum. You may get lucky, but odds are yours are from the 90%. 882 or 624 are very common, and are junk.

The rest really depends upon what you've learned going through these first steps. what comes next depends upon what you can afford.

Nothing wrong with DP for the street. Plenty wrong with VS for the strip.

 

The list I gave was "budget" stuff I thought? The rebuild kit from summit is 200$, and they are KB hypers with a 1.560 height, so not rebuilders crap. Pro-filer heads are 1100 bucks, and depending on your argument are on par with the best standard SBC heads out there. Proform roller rockers, 159$, used 750dp, PP knock off rpm intake. For a "dedicated" drag car that sees limited street time it seems reasonably "budget" . I only quoted the list based on the OP's lack of knowledge of his current parts list. But hey, if I'm 18, and on and shoe string budget I'm finding 416 heads, working the heck outnof them at home, 194/160's in them, buying a complete comp cam kit in the 236 dur and sub 500 lift, comp 12-326-4, with matching springs, assuming stock bottom end with small dished, then installing heads with a felpro 1094. Some Chinese roller rockers, used rpm intake and used 750DP, I'm selling the 700 to fund a TH350 swap, shift kit, and either a known good used 3500 converter or a summit house brand new unit. A set of 411's and spool if only driven to and from track. Used skinny front runners, and either used steel wheels, 15x8 from a vette have 4.5 BS and are dirt cheap, new 275/60 drag radials (not slicks cause lets be honest, spool or not its going to see street time, he is 18 after all) 70/30's, and v6 springs, lose the front sway bar, cut a coil out in the rear, weld in frame connecters. Used glass cowl hood from eBay or someone making a change and selling there's. Long tubes, flowmaster merge, 3" to the back, single bullit in stock location. Then a super diet, used lighyweight seats, no console, nothing in the rear, im thinking front carpet, door panels, seats and a dash, nothing more. If i can reach it, and either unbolt it or sawzall it off, its going. Its going to be light, loud, and angry......and just fast enough for the average 18 yr old to look like a hero....and probly get himself in trouble (I know I would have )

 

I love fast beaters......now I wish mine wasn't actually "nice" cause this sounds like alot of "I just don't give a ****" fun.....

 

I hear what you're saying and you can have some serious fun with a set up like that but I've learned the hard way about going cheap on things like Chinese roller rockers. We bought a cheap set for our race car and a couple of seasons after having them they started to crack and the bearings were getting rough. This wasn't some solid roller cam with heavy valve springs this was with a flat tappet hyd. cam.

There is just some things going cheap will cost you 2x to 3x more than spending a little extra and doing it right the first time.

 

Great advise. You guys are teaching me a ton being that i'm still young. The weather has been nasty here in South Jersey so I haven't gotten a chance to look under,or the casting number but will soon. You mentioned distributors, buddies have been throwing MSD in there cars. Never bv had an issue and I, personally, like the products. I have a MSD ignition coil in my 91.

 

Msd is good....but if on a budget a cleaned up stock HeI can be made to work just fine for your goals. Or I hate to say it, but I have a few friends running skip white's hei's with zero complaints.....

 

I don't disagree,and usually use harland sharps. But even comp has their die cast alum ones for like 159$ and although not as good as some, I have a couple friends using them and so far have had no issues. So there are cheap alternatives out there.

 

Well , stability is still an issue for I am going to want to let her loose on those nice springs days! So I don't think I'm going to eliminate any steering accessories. I'll upload a pic of the car today so you guys can see the project ahead D:

 

I believe the set that started to go bad was from Omega Gear or something like that. We now have CompCams stainless roller rockers and they are actually lighter than the aluminum sets. Not saying that is the way you or he should go. Just watch out for no name, e-bay stuff for your motor internals.

 

Pretty much what i'm looking for now is sone bolt ons to start out. Like headers, catbacks, intakes, etc. i don't feel,like ripping this motor up any time soon.

 

A car that runs well is one that has all the components matched to work with each other.

What kind of drag racing to you intend to do with this car? Street-type class? Mix it up with tranny brake cars? Is there a minimum ET you have to be able to run? Since you mentioned cat-back, can we assume you're going to drive the car to the track? (that makes a difference in what we would recommend)

Still haven't heard what you've got for engine (assuming it's a 350 is one thing, knowing is another), or heads. 90% of factory production 350 heads are performance junk. Get the casting numbers.

A mild cam will for sure keep you in a Street-type class. But, if you have large chamber, poor-flowing truck heads like most 350's available out there, more cam probably isn't going to help you much.

 

weather has been the main issue recently. With more sn numberow today it makes it hardto scope out idand casting numbers. But yes, it will be driven to and from the track. It doesn't need to be good gas mileage but something is better than nothing. I know racecar and mpg don't go together.

 

Something that a lot of people seem to forget. They slap parts on their car that they see from someones post and then wonder why their car doesn't run the same.

Pistons, cam, heads, intake, exhaust, torque converter, transmission, rear gears, rear tire diameter and suspension all have to work together. The best way is to set a goal for what you want out of your car then select the components needed to achieve your goal.

 

I understand exactly where you guys are coming from. You can't throw a huge cam in and expect the best, it just won't work! Hopefully today I'll get the Casting number, decode it, and fill you guys in with what I have.

 

New problem. Car will start but not shut off. Starts to choke out bu tthen putts back on slowly and dies out again. I have to choke the carb to shut it off. Possible timing? help?

 

Dieseling is what you call that and timing can be a part of it. Spark plugs heat range, carb tuning and vacuum line leaks have also been known to cause this as well. Leaving an automatic on gear when shutting the motor off can help keep this from happening but it's not a good solution to the problem.

 

Thanks man. I'm thinking it's the Carb because it's obviously bad being that the throttle doesn't go wide open or have much "snap" when closing. So, possibly some air leaking along.

 

Found this on my researching journeys.

"if you wanna quit dieselin, fix the carb. old quadrajunk carbs tend to not close all the way and they diesel. fix it to shut completely and it'll quit. if it don't , do the cold water thing with the engine warm.if that don't work, shut it off in gear. but i've had several do it and the carb was always the problem."

Since I have a QuadraJet carb and it is in fact not closing all the way would this be the issue?

 

They never close "All" the way because some air has to get by for the car to idle. If your car has a lot of miles your throttle bushings could be worn out and you are pulling air in through those as well. The carb is old and could be worn out and needs to be rebuilt. The Q-Jets are know to warp if the fuel bowl bolts were over tightened and the older they get the more parts get worn out.

Make sure you have a double return spring on the throttle lever. Make sure the throttle lever is sitting against the slow idle screw when the choke is fully open. Check your ignition timing and idle speed with the motor fully warmed up and choke fully open. Follow the service manual instructions so that you are adjusting the base timing.

Carb cleaner or cold start fluid can find vacuum leaks really well by spraying it near the throttle shafts and carb base. If idle increases then there is a problem there. You don't need to flood the area just get it wet.

 

How do I go about checking for vaccuum leaks with the starter fluid? If it is the carb would I be better off just getting a Holley 650 DP like I intended instead of dumping the money into a rebuild kit?

 

You spray starter fluid around the throttle shaft, the carb base, vacuum hoses at the carb and see if the idle increases. work in small areas, not spraying a whole side down.

I don't remember if you said if this motor is computer controlled or not.

If not then swapping carbs isn't that big of a deal except when swapping a spread bore for a square bore because most manifolds will not except both. Just one or the other. but they do have adapter plates but then you have to consider carb/air filter to hood clearance.

Swapping to a Holley, new or used, you will need to add a dual feed fuel system ( http://www.summitracing.com/parts/spe-5952 ) and either adapt the existing line from the pump to the carb or replace it with a new line. You will need the 700R4 TV cable adapter for the throttle lever. Holley PN 20-121 and you might need a throttle lever stud as well for the throttle cable.

 

The car has no computer and is strictly motor.

Ok, so, I am also working on an oil pan on my 1991 Firebird and I broke this piece for the engine coolant. Not sure what the name of it is to order a new one (If I can even find one!) Any clue? It is a 3.1l Fuel injected

 

I prefer to use something a little less volatile - The ether (starting fluid) can actually cloud the air and get sucked into the carb easy enough and cause a false reading. Use a spray lube (wd-40 or the like - if it says 'caution flammable' it's great - if it's not flamable it would just cause an idle drop as it gets sucked in), or a carb cleaner (as a bonus it cleans off the carb and intake while looking for the leak) Remember you're just looking for a change in idle speed/quality to find where the leak is.

Coolant control valve - it's probably there to cut off coolant flow when the a/c is on the "max" setting so it doesn't fight the heater core in the summer.

 

Thanks man. You guys have been helping me a ton with the projects

 

Thanks man. You guys have been helping me a ton with the projects

 

Yup, it cuts off coolant flow to the heater core so the A/C can be more efficient. Really important with R-134 systems.

 

My car's originally and R-12. However, I did do the conversion to R-134 so I guess it matters a lot. How do I go about deleting the A/C off the 85? Is there a A/C delete kit for them or can I just unbolt the pulley for it and get a smaller belt?

 

Is there anyway to use a newer code finder to find out what my CEL is throwing off in my 91 bird? I have the finder/decoder for vehicle I believe 96+ but didn't know if there was a way to use it for older vehicles

 

The 85 should have v-belts which then you just remove the A/C compressor, belt and A/C lines and it should be okay. My A/C system is an R-12 that had been converted to R-134 and it doesn't have that valve and it worked okay. I just need to replace the o-rings, dryer and recharge the system to get it working again.

My Actron can read the older OBD I systems but you have to have the adapter for it and I didn't buy that. Just use the paper clip method and short the A and B pins on the ALDL connector (located under the driver side dash) and the CEL/SES light will flash the error code to you. It will flash each code 3 times. First code will be 12, then the errors then 12 again when completed. If there isn't any errors then 12 keeps flashing

 

Can you thoroughly explain the paperclip method I thought you said something about it in here before but I couldn't find it last night when I was searching. Also, it has this rough feeling on the gas pedal. I don't know if it's the transmission or driveshaft because I just changed the oil pan on the 91 and the driveshaft fell out so I did put it in correctly, no leak and the trans is brand new maybe 20,000 miles if that. Maybe low on fluid, but the dipstick says it's full.

 

Read this article for the error codes.

When the drive shaft fell out did the caps on the u-joint stay on? I doubt this would be from the trans.

 

Yea first thing I checked. Possibly fell off when it hit the road again? I'll have to double check when I get home to jack the car up.

 

Successfully did the paper clip method. Code 13 was retrieved so that's my O2 sensor. Unfortunately, it looks a little weathered on so I don't know how i'm going to get it off without damaging or snapping the welds on the y-pipe. The bolt for it is one good i've tried taking it off before with NO luck. Any suggestions on how I can remove it?

 

Soak it good with either PB Blaster or Kroil and then try it. I've used Kroil a bunch of times and it has been one of the best products out there for this. You can find it at www.eastwood.com

I've also have heated the pipe plugs (block off plugs on engines) and got them really hot then cooled them off rapidly and that has always broke them free. It expands the plug and reforms the threads so when you cool it off, it shrinks and becomes loose. The best way to heat it up is with a Oxy/Ace torch (not cutting) but I have used a Propane torch on some items and got it to work as well.

The thing is that you are going to replace the O2 so cutting the wire and some material off behind the nut is okay if you need extra room.