I'm just wondering if anyone is using the Mass-flo brand of EFI, link: Mass-Flo Fuel Injection Systems. If so, how do you like it and are there any draw backs to the system? Would you purchase it again?

Thanks, Ed.

 

I have a similar system running on a TBI PCM and tuning with MAF is definatly easier, but there are some caveats.

One thing they do that isnt a real good idea is remove all but the center body of the MAF. Normally, the MAF has a flow straightener to smooth and direct the airflow through the MAF. The MAF is quite sensitive to airflow and monting it like that could cause problems. If you where to use that system, it would be a good idea to just use a standard MAF rather then the butchered one included and recalibrate the MAF flow table. It doesnt look like they give you any for tuning, though, so Id look elsewhere. And the cost! $3000+! Maybe if it was tunable in the field, but its not... An easier option would probably be to use a 7730 and an MPFI manifold.

 

Thanks for responding Dimented, you've given me cause to look at other options.

 

I was looking at this too....

http://www.mass-floefi.com/index.html

The Chevy is on sale for 2500 right now...steep...but it seems like a good set up.

 

From what I'm reading on the NET, and I don't know much about EFI, the Mass Air Flow systems are much cheaper to tune than Speed Density systems. So, somebody correct me if I'm wrong and then direct me to an inexpensive (or at least less expensive) source in the Midwest that can help tune my 91 Z28...please.

 

Edward...

what part of the Midwest are you in? IL? WI?

There is a guy named Norman Brandes in Silver Lake, Wisconsin that I consider...in automotive terms...to be a God. His Speciality is Vipers and LT1/LS1 cars but he can do anything...AMC and Fords too...he is one of the greatest auto gurus I have ever talked to and if I ever have the cash...he's gonna build the engine of my dreams. He IS that good....

http://www.westechauto.com/

He was responsible for almost ALL of GM's final F-Body mods like (look these up...) the Goldrush Trans Am, The Hurst Hauler Trans AM and the Camaro 302....which I personally seen with my own two eyes in his shop back in 2001...he does unbelieveable work....totally unbelieveable...

 

Hey John,

Thanks for the information. I am in the northwestern suburbs of the Mpls./St. Paul area of Minnesota. I'll check out Norman's website.

-Ed-

 

I have MAF (what thier using), and after using it for awhile now I can tell you from experience that the AFR is but one piece of the overall puzzle. Theres the startup fueling, initial enrichment, idle, etc. and all of those are unique to each motor. While the MAF had the fueling covered, it still took me about 30-40 burns to get the car to run well, and will probably take another 10-20 to get the last few kinks out. One thing that is definatly unique to each motor is the cranking/startup fueling, unless theyre trying to use the MAF for that, which isnt a real good idea. I think itll probably run well, but itll go out of its comfort zone every now and then. Id have to see it in action when its cold and miserable out to be a believer.

What would be really nice is if they offered a tuning package along with it. It looks like it could be a potent setup that could run like a late model factory setup if they allowed the end user some flexibility to adapt it to each vehicle. When will companies start doing that.

 

I read through the whole intro, and he does make a convincing argument, but the fact that they use an electronic dist. with the timing in the ECM makes the whole turn key thing look more like . Maybe with a standard dist., but the timing is a whole nother story. I dont think we'll ever see an intuative, easy to tune aftermarket EFI setup that can truely take the place of a carb.

 

Actually, the more I look at it, the more interesting things I see. It looks as though their using an old early 90's OBD I ford ECM. I usually go out of my way to avoid working on fords, but those connectors are unmistakably ford. It may very well be tunable if it retained the factory code. Might just be a matter of popping it open and replacing the chip with an adaptor and your own chip. Also looks kinda like theyre using a converter of some sort for the LS1 MAF. IIRC the fords used voltage based MAFs, no?

Very interesting. If I had lots of money and nothing better to do, I would purchase one just to mess around with it.

 

your right 24x7, i can't tell about the relays, but other than the MAF, everything is ford, MAP, IAC, TPS, TIF, right down to the dianostic connector.
ford did use voltage based MAFs back then.

 

If you are looking at an aftermarket EFI system, consider magasquirt. Only costs about 200 dollars(fuel only) or 250 for fuel and spark, and can run MAP, MAF, or MAF+ MAP for extra accuracy. It is a DIY, but the support forums are awesome.
Also has lots of user-specified outputs which can be used to control any number of devices! (fan, lights, TC lockup, you name it)

 

Bringing this one back to life. I haven't been following new products for a while but finally came across this product. I just seen a write up on it in the May issue of Chevy High Performace. I'm not very knowledgable with the whole fuel injection deal & I've seen all of your comments & feedback on the system already.

But, I'm just curious if anyone has finally had some time & money to actually get a setup & try it out? I like the idea of not having to tune anything & the claim of the computer "self-learning" as you change stuff. But, like anyone else....is it BS or plausible with how they set this thing up with the MAF on top of the throttle body? In theory, I understand everyone has the knowledge to comment....but just curious if anyone has had actual hands on playing with this thing?

Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys!!

 

ttt

 

Take a look here.

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/show...&highlight=efi

http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...php?tid/153680

 

Im using a '95 truck PCM with the LT1/LS1 MAF with my TBI injection. For the most part, mods to the engine have little effect on the fueling and is much easier to calibrate. It doesnt mean that there is no tuning to be done, though, just that I dont have to worry about the steady state fueling as much. Also the self learn with that system is mainly for part throttle in closed loop, just like a stock GM ECM. When you nail the gas, the ECM enteres power enrich, and there are no (or very little) corrections during WOT.

The MAF doesnt really care whats behind it, but it does care about the airflow through it. This is effected by the intake tract configuration, so intake mods require changes to the MAF flow table in the prom to maintain accuracy. On top of this, you also need to select your airbox and ducting very carefully. I can say from experience that any resonance or airflow changes will seriously screw up the fueling. The way they have it set up is the way you DONT want it. The MAF must be fully intact (screen and all) and mounted in the ducting close to the throttle body. If I where to buy that system, Id refuse the hacked up MAF and see if I could get a credit of some sort.

 

From what I understand they use the A9L or A9P Ford EEC. That's what came in the Fox body 5.0's. A9L being the manual trans and A9P the auto. The OEM Ford A9L's were a great system if you ask me. I'm not quite sold on the "one size fits all" tho...

 

Cool, thanks for all the responses guys. And V8Astro Captain is right about those Ford EEC's, they are considered to be a pretty good system & good in the self learning department.