Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Installed and wired my MS2 into a relay board following the diagram I am attatching below.

The issue I am having is a no start with terminal B. If it is connected it will crank over and not fire. If I disconnect it the car will fire and run no problem.

If I connect them while the engine is running it will stall and not fire up.
So right now I have been running them disconnected and the timing locked out...any ideas?

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

may have found my answer here.....thoughts???

http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...part2-nova.htm

reconfigure for hei8 ignition

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

What ignition did you tell your MS2 you are running?

Is your MS2 setup for HEI ? You typically have to change a few jumpers on the MS2 3.57 board when using HEI.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I don't know if it is or not its the ms2 with the 3.57 board.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

ill look at my msq when I get home and post what I have for settings.

LilSki

iTrader: (1)

I have had to use the HEI mod on mine and have helped a few convert over to it.

http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/p...kit-p-325.html

You can make your own with a 100ohm resistor. There is a video link on how to install it.

EDIT: I just re-read your post and it sounds like your ignition out wire is not connected properly. I use JS10 on mine and after you connect it you need to set it in the tune.

This is a picture of my 3.0 board but you can see the bottom red wire. It goes from JS10 under the processor over to the IGN out over by the main connector. The 3.57 board should be similar. I have one I can take a picture of if you need to see it.



EDIT 2
I had a minute and took a picture of the 3.57 board. The JS10 hole is labeled on the oposite side but you can see which one it is in the pic. It goes over to the middle hole where the optional ignition driver would go. I still recommend the HEI mod regardless.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I ordered that last night....I am hoping that will solve my issue....for 8 dollars ill give it a whirl

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

heres my board

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

You will need to set some jumpers for use with HEI. I doubt they are set from the factory. Your best best is to email Matt @ diy auto tune.

Then, you need to modify your ignition settings in tunerstudio. You'll want falling edge, trigger rise, 2.0msec coil dwell, and the spark output should be 'going high'.

Then unplug your est connector, set your base timing, tell tunerstudio what that number is and you should be all set.

-- Joe

LilSki

iTrader: (1)

OK you are hooked up properly. Make sure the Spark A output is set right in the tune. By default it may be D14 but you want JS10.

If the engine is running in base time then that means the computer is seeing the signal from the module so the HEI mod may not be needed. This sounds like the ignition out is not working properly.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

EST would be terminal B from the dist? im running a HSR setup so I don't have the est connector

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

then engine wont run unless I have B from the ignition module disconnected

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

edited first post

LilSki

iTrader: (1)

Yes because B is the 5vref. When it sees 5vref is expects to see a signal from pin E. If there is no signal from pin E it won't run. You have to make sure that pin E connects all the way back to JS10 inside the computer.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I run the harness to the relay board then the relay board harness goes to the ecu the wiring from the dist to the relay board is good....

LilSki

iTrader: (1)

Is Spark A output set to JS10?

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I believe ive tried js10 and got the same result

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

whats the spark hardware latency?

LilSki

iTrader: (1)

I would make 100% sure pin E connects to JS10 through all the wiring with a multimeter. If that is then the only things it could be is the MSII chip or the ignition module.

What firmware are you running?

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Here is where I left off back in December.ive tried js10 and falling edge and gm bypass off also

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

..I ordered the HEI mod kit and will try that. Ive also set the options in my MS tune as well

Spark mode--Basic trigger , Trigger angle offset to 10*, Falling edge, GMhei bypass off , Spark A output to Js10 ,Dwell type to standard dwell and Spark output to Going high

I will also check terminal E thru JS10 and see what's going on there.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

The "Mod" kit is two jumper wires (one has a resistor). Based on the pictures you showed, I don't see the green jumper wire. So I don't believe your MS2 is set up to do HEI.

Once you get the "kit" in the mail, follow the instructions. You connect the two wires to the spins specified and you should be good to go.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Yeah I am hoping that's all it will be. the tune is already set on my laptop and ill load it once I get the HEI Mod complete and put some fuel into the empty tank .lol

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Well, I just checked and I will have my jumper kit delivered today so I can tackle that once I get home from work and the gym. I'm hoping that will take care of the issue.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Should. The MS2 supports a number of different ignitions, but with only 35 pins on the ECM interface you sometimes have to jumper things when changing systems.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Very true man. Once fixed I will neaten up the wiring

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Well.....I got home expecting the items to be in my mailbox like the USPS website said they would be...not there...had to call the USPS and file a claim for a missing package...so pissed at the moment

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

While I am waiting to see where my package went I made my own jumper kit. Cost me two dollars.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

edit, didn't see the picture. Looks like you got the 100ohm resistor.

Does it run now?

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I wont know until I go home tonight. And yes I used a 100 ohm resistor 1.49 from Radio Shack for a pack of five.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Cool. Yeah you should be good to go.

You should be quite happy with the system.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I will keep you posted if this works. If it does I can finish tuning the Camaro this year.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Well............loaded the new ignition setting and fired it up......Let it warm u to operating temp and set my trigger offset and my timing . I shut it off and went inside to eat dinner. Then went back out and it has started numerous times so I think everything is all set.
I'll let it sit all night and see if she fires first thing in the morning.

project89

iTrader: (1)

what setup are u using on the est bypass wire?

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Haha it won't change over night. Glad you got it working.

Now you just need to get a boost control solenoid and hook it up to your wastegate so you can dial in boost curves.

How close are you to framingham? You can get e85 out there. Hook up a flex fuel sensor to your fuel rail and you can run any blend of octane you desire.

MS is really amazing stuff. After like two days of playing with the MS I regretted all those years of messing with tunercat and tunerpro and emulators and all that crap GM stuff.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

As of right now I am using a switch. I did read somewhere about a relay being used for that circuit.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

(1) I went out this morning and attempted to start it.....crank no fire....so I shut off the B ref via the switch I had in there.....cranked it over and it fired up..Once it fired I turned the switch for B Ref back on..... It stayed running.

(2) I work in Framingham at the Chevrolet Dealer right next to the MEMA/State Police Barracks.

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

This--Right from the website___--One note: You might notice in the HEI section of the MegaManual the recommendation to wire the B wire (5V) through a relay that makes this 5v signal hot when the engine is running, but not when it is cranking. Let me explain why-- this 5v signal tells the HEI module to allow the ECU to control the timing. When the ECU is NOT getting a 5v signal it goes back to base timing (whatever you set with a timing light here in a few minutes). The stock ECU does NOT send 5v when cranking so that the engine cranks at base timing. Wiring this as per the MegaManual creates the same type of behavior. My wiring recommendation above goes about this differently, but works well nonetheless. The difference is the computer is controlling timing during cranking. This shouldn't cause a problem as long as the computer is configured properly, and in my tests I've had no negative effects at all.

make sense Joe?

project89

iTrader: (1)

thats sounds liek the diyautotune way of sending 5 volts on a controllable ecm output circut so its automatic , ive always done the relay, i may switch do a toggle switch this time around i like the idea of throwing timing back to base at will if im out somewere and dont have a laptop with me, and i get bad gas or something

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I already had the toggle switch in place from when I used to control my cooling fans(which are now controlled by a different way) so I used that switch for the EST(B ref) control.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Yes, your crank advance is probably too high.

What is your base timing? 10 degrees? If so, when EST is unplugged you are cranking at 10 degrees. Once you apply 5 volts on the EST wire the ECM controls the timing. Your car probably won't start at 25 or whatever you have degrees.

So what is your cranking degrees set to ?

I have a different revision MS so my +5 on the EST connector is only during "run", so my cranking is on the module.

The MS2 is a little older and doesn't have some of the logic on board that mine has, so you can mimic such logic wiring it up this way:



Frankly, I think controlling cranking advance with the ECM is fine too.



-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Base timing is 14* and trigger offset is set to 14*. Where would I look for the cranking degrees?

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Well, that depends on what version of firmware but basically it's under "ignition settings" where you set the trigger type and all that.

Default is normally 10. So if your base is set to 14, set it to 14 or 20.

Setting it to less than your base might be an issue.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

Just to clarify it is not the same as the trigger offset?

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

No, not the same.

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

ok I will have to check where it is. I'm running the updated tuner studios program.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

What firmware are you running?

http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewto...?f=101&t=52147

-- Joe

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

I will have to check the back of my MS2. I think it said 3.3.0......

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Oh this was too funny. Last I checked it took the crappy GM stuff to fire any engine it was being utilized on in less than five minutes the first shot, let alone eight days for this MS user. Amazing indeed...

Badass355ciz28

iTrader: (17)

is that a crack towards me?