Yes, this is bad.

Click here for details:

http://moates.net/mainframe.htm

This is my child, torn apart from the inside out.
Keep this in mind the next time you choose parts.

Hey, at least it was tuned good!

 

Ouch!

 

Ewwwwwwww, like the post before that had to hurt.....

 

When you blow up a motor you really blow up a motor.

 

Hey Craig. You said not to "skimp on parts". What parts did you skimp on? The valve springs? Which valve springs were you running?

Tim

 

Man Craig, I feel your pain.. A couple years back I did the EXACT same thing... Bought cheap valve springs and paid for it ten-fold...



Pics and details of that are on my site for anyone who cares.. (see sig) Hope you're back up and running soon..

Cheers,

 

Hokey chit! Talk about self distruction.

 

Ouch...Hopefully it'll keep other from buying cheap parts.

David

 

Craig,

JB Weld & a new Coat hanger wont fix that right up? Well, maybe the piston hole, but might be hard to glue the tops of the valves back on. J/K.

Sorry for your pain amigo, Most of us have been there. I think my Buddy Marv says it best, "only a rich man can afford to buy cheap parts, because only a rich man can afford to replace them time, after time, after time". still sucks.

Bob

 

You're not cool until you can do it with a shoestring and a potato while powering the eastern seaboard.

 

Those pics put the pain into the belly of anyone who views them. What is a quick breakdown of what you were runnning in it?

 

those pictures are gonna give me nightmares

 

damn thats some carnage....

Last engine I broke lost a rod bolt... blew the crank, a couple rods and pistons, and of course the block.

But that was a Ford 302.. still haven't killed a chebby.. yet. BW

 

Sheesh! You're going to have to sell a lot of PROM adapters and EPROM chips to cover that! Got anything new that I need. I've got a few bucks I can lay on you.

BTW, you have GOT to tell us what brand of valve springs those are! (They were rated for your application, right?)

Sorry to see it buddy. My 383 rolled over 13k and two years just recently and still holding. Hits 7k pretty often and I hold my breath everytime! Sounds so good I can't stop it though.

Just to stay on topic. Hardly any of the original 3rd gen left except the hacked up 165 harness and the BBK throttle body.

Let me know. . .

 

My condolences Craig!

Look at it this way, now you can do what I should have done in the first place:

LS-1 crate motor
ported heads
big-*** cam
MTI computer


reliability, over 400 at the wheels, and while getting 22 mpg !

Good luck and let us know what you decide to build next!

Mike

 

OUCH! What kind of Springs were those and then what did you punish them with?! Cam/RPMs!

SUCK!

 

i looked at the pics. a good machine shop, a sleeve, a new head, and a fresh piston could get it up and running without breaking the bank. doesnt look like the crank took any abuse so if the block is still mechanically sound then everything should be ok.

aside from the hole i saw every thing except the cylinder head looked repairable and to be honest ive seen some guys who could fix that to.

 

I hadn't really revved it too terribly much. Usually brought it up to 6k and that was about it, even though there was lots more up top. I'm thinking that the outer spring was already broken/fatigued (it had been running kinda rough for a few days), and that the inner had kept it 'alive'. Should have inspected below the covers and not just changed plugs. Hindsight 20/20 right? Maybe.

OK, here was the 383 combo, starting with the springs:

1) Springs: Used (there's the mistake) Lunati 'green stripe' (also known as 'bad luck' springs I've come to find out) 1.550 set up at 1.900" and 170# seat. Also had lash caps.
2) Heads: Iron Sportsman ][ heads, 2.05/1.60, opened up, flow tested at 275/190. Fresh guides, etc.
3) Block: 010 high nickel 4-bolt 2-piece ca. 1979, .030 over
4) Crank: Scat 9000 externally balanced stroker
5) Rods: Scat 4340 Forged I-beam
6) Pistons: TRW/SpeedPro Powerforged, press-fit
7) Cam: Comp Cams small base circle solid roller 236/242@.050,.560I/.570E
8) Lifters: Comp Cams solid roller (especially for deeper galley requirement of SBC cam)
9) Rockers: Comp Cams ProMagnum 1.5 full roller
10) Pushrods: Comp Cams Magnum, good ones.
11) Timing: Billet Comp Cams set /w/ 'cast' aluminum cover, offset bushing for dial-in to 4 deg.

Total damage:
- Block shot
- One piston gone and others damaged
- One head gone along with 2 valves & 1 spring
- One rocker arm trunion bearing damaged / rough
- One pushrod bent

Stuff that MAY be OK:
- Rods & crank
- Timing set, cam, lifters, oil pan / timing cover
- All but one rocker, all but one pushrod
- Damper, flexplate, etc...
(Wouldn't be betting on that #6 connecting rod ;( )

I'm thinking on what to build next. Still going to make it 165 MAF-based. Looking for ca. 600hp this time on the engine. Stroked 400? Hmmm....

Maybe I can reuse some of the valve springs.... No, not really!

Muahahaha!

 

criag i can get in touch with people at world products and see how the durability is comming on the 454 motown build ups theve been doing. yeah a 454 SBC is the **** !!!! anyways theve got the parts now to do it. as for cylinders heads the pro line 18 degree heads would be on the top of my list or a set of nascar sb2's. you can pick those up from a few places. hell i would say if your gonna trash the block trash it all. if your shooting for 600hp and driveability i would consider looking at some with forced indution. or go for the biggest SBC you can scew together. at 454 CI the problem will be finding cylinder heads with enough port to feed the monster but i think worl products has head snow that are 220cc intake so that might nix the problem right there. anyways toss me an email i might be able to dig something up out here for you. and sorry to here about the engine going kaboom.

Did the gear set install go smooth ?

 

Dohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Do i know that feeling :-(

Looks like your dampers started breaking and knock out everything else just like mine started too :-( I had to redo a head cause it was seeping oil on the outside and when i pulled the valve covers i found all my dampers had broke or wear fatigues and the formie vortec 350 soon got a rebuild . Went thru the pump obvioulsy and had shards all over in the engine but managed to catch it before catastrophic failure occured

I share your pain but hey look at it as an excuse to go bigger/faster :-)

LAter
Jeremy

 

There have been a few on-lines sources for ti keepers, then decent retainers, with Lunati springs.

I've lost faith in Comp cams and Crane.
The Comp 980s are junk, IMO. I broke some on a 5,200 RPM engine.

FWIW,
Sorry about the kid.

 

Contrary to what Bruce said I've seen nothing but reliability from the Comp 987 series springs. I personally know several people running them in applications from road racing to drag racing to double duty and tripple duty with street driving. Definitely not good for a solid roller application ... but definitely an awesome spring for a hydraulic roller application. I have a set of dynoed 987s that are going on my car. The matching titanium retainers should be here today and then I have to mic each location and shim as necessary.

As far as the motowns go ...
When my motor goes I'll be going the 427 shortblock route. The 454 is a great idea ... but they are getting that extra 27ci via the bore. Both the 427 and the 454 have the same stroke from Motown. The 454 gets overbored to the limit where rebuilding it might prove to be difficult. The 427 has tons of life left in it and can be bored over many many times.

Tim

 

Actually, the 427ci motown block can be bored and stroked to 500 cubic inches!! :hail: Thats right, a 500 ci. SBC ! I have the build up in one of my chevy high performance mags.


I still say save up for a 382 ci all-bore heads and cam LS-1. 500+ horsepower and 22 mpg with great street manners is hard to beat!

 

I'm not seein' any pics

 

ditto..

 

http://www.moates.net/gmecm/death/

 

OUCH! Hope that engine killing disease isn't going around! Makes me want to swap springs just for the hell of it.

 

Craig, would you mind telling us what parts you believe were sub-standard that failed and caused this so hopefully no one else makes this same mistake..?

(Don't worry, I've lunched some parts before myself, including a brand new Crane cam!)

 

The root cause of failure was a broken #6 exhaust outer valvespring. It actually broke a few days earlier, and had I been more diligent, I would possibly have discovered it. The car had begun to run a little rough, and I think the broken outer is why. Later, when winding it up, the inner was no match for inertia.

I had reused some 'green stripe' 1.550 valvesprings from Lunati (as mentioned before). They had been lying around a while, but I tested them out and set them up at like 170# on-seat. I think they were around 500# 0.500 at lift if I remember correctly. Height was 1.900. I used lash caps. I guess the solid roller cam probably didn't help, even though the lash was set correctly.

Anyways, bottom line, if you have to think twice about reusing a part, then don't do it.

I just pulled the engine/tranny combo out last night. I hope to find the cam and crank servicable. Then again, reuse is kinda sketchy now. You get gun-shy in a hurry.

Really, the worst thing right now is that my EFI test mule is down.

 

Yea, I'll be honest, too, I bought all new stuff; including a new cam and lifters; however, I didn't check that each lifter went in smooth. I started the motor up (for the first time) and YUM! That was a tasty cam. Lunched lifter and lobe for intake on #1. I was also using 1.6:1 roller tip rockers - I thought I had calculated everything out but when I went back over everything, I noticed that the lift with the springs (Crane, brand new to match the cam) was within .003" of the tolerance; I opted to not only go with 1.5:1 rockers, but go with a different cam entirely (the new cam has fairly similar tolerances, but has substantially less advertised duration, but more .050" duration.)

Talk about miserable; I lunched this cam within 30 minutes of starting the car!

So far the new cam seems to be working out great though, now I'm just down to tuning; everything else is set. Hopefully Bill will send me my prototype PROMinator quick so I can really tune faster.