I was going to get into this over a year ago but now I come back to do it and it's all different now with thing like AutoPROM and PROMinator and now I'm just confused So much to read through and I keep getting more and more excited.

I've got a 7730 ECU in my 1992 Trans Am GTA, and an extra stock MEM-CAL. I want to be able to hook up my laptop to the ALDL connector and see real time data output when running, and be able to change and save variables in the PROM BIN on the fly. I also want everything self contained in the ECM under my dash so that I never have to do more than simply plug my laptop into the ALDL connector. Lastly, I want to be able to download and save entire BINs to my laptop as well as upload them to the PROM.

Now, is this all possible with all the new stuff and exactly what do I need?

Thanks!

P.S. I already use TunerPro RT to edit.

 

As far as ALDL is concerned, you need an interface. For this you have two options - both fully supported for your vehicle in TunerPro RT:

1) Get a serial or USB interface. Serial interfaces are offered by a number of sources including Steve Ruse, Andrew Mattei, etc. USB interfaces are only available from Craig Moates AFAIK.

2) AutoProm - This is an ALDL Interface AND will take care of your next requirement:

As far as buttoning up everything under the dash *WITH* the ability to upload bin data, etc, you, again, have two choices (well, three, actually):

1) The Prominator. This is simple and effective both in cost and functionality. This will allow you to permanantly replace your chip, button up under your dash, and upload/download bins. It includes software that you'll need to upload/download bins. TunerPro RT support coming soon.

2) The AutoProm - this is more complex and expensive, but with more functionality, namely realtime emulation, chip burning, ALDL interfacing (including 3 additional channels of A/D for WBO2, etc), as well as some more accessories being worked on (remote control, anyone?). Permanant installation is fine, since memory is stored in non-volatile RAM. Full TunerPro RT support for all features.

3) Romulator - This is an emulator, however, XTronics does not recommend "permanant" installation due to the fact that memory is battery backed. TunerPro RT supported (on all features except the latest "memory hit tracking").

Options are good. No need to be intimidated. Just choose whats right for you!

 

Sounds like I definantly want AutoPROM then since it already works with TunerPro and gives a WB O2 option which I do want to upgrade to soon.

So, I buy AutoPROM install it under the dash with the ECM (I assume instructions for this will be included) and then all I need to do is buy a USB to ALDL adapter?

That's it? That's all I need to buy, just those 2 things? How hard is it to install AutoPROM? Can you give me and over view of how I would do it for permanent installation? Also what software do I use to see realtime data output from the ALDL on my laptop while the car is running? Is TunerPro RT also the best for that too?

Thanks, I really appreciate your help!

 

If you choose to go with the AutoProm, you don't even need the ALDL adapter. ALDL logging is built into the device.

Regarding installing with the ECM, there are no instructions, but you'll figure it out. All you need to do is install the AutoProm chip header into the ZIF in your memcal/adapter and then place both the ECM and AutoProm under the dash.

Note, however, that having the AutoProm under the dash will make it hard to burn chips with it (not that you'll need to), as the chip burning ZIF is located on the AutoProm itself.

For viewing realtime ALDL info, for your vehicle (7730 ECM I assume), you can use TunerPro RT and the included 7730 ads stream definition. I wouldn't say TunerPro is the best, but its certainly "useable" and getting better every release!

Your other option is to get a prominator (which can only be permanantly installed in the ECM), which uses the Parallel port of your PC, and to get a serial/usb ALDL interface. That may end up being cheaper than the AutoProm if you choose to go with the non "realtime" prominator. However, with this choice you will not be able to make realtime changes while the engine is running.

To be clear, the AutoProm can log data from your WB02 *controller*. It does not control your WB02.

 

So with all the new stuff out what would you recommend for someone that already has Tunercats, datamaster and a PPII? I would love to get some help with the programing aspect.

I can do all the burning, but having a problem getting it to help my car :-)


Chris

 

Also, when doing DIY PROM burning, its highly recommended you pick up an adapter for your stock memcal from Moates. You'll need a G1 or G3. Many of the guys around here use them.

You'll also need this to connect the AutoProm to your ECM.

 

So that way I see it is I installed the AutoPROM onto my ECM board and I'll end up having a USB cable that I can have access to via the under dash access panel. The USB cable I can plug unto my laptop and do the datalogging and make the on the fly changes to the BIN right? So I bascially would never even need to access the ALDL for my purposes.

It sounds like I remove the factory MEM-CAL and then install the AutoPROM in it's place and that is what has the BIN saved for the ECM to use?

Am I on the right track? I just want to be sure before I order it tonight...

Thanks!

EDIT: I need a mem-cal adapter too? for what? Now I'm confused again?

 

My (and most) recommendations would be to read, read, read. Start small, make changes, note the changes and their affects.

I would venture to say just about every question you could possibly come up with has been answered on this board somewhere. Searching makes them easier to find!

Sounds like you already have everything you need in terms of hardware.

 

The AutoProm is a box all by itself. It does not get installed *in* the ECM, but rather connects to it. You can see pictures at www.moates.net.

Yes, with the autoprom connected to both your ECM and your ALDL connector, all you'd need to do is plug the AutoProm's USB cable into your laptop and you'll have full control of your ECM as well as ALDL datalogging capabilities, all from the single USB connection to your laptop.

See my other post about your memcal. You'll need an adapter (~$30).

 

Ok, I'm going to order the following P/N's from Moates site, let me know if I have them correct?

APU1: AutoProm Package: USB Version

G1: GM Memory Adapter: TPI Etc

Now what does "memory bank switching capability" do for me that is offered with the G3?

Also do I need to buy a chip too? Like the C1 or not?

It also says something on his site like I "probably" need a ZIF too, why and what will this do?

Thanks!

 

With the G1, you can install a 29F040 chip with 16 bin images on it and switch between them while the car is running. This is especially handy when you purchase the remote with the switch (you'll want the G3 package, which includes chips, and the switch remote if you choose). This is what I have, and I use it for switching between economy (mild spark, etc), performance (hotter spark, etc), valet (rev/speed limiters), and wife (car won't start :-D). I don't install my AutoProm permanently, though I have run the car for 2 weeks straight from it. =)

Yes, I recommend getting at least 2 29C256 chips. You can use the AutoProm to burn them with "backup" images of your bin. When doing DIY-PROM stuff, its *always* recommended you have a known-good chip in the car with you at all times. Bad things have been known to happen (static happens, for one), and this allows you to make it right.

A ZIF is not required but recommended. It makes it very easy to insert and remove chips and/or the AutoProm chip header. The G3 packages include a ZIF, 2 chips, etc.

If you want the remote, you'll need to purchase that separately.

 

Ok awesome, I like having different chips options for the wife

So I'll get a G3 and say 4 C1's and 2 C3's. Will these all work with each other?

Now what's with the ZIF that I may need? Last question I hope

It looks like I'll need the S3 right?

EDIT: Oh so if I buy a G3 it already comes with the ZIF?

 

See post above for ZIF info.

Regarding the switching option, note that you cannot use the switch when the AutoProm is installed. That functionality may come later (built into the AutoProm), but for now, if you choose to use the switch, you'll need to remove the AutoProm and install a 29F040 chip.

I know, theres just so much information to soak in, huh?

Also note that I'm not trying to push any one product (believe it or not). The Prominator is also an excellent choice. And if you're just starting out in this, you may find it easier to use. However, if you think you'll be in it for the long haul and do some serious tuning, the AutoProm may be a better choice.

I support (heck, I own) all of the products I've mentioned in this thread. =)

 

Alright final review. I will order the following:

APU1: AutoProm Package: USB Version

G3: GM Bank Switching Adapter: TPI Etc

C1: Atmel 29C256 Chip (about 4 of them)

Is all that right? And you said that the G3 will come with 2 C3 chips and the ZIF? I can't find anything about any G3 packages on his order page? He even talks about some "GP3" package but I cannot find it....

Whoa, $404 worth of stuff. I hope that's right...

 

Hmmm. you're right... its not there. Email him and tell him you want the GP3. It includes the G3, ZIF, 1 29C256, 1 29F040.

You may also want the remote switch (PN: EX) that will work with the G3.

Also note that the APU1 comes with 1 C256 and 1 F040, so you may not need the GP3. Maybe just the G3, S3, and an extra C1 (and EX if you want it).

Email craig and let him know all of this before you order, just to make sure.

 

Got it thanks!!!!

I emailed him this morning with a couple questions that got answered in this but I have not heard back yet. I'll wait for his reply and I'll reply to that with all of the parts that I'm going to buy to verify it with him right before I place my order. I can't wait to get the stuff and start! I've already got a BIN that I modded I can't wait to test out!

Thanks for all of your help!

Alex

And to think I was going to spend big time $$$ on a F.A.S.T. DFI with WB O2!!!

 

Good because I couldn't find GP3 on there to order anyway...