After logging some data with TunerPro while trying to correct a "soft spot" on AE just off idle, I noticed that the TPS voltage and TPS% is increasing but the injector PW is not until alot of TPS increase is added. I don't believe it is going into PE before injector PW increases. I just have a slightly dead spot right off idle.
Should I be trying to get the PW to increase right along with the increase in TPS say above 3%TPS?
My O2 voltage also goes lean on TPS increase.
Using MAP 8D with 6 spd.

 

It's delta TPS. If your moving the throttle too slow, you won't get any AE.

 

I need to clarify my question, when should I see the PW of the injectors increase? How much movement of the throttle would I be seeing in %, in voltage?

 

In order to envoke AE you have to move your TPS X% over a set period of time. On tbi ecm's it's 12ms. In order to use the 3% cell in your TPS delta AE table you have to move your TPS 3% in less than 12ms. If you move your throttle slow enough you can get to WOT without ever envoking any AE at all.

So the awnser to your question is.....it depends. Hope that helps

 

I'm not sure about MAF TPI's, but the attached thread might give you some ideas to how AE works in general.

I have lean spots at very light throttle (tip in and decel). My trouble appears to stem from the larger injectors playing havoc with my PID loops. Although I still don't have it sorted out yet...

https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=323749

 

I have the following datalog from TunerPro:

TPS Volts TPS % INJ PW O2 MAP
.59 0 .66 803 24
.92 7.03 .45 93 39
The above figures are at 0 MPH, just cracking throttle.
The nest set is just getting underway from a stop.

.78 5.86 .26 155 46
.92 10.16 .22 66 55
.94 10.94 .22 62 55
1.00 12.89 .19 44 61
1.18 18.75 .15 44 75
1.29 22.27 .18 62 69


You can see the trend, lower PW as I open TPS and load increases, these are afew readings within a couple seconds time period. I have been playing with the AE tables to get rid of this trend, but so far have not found the right one I guess.

So am I correct in my thinking that the AE needs to be played with or am I heading down the wrong path?

 

Do you have an auto or man trans? If it's an auto, are you in gear or park?

I have a mt and when i take off from a stand still i used to go lean. I increased my delta Map vs AE table in the lower cells and improved my take off.

From what i understand, the delta TPS vs AE is for fast moving tps and the delta map vs AE is for the slower moving stuff.

 

I have a manual trans. How much of an increase did you use on the Delta Map table?

 

I was originally an auto so I ended up with almost 3x the factory values in the 0,20 delta map cells. Apparently mt's require a bunch more AE than autos.

I also have other issues that may be affecting VE and AE so you may not need as much. I would increase it gradually and see if it makes a difference. Too much AE and the engine will puke pretty violently (been there as well. )

 

I'm not really sure of what you're trying to say here, so maybe this will clear it up:
Delta TPS AE is (usually) instantly available, ie an asynch PW is added to the fueling.
Delta MAP/MAF AE is added into the normal fuel calculation. So there isn't the immediate response of the TPS invoked AE.

Then not all Data streams show the TPS AE since it's an *added* PW, and not part of the normal fueling calculation.


In some appls., when the AE is correct you might see a lean spike on your AFR sensing. Tuning to stay rich on tip-in might not work for all appls.. For along time I thought no lean spike was *best*, but it turns out, it's not a universally true statement.

 

I was digging in the 8D fuel code the other day noticed that it was only looking at delta map for the normal fuel calc (sync).
So delta TPS is async I believe.
I'm also not sure you would be able to "see" the ae in the pw numbers of the aldl. jmop

You might look at the AXCN tables to see how much the vette used. Or maybe the AXYC 305 bin.

 

So other than 'feeling' a dead spot during accelleration there really isn't anyway to 'see' the dead spot in the data logging? Using TunerPro and watching Injector PW and O2 volts along with TPS% may not be correct, or really doesn't show the problem?

 

To put it another way-
How do you know what the pw is supposed to be?
PW follows RPM, MAP, & AE + CL corr stuff.
All TPS does is determine idle and PE for the most part along with some AE.

You can see it in the O2 and feel it yes.
And then correllate it with TPS, RPM, & MAP.

 

Well, my original question in this post was why was my INJ PW not increasing with TPS and MAP. It actually was decreasing. I would expect the reverse to happen. So I wanted to know what everyone else sees on their data logs in this respect and if they used the data for tuning AE.
I have increased my Delta Map constant and it is making a difference, but I need to check my data log to see if the PW has increased or changed from earilier datalogs.
The reply from Grumpy seemed to indicate datalogs may not be useful in regards to PW when tuning AE.

 

You didn't mention that they were actually decreasing, that makes it sound like part of your problem is the actual VE table.

While I used to rely on datalogs, and the WB for seeing which way it was going, I don't now. IMO, AE just takes some experimenting with, til you get it right.

 

7747. SD. the invoke of AE is obvious in my WB datalogs. as is PE. i could lean it out or enrichen it in multiples of 61 only in tune. 61-122-184-244. i started lean and then enrichened. kept AE/MAP at minimal values and played with AE/TPS on level roads. changes in tune are obvious in log. logs showed the AE coming late. lean spike. always. i believe it is somewhat related to my intake manifold(lack of heat)/head intake runners/ cam/gears/manual transmission/large inj's.. my setup. seems i ended up with a larger #'s than stock/common bins at low tps %. 0-3-6-9. i think i have as fat there as above 9%. giving it a lot of AE.TPS at low % seemed to help. prior i always kept proportionate to GM bins i saw. running OL with fatter fuel tables now to help crutch the AE. once car is rolling over 2000 rpms issues are lessened dramatically. intake velocity so much greater. car was down much of summer so i did not log as much as i would have liked. running out of time. fall approaching.

 

Is it me just looking at the data wrong or is there an error in the ALDL Definition file he is using.
Pulse widths from .66 at idle to .18 under load sound WAY incorrect to me.

There does appear to be a lean spot though from the NB O2 readings if that is the actual mv coming from the sensor.