I'm a little confused about the Moates.net APU1 AutoProm package. It allows for real time emulation, which is loading a new binary instantly into the chip, right? And it allows for burning a new chip. Does the AutoProm device itself allow for the burning and reading of the chips? Also, on Craig's website it says that you will also need a chip adapter, but why would you need to buy the adapter if you can upload new binaries instantly? I guess what I'm confused about is the emulation process. Where does it upload the new bin? To the stock EPROM, 27c256, or the EEPROM in the chip adapter? And which cable allows for the emulation? Sorryfor such a nieve question but its just kinda new to me. Thanks!

 

ok, i understand now that the cable with the 28-pin adapter plugs into the chip adapter that bypasses the stock eprom, but when you use the emulation feature of the autoprom, what are you loading the new binary into??? Is it a temporary thing until you unplug the AutoProm? That would be the only thing that makes sense to me because there is no chip in the adapter except for the AutoProm... sorry if this is a simple question, but I just dont completely get it . Any help would be rather, ...helpful.....

 

Q-It allows for real time emulation, which is loading a new binary instantly into the chip, right?
A-Real time emulation on the APU1 means making changes to individual tables while the car is running. To upload a complete new binnary while the car is running requires a chip upgrade available from craig.
Q-Does the AutoProm device itself allow for the burning and reading of the chips?
A-Yes. Its an all in one piece of hardware.
Q-Where does it upload the new bin?
A-It has a permanent memory chip. It can be connected to your ECM and never removed. It can replace your prom chip entirely or you can burn a chip and use it to work on another vehicle.
By the way you wont find a better guy to deal with on the net than craig.

 

Which adapter is required to allow uploading of a new binary code while the AutoProm is plugged? Is it an adapter or is it a kind of software? And, sorry for being dumb again, but let me get this right:

<b><u>APU1 AutoProm Package: USB Version </b></u> [APU1] - $325.00 : Moates.Net

-The USB Cable plugs into the USB port on the computer, which is the only source of power to the AutoProm.
-The OBD1/ALDL/CABL1 cable plugs into the ALDL input on the car allowing datalogging.
-The 28-pin adapter plugs into the adapter, piggybacking on the stock memcal, which bypasses the stock EPROM.
1. When you have the ALDL Cable hooked up, you are simultaneously running some type of scanning software, such as TunerPro RT.
2. After you have datalogged you unplug the ALDL Cable and plug in the 28pin adapter. With this in, you can modify the tables of the binary while the car is running. And with another adapter you can load an entirely new binary.
If this is not right, please correct me on it. Thanks.

 

I think your confusion is because the terminology is getting you.
The AP unit "emulates" the chip that would be installed into the adapter in your ECM.
That means that when you are emulating, the chip is not in the adapter. A ribbon cable is plugged into the ECM adapter where the chip would normally be and then the AP uses its onboard memory to simulate the actual chip.
Making changes to the contents of the AP memory is like changing the actual chip. That's why it can be done on the fly.
When you are done making changes you can then insert a 29C256 or whatever into the chip burniner on the AutoProm and burn the changed bin onto the chip.
Then install the chip into your adapter (removing the AP emulation cable first) and now you are running on the chip in the adapter.
You can run the ALDL cable for simultaneous "emulating" and datalogging with TunerPro.
Or you can just use the AP ALDL cable to datlog when running just a chip in the adapter.
HTH

 

Thanks a lot. That clears quite a bit up. One more, like 884+3 said, "To upload a complete new binnary while the car is running requires a chip upgrade available from craig." Which upgrade is needed for this?

 

To do a "normal" bin, no upgrade is needed.
The only option for upgrading is if you are using a "G3" adapter with 16 bin capability. That would require a larger capacity memory chip to emulate 16 bins at once so he made it an option.
I run a "G3" and never felt it was needed to emulate all bins at once. I make changes to only one bin at a time anyway. Nice feature if you ever really wanted to.

 

Ok, the G3 sounds a little complex for me, I dont think I will ever really need to emulate more than 1 bin at a time. What would be the benefit for doing more than that? And in terms of operating software, will I need only the one driver offered on Moates.net? Thanks for your patience.

 

The G3 is pretty cool that you can have a small switch that lets you select between 16 different bins you have made. I do one for good hiway milage, a couple different lockup settings and one for just wating fuel
If you had the upgrade you could have all 16 in the AP memory for instant switching over and making changes to any/all of them as you wanted. Something tells me it would be confusing and you would lose your place in what you were doing if you did that much at once.
I stay with a couple of items and concentrate on making each of them better during a session of tuning.

To run the AP all you need is the drivers for the USB that Craig has posted and you should be off to the races.

 

I keep seeing things about "stacking" bins on a chip, but ehn is this necessary? If I have the 7730 speed density ECM with the stock bin which is 32kb, will stacking be needed on an AT29c256? Wouldn't stacking only be a necessity if you were running a smaller bin than what the EEPROM has available for memory?

 

exactly
The running bin is "usually" at the end of the image so stacking it is one way to be sure the running bin is in the right place.
Can get confusing though if you change the values in the lower "stacked" bin thinking it is the running one. Just have to keep that in your mind.
That is also the method for running the 16 bins in the G3 with bigger chip.
The 32k bin goes right on the 29C256. No stacking needed.

 

you can upload an entire bin at once but I haven't had a successful full bin uplaod,
its either no ran right and everytime I lose my datalog connection and it won't reconnect until I shut everything down

I have successfully loaded small changes or single perameters,

I mostly use emulation for testing bins,
I run the car, datalog, usually go home go over the logs make notes and changes, to bin save it,
take car out run off my new bin, datalog, and repeat, notes go over log, make changes
I do all my tuning by how the car feels to me, and old school G-tech

when I'm done for the day or a couple days I burn a chip run it awhile, note millage and how car feels

 

I didn't read that statement correctly about the whole bin thing.
I took it as uploading a bin to the AP to start out with.
Never actually tried fully swapping out a bin in memory for a totally different one. I don't think it would work, like 89Vert said.
Seems to me you would lose connection because the code will be replaced in whatever order it is done. Memory would be scrambled when that changover happens. You would loose the mode 1 command and sequence that was occurring. If the bins were the same code and just calibration changes it might just recover depending on the amount of changes that occurred all at once.
Maybe Craig does have a way to make that happen, Would have to ask.
Really doesn't seem like something you would need to do anyway.
You would be tuning the bin you are running.

 

I tried swapping a different bin while running and I don't recommend it. You kind of lose the connection like JP said.