I received my ZT-2 in the mail yesterday. I was going to use the narrowband output to give the ECM an O2 signal. As I was running all the wires I realized that I would need to take apart my NB O2 heater relay and all the wiring, route the NB O2 signal wire to the ZT-2 box and so on.

So my other option is to leave all the NB stuff intact and use the WB only for the datastream. I could run the NB where it is now, in the right side collector and run the WB in the left side collector. That would be more convenient...I hate wire looms criss-crossing everywhere. This would also allow me to check the actual switching point of the NB.

How does everyone else here use thier WB? Just for logging? Or for the ECM too?

 

That's exactly what I'm in the process of doing. I've left my stock ECM O2 sensor in place, and added the WB just for logging and tuning myself. Not sure about anybody else tho

 

I leave the NB in place for the ECM, then just data log the WB. This also makes it easier to R&R the WB is desired.

RBob.

 

i tried using th nb out from the lc-1, but it was not to acurate.

 

BTW, I got an O2 bung thru US Tire and Exhaust for $1.09. Even at retail price it's $2.96. That beats the $7 Summit and Jegs list...

 

Mic,

I have the WB and the NB on the same side next to each. That way they're "seeing" the same exhaust flow. WB is plugged into A/D channel for EBL. Works great. Only way to tune.

 

Hi Dom: thanks for contributing. another of a multitude of items I have on tap for this seasons tune. my understanding is the WB02 sensor is quicker(?) as well as more accurate(?) than using the stock NB sensor? are there other advantages to WB use?

as far a the calc for PE, is that still done off the underlying VE tables and/or BPC OR does the WB provide any "feedback" to ECU to hit the desired PE A/F?

when you switched from the NB to the WB input to ECU did it require revisiting the VE tables. IOW as far as "stoich" did the WB mirror the NB values?

This next question is best posted on the Innovate Forum but I have a concern about the dependability of the Innovate unit for long term use as an alternative to NB input to ECU. Last year it was flawless but prior year it would sometimes give some erroneous readings at times that could wreak havoc on my drivability and any LEARN. I think I am on my 3rd WB Bosch sensor.

 

Ron,

The NB O2 is designed for accuracy around the stoich AFR. The name "narrow band" means exactly that. So for the purpose of keeping track of PT and cruise modes, its doing what its supposed to do. When you use the WB, you're interpolating the output to fit into the NB profile.
When I first used EBL for tuning, I used the WB. The NB was still in place and working however. Then I enabled C/L and started using the BLMs to tune with the WB used for WOT tuning.
The WOT AFR is tuned from the high VE table. I change both the 90 and 100kPa VE values when tuning WOT. My motor usually pulls 96-98kPa at WOT and so the VE used is a blend of the 90/100kPa VE values. The WB is not modifying the VE realtime to achieve the Commanded AFR you have in the PE table. BTW, I have found that my motor really likes the WOT AFR down in the 12-12.2 range. It looks like I can pick up 2-3mph top end at that AFR. I'm hoping to go to the track weekend after next to see if it turns out.

 

what's the website for the zt-2? i looked for it the other day and didn't find it.

 

Your first and second paragraphs are understood.

So you are still using your NB in CL? I thought you were using the WB input to ECU exclusively. Maybe there is no advantage to using WB for CL operation?

Quote: The WOT AFR is tuned from the high VE table. I change both the 90 and 100kPa VE values when tuning WOT.

Does this mean the PE is somehow disabled? The fueling increase is strictly in the VE fuel table(main fuel #2)?

 

The PE AFR is a calculation based on the VE table. I assume that Dom meant that if the WB doesn't match what he has on the PE AFR table he modifies the 90 and 100 kPa columns of the VE table.

I'm taken every time I read about others' kPa at WOT. My entire notion of "normal" is that I'll hit 100-105 kPa driving to get lunch It's real easy to hit 100 kPa with a 10% throttle stab.

Anyway I'd like to say I got my ZT-2 working tonight. I called my buddy John who just ordered a 6-71 for his '67 Cutlass and told him he's not getting help from me unless he gets a WB! hahaha The WB is like cheating! This is supposed to be voodoo science!

 

Mic,

You are correct, that is what I meant. Using a WB is like seeing again.

Ron,

Here's a pic of a WOT datalog run I did the other day. Notice the MAP dropped from 98 at start to 96 by the time I hit 5500rpm. Not too bad actually.

 

Have you thought of programming the IACs to open fully @ WOT. I did with my TBI engine and increased the MAP reading by 5 KPA @ 5,000 rpm on my stock bore 350 TBI unit, making 300 HP at the time.

 

Attached is a rough sketch I made for the relay I'm going to power the ZT-2 with. I sketched it out on scrap paper at work between the belly-achings of helpless customers so excuse the unprofessionalism...lol.

The point of the circuit is to provide a 1-click power-on using a momentary button (like an N20 purge button). Once actived the circuit will stay on until the switched +12v drops. I'm going to use the radio fuse for that. This way, it won't get voltage spikes from cranking and can't be left on over night. I toyed with the idea of using the CCP output or something but decided to keep it simple for now.

 

Latching Relay (circuit actually), fun stuff. Should work well.

 

How do you go about doing that?

 

With the EBL it was simply a matter of changing the maximum allowable IAC counts from 140ish to 255. From there the throttle follower logic will take over @ WOT.

 

Surprised its that easy.

 

Depending on how the truck feels coming off the throttle, you might need to change the throttle follower decay rate (speed up the IAC closing on a throttle lift). Speed up the closing too much and there will be so much engine braking you eat the windshield, or too little and it will feel like it is going to run away.

 

I'll keep that in mind. Thanks

 

Fast,

That was a strategy I would use to get more airflow thru stock units. However, I have 2.13" bore TBs and want as much airflow going thru the venturis and not bypassed in the IAC outlets. I'm actually trying to limit the amount of air going thru the IACs. Trying to keep flow velocity up so I can control idle even tho using a cam with more duration and overlap.
My 'key-on" MAP reading is usually between 98-99kPa. So I don't think I'm losing a lot of airflow.

 

This may require basic soldering skills and proto board fabrication, but fun anyway!

A very simple time delay switch circuit can be constructed using a single NPN general purpose transistor and RC timing circuit. Transistor can switch ON-OFF relay via a LED- optocoupler. Optocoupler is used to isolate timing circuit from load.

Upon 12 Vdc switch ON C1 will be charging to 12 Vdc power supply voltage through R1. When the voltage across C1 reaches 9.1 volts, zener diode D1 will conduct, slightly biasing the transistor Q1- collector current will begin to flow . Since a typical silicon junction transistor requires about 0.7 Vdc to fully turn on voltage across C1 must reach 9.8 volts. Once voltage across C1 reaches 9.8 volts, the zener diode and base-emitter junction will be fully turned on hereby reducing C1 charging current to a minimum. Therefore C1 can not be charged any further and voltage across C1 will be around 9.8 volts. With Q1 base-emitter junction forward biased maximum collector current will flow through R3 and LED section of the optocoupler lighting the LED and activating BOSCH Relay.

R1=4.7 kOhm and C1 = 220 uF have a time constant around 1.03 seconds. Since it takes approximately 82 percent of the supply voltage (9.1/12) of capacitor voltage before zener begins to conduct the actual delay is slightly longer 1.7 time constants or 1.75 seconds. Effective time constant of this circuit can be improved further by adding a linear voltage regulator LM7809 to eliminate switched +12 V line variations, but this will require different zener diode (lower voltage).



Upon 12 Vdc switch OFF C1 will discharge through R1 and R2 providing delayed turn OFF functionality as well.


RF

 

Fast - the one thing I'd be concerned about with your set up is forgetting to turn it on. I remember reading that running exhaust over a WB that is not powered up will toast them pretty quickly. For longevity the WB needs to be powered on whenever the engine is running, hence the idea to tie the power into something off when cranking and on when running. Altho I'll admit I need to change my WB's power source, I think mine may be on when cranking... (NOTE TO SELF - I need to check that!)

 

Vern,

That's what Zeitronix says about their unit. I have mine powered by the ECM. Its starts cooking in about 20 sec after startup. I used to just plug it in to the cigarette lighter, but sometimes you forget.

 

A Ford friend of mine sent it to me....

a little expensive, but seems to do both


http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2...FAST/index.php

 

How did you do that?