I currently have a chip burned in the car for a maf 88 camaro 383 stroker, 5 speed, ligenfelter 74219 219/219 cam, dart iron eagle 2.02/1.60 215cc runners, Accel Super Ram, 58mm throtlebody and 24lb injectors. I dont think I am getting the most out of my engine (330rwhp/430rwtq) and stops pulling at 5000rpm with current program. I just bought a set-up from moates for programing using tunerpro rt. I want to try to tune it myself so that i can get more hp (especially at higher rpm). Should I start out with that program and make my adjustments from there or start from scratch? If scratch, where can find a stock program? Which adjustments would make any type of difference? is there a guide for each adjustment (def of what is and what it does)and how it effects performance online somewhere? what are your thoughts on a larger 3.5 maf on this set up?

 

You got hundred questions. With the 24#/hr injectors, you probably are not getting enough fuel. Do you have an adjustable fuel pressure regulator (AFPR)? If yes, what is it set at?
For tuning you should always start with the .bin file that you are currently using. I do not want to start from scratch. What intake manifold do you have? Have you ported the SuperRam?

 

I do have an adjustable fuel pressure reg, I havent checked it in a while by I remember it being around 45. I have a super ram, dont think its ported. I understand the bin file, but inside the bin what catergories, what can I adjust for tuning purposes. There is just sooo many options, where do I start? Kinda need a basic starting point, so I can build up from there. For example, in fuel, "max air flow vs rpm" and "Start up enrich vs coolent? " I kinda understand what those are, but no idea how to adjust for benifit. and I really have no idea what "DFCO" is and its ten options to adjust.

I will use my current .bin file but where should I start looking to tune?

Thanks SOOO much for the help

 

This is a good starting point, Happy reading!

https://www.thirdgen.org/promintro

 

BTW: do not touch the "Max Air Flow VS RPM" table, unless you need to increase it. Apparently, this table is only used as a check. The values in this table must be higher than the MAF tables would have for the corresponding RPM.

 

Thanks, that link really helped. What I have a better idea where to start, is there any where to find the def of all the adjustable aspects in tuner pro? Or do I just have to hunt and search?

If I went to a larger MAF ie. 3.5 what table would I have to adjust besides the basic MAF table?

 

Where are you going to get a 3.5" MAF that will work in your car? To the best of my knowledge, there is no 3.5" MAF that is compatible with our 3rd gen cars.

Having said that, I made a 3.5" MAF by cutting away the tube of a stock MAF sensor and siliconed sealed the elctronics into a 3.5" aluminum tube. Having done this, the MAF tables are way out of wack. The first think is the alter the MAF table scalars, then calibrate each MAF table by letting the BLM value guide you.

Also, since you are new to tuning the ECM, I strongly suggest that you chabge of one table at a time, and go out and test drive the car to document what the change did for you. BTW: I count the six MAF tables as one large table considering the previous statement.

 

Just like you, I was going to build one. Right now I am a building a larger air box with a 3.5in opening to attach to the larger MAF. From reading other posts, I would need to raise the tables across the board 38% to accomadate the increased air flow? Correct? Can you help me out with the correct specs, since you already have it done?

 

Good idea, a 3.5" dia MAF will do you no good unless you open up the airlid also to at least that same diameter. Since I am using TunerPro, I had to learn to convert between hexidecimal and regular base 10 integars in order to adjust the MAF tables up 38%. The factory MAF scalars for my '87 ECM are in oder: 17, 30, 53, 87, CF, FF. 38% higher hexidecimal values are: 20, 42, 73, BA, FF, FF. This means that the 5th MAF table will max out (along with the 6th, of course). No biggie here because long before this, you have gone PE and you can add as much fuel as you need via the "PE VS RPM" table. I just saved you alot of time. You owe me a pizza and beer!

 

Yeah I do, if I ever make it down to FL or you shoot up to chicago, but you have to role with the deep dish if you make it up here lol. In terms of opening up the air box, almost done with that. I just have to sand and paint. I saw a post on how to raise it up a 1/2 in and then I replace the neck if a 3in pvc coupler which measures 4in od and 3.5. id. then i'm going to use the same pvc part to make the MAF.

What do BA FF and FF stand for??? And I start the first table with 20 and go up value by ? then the 2nd table starts with 42.....is just the dif between 20 and 42 then divide by 9 for each volt box? Is there a thread on PE?

 

You do not understand hexidecimal numbers. I think that its called hexidecimal. If I'm wrong please correct me. 20 hexidecimal = 32 integar, 42 hex = 66, 73 hex = 115, BA hex = 186, FF hex = 255. Counting in hexidecimal starting from zero goes 00, 01, 02, 03, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 0A, 0B, 0C, 0D, 0E, 0F, 10, 11, 12, etc. 0F hex being equal to 15. I am sure that this is clear as mud. I just did a search on google on the word hexidecimal. You can figured it out from there. There's a couple good articles.

 

Doc,

Thanks I looked up hex number and have a better understanding of that. I am using TunerPro RT, and I am look at the 6 MAF tables where there is two collums labeled Volt and Grams/sec. I dont see any FF symbols that rep hex numbers. Am I in the right table? It starts in table 1, 0 Volts = 8.36 G/S up to table 6, 5.12 Volts = 254 G/S

 

You are looking in the wrong area. or TunerPro there are three boxes to the right side of the screen. The top box are the constants. The MAF scalars are there. The MAF tables themselvs are what you have already found.

In order to raise the individual MAF tables enough to account for the much higher flow of the 3.5" MAF, the scalars are going to have to be bumped up to what I listed. There is a limitation on the max values in the MAF tables, its the scalars that create the limitation.

 

Yeah, I found it today. Do I need to adjust the tables as well? Is there anything else I should adjust beside the PE tables to account for that larger MAF? And with PE tables, where/how should some of the ajustments look like?

 

I vaguely recall that when i altered the MAF scalars up, that the MAF table values changed also. Before you change the MAF scalars, write down the values of the MAF tables (or just compare back to the starting bin file). The PE tables may need a little tweeking, but this should be done using a wide band O2 sensor. So eventually get on a chassis dyno for the WOT tuning.

 

Doc,

Again thanks for walking this retard thru, and i'm sure you could be doing better things than helping me. That being said, can you give me 5 catorgories in Tuner Pro where I should start tuning to get so I can begin this journey.

 

The first place to start is to check over all of the constants. They are most likely all correct except for the fuel injector constant if you swapped out the injectors or increased the fuel pressure. 2nd, tune the idle stuff. For example if you have a big cam, it probably would like to idle at something higher than the stock 750RPM, maybe 850 (choice is yours). Get the BLM close to 128 while at idle. You should be in FTC 0 while at idle. To change the BLM value in FTC 0, you will need to alter the values in MAF table 1, because you are sucking in 9 to 11 gms/sec,,, thats in the first MAF table.

Also, use a tuner which gives you a graph,,, nothing better than a graph. For the MAF tables, you want them to be smooth curves or even straight lines. No jagged peaks. Smooth is good here.

Oh yea, before you start tuning, do a engine idle, TPS and IAC adjustment. You can find several excellent tech articles on the home page, read these over.

 

Doc,

I really cant cant get the car out bc of the weather.....im sure you are feeling nice n toasty down fl, lol. but, I downloaded my current bin onto the computer and it really looks out of wack compared to the arap bin that comes with tuner pro rt? I looked at tye ajustables in spark and fuel, there is no change in values it all looks flat compared to ths arap bin in the graph.

 

When I moved to the '89 $6E def file, I started off with the ARAP bin. I think thats where you should start also. Also, when Spring comes to you, simply do your tuning using the stock MAF. Once you got things well tuned, good idle, no stalling, BLM all between 122 and 134, AFR at WOT near 12.8:1, etc. Then come back on here and talk about the large MAF. You should be able to get your car easily into the low 12s, if not the 11s with the stock MAF. I use to live in Ohio for 50+ years, I know full well how it is fustrating to sit out of the performance driving thing for at least 4 months a year, it $uck$.

 

Doc,

Can you take a look at this bin? Its the one had made up from either superchips or fastchips. It really looks odd compared to the arap. Pretty much I would like to know which one I should start with?

 

Sorry, the message board wont upload the file. Can I send it via email?

 

Start with a stock GM BIN, always the best way. If you start with ARAP there are a number of changes that are required for it to work properly in a Camaro. IIRC, one is that the fan output needs to be inverted (on when off and off when on with stock ARAP). ARAP being a 'Vette calibration has a a higher level of SA. So that will have to be reduced to work with the heads on your engine.

Do a search on ARAP here for others odds & ends. Just remembered, it also holds off injector pulses when first cranking. Can change that too.

Just a note on aftermarket BINs, please don't post them to the forum.

RBob.

 

My bad, I just wanted too know if I had a shitty aftermarket bin to start with or if I should start new , didnt mean to **** anyone off?