Not sure. Never tried $59. Had an account on their, it stopped working. Website appears somewhat broken. Not worth it IMO.


Well, I'm only running 42# injectors, but I had problem with these before using $58/$60.

In regards to $8F, is getting it to work with a dizzy simply a matter of flipping some constants or is it much more involved ?

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...315-post2.html


-- Joe

 

Months of conversion work? OK, whatever... Repeated what you wrote? Uh-uh, whatever...

> If you have more information you would like to share on how
> to write the code I am sure they would like to hear it.

Oh, but I have shared lots of code work/samples along with how-to's. You are the one that is afraid that some little piece of info that you post will be stolen. What ever happened to your copyright sig? You know, the one that explains your paranoia?

Just so you know, I'm the last person that needs code examples from you. I develop and test my own code. That way I know that it will work...

RBob.

 

I was just trying to help them before you started attacking my posts.
Guys working on getting your $8D working with boost, good luck, I am out now.
I have helped JP with the SAUJP stuff and it was a pleasure. I don't help when I get attacked for no reason.

 

Switching a calibration between DIS and a distributor is a piece of cake. Only need to change three parameters. The initial SA, then the maximum SA and the minimum SA.

The values used depend upon the DIS system in use. The 6-cylinder set ups are offset by 60*. With the initial at 70* (10*) BTDC.

Dependent upon which rare 8-cylinder set up is used, the SA values may be the same as a distributor. Or, offset the same as the typical 6-cylinder but in 8-cylinder terms.

RBob.

 

DIS, I built a hybrid 60 degree V6 engine, that used a FWD top end on a RWD block, and it was much easier to use a DIS ignition than dizzy, physically fitting it into the vehicle.

After running dizzy on my car, then switching to DIS, I would never want to run anything but DIS, the driveabilty and smooth revving were improved drastically.

While I haven't personally ran large injectors (yet) with $59, I know there are a few people running 60+ lbs/hr set-ups with $59, and haven't seen too many issues reported, especially after tuning for them. I think the biggest problem is that people don't tune, or know how to tune the battery compensation tables, which makes it very difficult to tune for a smooth idle, without doing so.

 

If someone is that familiar with it than go for it.
I don't think anyone who is capable is willing.

 

I don't disagree with that.

What was the actual pinout when running $8F on a '730? I couldn't seem to find that answer searching last night.

I realize it's native on a '727, but the '727 and '730 don't share the same pinouts.

-- Joe

 

Jeez, what a collective effort, we should just call this new boost code $8FU. Why all the bickering? This just gets us nowhere guys. The $8F is an excellent platform to start with, and Bob essentially laid out the ground work on what needs to be done in terms of getting it to work within an $8D application. Those of you who worked hard on the $8D and $58 all these years can now come together and bring it all together, collectively. Why the arguing? Cut the crap already lol...

3.1 Turbo Wiring Diagram...

 

That diagram is based on a '727 right?

I know recently, I did some work on a '90 Corvette ('727) and the pinouts for $8D on the '727 was nothing like a '730.

-- Joe

 

Yes, the '727, just the insulated version of the '730. The only wiring we would need to add to it is for the Wideband (F14). We don't need to worry about wastegate control...

 

What I'm talking about for example, $8D:

On the Camaro '730 : A3, E4, E5, E6

On the Corvette '727: A1, A7, A8, A2

Now, I realize that when $8D is run on a '730 vs a '727 it follows the correct channels. What I'm wondering is what will happen when $8F is run on a '730. I guess what we do is compare $8D and $8F on a '727, and if they both use the same pins 'assume' it will work on a '730 just as $8D does?

I've got the latest XDF and ADX files that Sil (Dan T.) and Robert Saar did. I'm curious if the "patched" AZRC bin I have has the wb02 patch in it. (I notice mention of it in the XDF)

-- Joe

 

Two members on here have run $8F on their boosted 730's without changing anything (I believe MARS is one of them), only the addition of the wideband using MAP2 (F14) and fueling tweaks. Other than that it was a drop in and go for them because their 730's were already setup for DIS...

Edit: So the real question is are the 7730's identical between the years, and they were. Another popular code swap w/them was also the $A1 code (3.1 DIS). Will invite MARS to this thread to get another perspective...

 

The attached zip file contains the cross referenced pin out between the '7727 & '7730/'7749 ECMs. Thank Ludis for this, he did the work (I believe that Ludis is no longer with us, RIP). Ludis is the one that also did the internal ECM schematics.

You don't really want to just go with $58 or $8F. The $8D mask already has the S_AUJP modified version, and is well known and supported.

What to do is to lift the 2-bar MAP conversion from one and graft it into $8D. Can lift it nearly directly as this is a hobby thing, not commercial. There is basically three parts of it. The conversion of the 2-bar value into a value used for the PW calculation (IIRC, calc's the mass of air per cylinder, will likely need to be doubled for a 2-bar MAP conversion), converts the 2-bar value into a 1-bar value to take the place of the regular 1-bar MAP for the table look ups and such.

Then a scaled 2-bar value that can be used for a boost PW multiplier table and SA table look up. Of course that value can also end up in the data stream for logging/observation.

Use an option flag to select between a 1 and a 2 bar MAP. And run the code accordingly.

RBob.

 

I don't think Joe is thinking $8D like me, he might be on a mission to complete $60...

 

I would love to help on this. I don't have the commented source code for saujp to start studying where code patches may need to be implemented but...... I would be glad to offer my time and I have an ecm bench for open loop code testing if someone could give me an assignment to work on.

 

When I did my conversion, I pinned the ECM as a 1988 Cavalier, since I was also using one of those MEMCALs for initial firing and testing, keep in mind this was back in 2002, when there wasn't the wealth of information and code understanding that there is now.

I don't see any reason that $8F couldn't be dropped into any '7730 appliaction and not work, pinout wise. Obviously there would need to be an adjustment to the ignition offset, and likely to injector set-up (sizing, BPC, etc.).

Personally I wouldn't use it again, except for very specific instances, one being automatic trans, there is no manual trans flag in $8F, and less than 15 PSIG of boost.

Yes, Mars ran $8F for years, he's now running $59.

I've been interested in getting a copy of B_AUJP, but it hasn't been made public. There was some short lived discussion on another site qbout making a generic code that could cover just about any applucation, just by selecting the correct flags, unfortunately there is really only two people that are capable if writing that kind of code, and I'm not one of them.

 

subscribing....

 

Six, this is why I brought up implementing $8F with fasteddi's $88 project a few months back, as opposed to immediately going the $59 route, and the arguing ensued, when it really shouldn't have. Idea was presented by Bob Rauscher a long time ago, I then revised the idea with Bob Bailey on the Buick boards to get his take on it last year because I wanted to see a boost encoded $8D, and now here we are again with it. RBob just laid it all out for everybody here, and I myself am not interested in fame and do not wish to have my name stamped on anything whatsoever, and I already started working on my own boost code following Bob's direction above. I'll send it to Joe when I am done, and he can do whatever he wants with it, I just want to get it done already...

Not the turbo Camaro, I meant his supercharged Z24 w/'7730, it's running $8F...

 

I only cited those reasons as absolute reasons, I would still run $59 over $8F any day, on anything, well, might run $8F on a stock TGP, just because it's stock. . What you proposed just meant more work overall, I still can't follow the idea to use one code, while planning to switch to a completely different code, just makes no sense whatsoever.

Yes, Mar's Z24 ran $8F, he also ran $8F on the Camaro at first, then switched to $59. He did try $59 on the Z24, but didn't have enough time between race weekends to tune it as well as he had been able to with the $8F bins that he spent a lot of time on before even knowing about $59. The Z24 is no longer around, someone pulled out in front of him, the day after I finally got to see that car in person, and wrote it off.

 

Is $59 defunct? I tried using the site the other day to no avail.

-- Joe

 

It seems that new or non members, have difficulty accessing the site. I really wish they would use a more common software for the forum and site.

What wasn't working for you? I can PM someone in charge over there, and see if it can get straightened out.

 

My account doesn't work anymore. It 'exists' but my password didn't work.

So I used the "Forgot password" link, which doesn't work properly.

I then tried leaving feedback on the contact link. That doesn't work.

Finally, I emailed SKWAYB to the email address he has registered hear as a TGO member. He hasn't been active on here in about two months.

I agree, they should use vBulletin like the rest of us

-- Joe

 

Going through some emails back and forth with Bruce back in 2004, apparently I was (trying) to get a 2-bar map to show up on an $8D bin for logging purposes. At the time, at least according to what I said in emails, I was just trying to log boost in the aldl stream and was using PE fuel adder.

To be perfectly honest, I don't even remember working on this. Based on the files I had in a directory it looks like I read some work by Rbob, some help from Bruce, and this is where I got. I don't know if it ever worked, or if it even does anything. I honestly don't even remember working on this, but I've got about 30 emails back and forth with Bruce about it.. I must be getting old..

I uploaded the files to my webserver. Ignore the file dates, the server thinks it's 2010.

http://members.cisdi.com/~anesthes/p...om/730/s_aujp/

It looks like part of this may have been taken (either in part, whole, or just stole the idea) from someone named "John".

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...kpa-limit.html

I really don't remember this..


-- Joe

 

Grab the stock disassembly on the AUJP off Moates site. That was the starting point.
AUJP_JP2.zip or something similar to that (also on my website links page)
It is relocatable and reassembles easily.

 

I actually have one that I disassembeled my self. I havent finnished commenting it out yet though.....very time consuming. I have been studying it and I will look at how it's done in the $8f and try to come up with a patch that won't work and maybe somebody can help me from there.

 

If you have a test bench, could you apply the patch I posted and see if the second map sensor shows up in the ALDL stream?

I really think the best route here is to log map2, and import the BPW adder from $8F or $58. Leave all the "works an drives well" stuff on map1.

There could be some benefit to spark control under boost, although I'd think most people lock their advance in by 100kpa since retarding advance under boost typically spikes cylinder temps and causes the detonation your trying to avoid in the first place...

-- Joe

 

YES, I have already been working on that. I have been reading over the material that you posted , letting it digest and figuring out how it all goes together.

This patch?

; 2-Baro input patch for $8D (AXCN, AXXD, maybe others)
; 04/13/04
;
;
;

; -- Begin 2-baro code
; -- Load accumulator on channel 0
2000: 86 00 LDAA #$0000 ;..
2002: BD E2 DC JSR LE2DC ;...
; -- 0034 is the CCP ALDL byte
2005: 97 34 STAA L0034 ;.4
; -- The original statement at $4C88
2007: CE 00 E2 LDX #$00E2 ;...
; -- Return
L2008
200A: 39 RTS ;9
; -- end

; -- Jump to LA000 ($2000) for the 2-baro map input on A3
4C88: BD A0 00 JSR LA000 ;...
; --

 

Yep.

 

... just correct the last line for 2-baro map input on F14.

 

What if you want wb-02 on F14?

-- Joe

 

... I started to over the weekend, but it's filtered, although small enough to essentially go unnoticed. Was going to run the second MAP through F14, and the WB though A3, but either way should work.

 

I was thinking that, if the plan is to release a bin + source with both fine, but if releasing it with just the 2-bar then we want to make sure the common available wb-02 patch applies and works.

I think most people use F14 for the wideband.

-- Joe

 

So.......the two-bar is going on A3?

 

That would be my suggestion.

It should take a 0-5v.

-- Joe

 

OK, I forgot that AS11.exe will not run on a 64 bit machine. I will dig out one of my old machines tomorrow.

 

Same problem I had the other day. Loading winxp in a virtualbox, then transferring files between made me cranky..

-- Joe

 

TPS2 (220K to GND).........U6-13 via 10K............A3



MAP2 (51K to GND)...........U5-1 via 18K.............F14


I understand now why you are asking to change to F14.

 

Copied this from the documentation that was zipped with (S_AUJP_V4_1026).

It seems that both A3 and F14 are used for WB input.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
6.) Wide Band Multi-Sensor Support (Thanks to Don Dibble, 1981TTA)
Selectable sensor and calibrations incorporated by Scott Lopez Z69’
Made ALDL word 37 = 0035 to monitor WBAFR (OEM = 002D Was “Keep Alive IAC Steps”)
COPYRIGHT MATERIAL
899A: .byte 0x00 ; Word 1, set sensor option here
899B: .byte 0x00 ; Word 2, set sensor option here
***************************** Calibration Section *************************
Option Flag for WB O2 Sensor, Option Flag 2 for WB O2 Sensor
Bit 0 = DIY_TE NonLinear Bit 0 = RAW A/D Output
Bit 1 = FJO Bit 1 = Innovate Linear L2H2 (vdc*2+10)
Bit 2 = AEM NonLinear Bit 2 =
Bit 3 = TE 2.0 Linear Bit 3 =
Bit 4 = PLXWBLin Bit 4 =
Bit 5 = Innovate Linear Bit 5 =
Bit 6 = AEM Linear Bit 6 =
Bit 7 = Zeitronix Bit 7 = Select WB Input (0) = Pin F14
(1) = Pin A3

Select ONLY 1 Sensor type or the “Raw Output”
(See XDF description below for adding this item with your definition editor)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I could not get 2bar.asm to assemble into a .s19 file. (gets six errors) It must have lost formatting or something.

I did get 2-BAR-PA.s19 to run in AS11 but there was no output file.

After a little more studying I plan on putting together my own patch. I will see what happens.
It seems to me that map2 is already set up for a map sensor, just need to rescale it for a 2bar and then play with the .adx file to make it show up? Not that simple?