So I turn off my car and about an hour later go to start it and I got no crank... I end up haveing to throw a screw driver across the starter to get it started, mind you all this at 11 pm when it is dark with no light! Today I tore apart my center council and cheked the nuetrel saftey switch, I dont know what wire is positive from the key but none of them had + into the switch... now if im not mistaken I do beleve power comes out of the key switch goes to VATS and then on to the nutrel safety switch then to the starter.? I checked the VATS relay or starter enable relay for power during crank and none of them give me a +12v. What elce chould I check? I cant really get to the ignition wires at the top of the column with out droping it... oh yeah and where is the VATS module?

edit: I just noticed that the security light does not come on... not sure it ever did, never noticed, but im pretty sure it would have came on before... what does that mean?

 

Unless you have added the VATS control module into the car when you did the 350 engine swap, you do not have the VATS option. In 1989, only the V8 engines had the VATS installed.

 

Then why is there a resistor in the key and the starter enable relay under the drivers side kick panel with a bunch of yellow and green wires?... those are factory. If there is a fact of not haveing VATS what can be wrong... the key tumbler itself, and why would it have the resistor in the key and the pins in the tumbler to contact the resistor, and the two little wires that come off the contacts for the resistor in the key which should go to the VATS (although I have not traced them)? sooo... your telling me that that resistor in the key is worthless in every V6 car I have seen? I'm lost! HELP

 

Hello rsc350,

After reading your reply, I have gone back and reviewed my GM service manual for the 89 camaro and several other wiring schematic sources I have for that year. I was hasty in saying that the 89 2.8L V6 RS did not have the VATS control module and other related components installed. For this I truly apologize to you. However, even though the components were installed in the car. The VATS control module was not connected to the ECM and therefore did not serve the same function as it did in the V8 models. On the V8 models, there was a dark blue wire running from the VATS control module to pin "B6" of the ECM. This was the "Theft Deterrent" function of the ECM. On the 2.8L V6, there is a tan/white wire going to pin "B6" of the ECM and was used for the MAF sensor relay.
Since you now have a 350 TBI installed, you obviously have a different (possibly custom burned) Eprom and possibly a different ECM installed. Depending on how that chip was burned and whether that dark blue wire from the VATS control module was connected, your VATS may have been made as functional as it is in the V8's. Again, I apologize for my hasty response in my first post.

On a side note here, since the VATS control module did not go to the ECM on the 2.8L V6. It did not control the fuel injectors and would only disable the starter if the wrong resistance was detected by the module. If the system fails on the 2.8L, you will not get a trouble code for it like the V8's.

 

:hail: You know lots... must have bunches of nice books I would love to get my hands on. Books = schematics on what wires were different between the V6 and V8 inside car harnesses, like my ALDL and heat and wipers which dont work... just to name a few.

Back to the point: I have no crank with the key, I also have no security light lite durring what should be crank. I also would have already threw a resistor inbetween the wires going to the tumbler but my voltmeter is reading very weird on the chip in the key... jumping around from .170 to .250 M... it's on auto and it wont go to K but it wont stop on a number long enough for me to read it, on either of my keys... guess I gotta break out the old analog meter. If the resistor in line dont work what should I check/replace?



P.S. what would be really cool... if you could tell me some time what each one of the wires in the little connector by the ECM are, the one that connects all the inner car stuff to the ECM and the outer car harness(well not the wires on the drivers side), mine is white maybe 16 pin or so. I need to know what they are on the 89 2.8 and the TBI cars (not sure of the year I got the harness out of) I know there are tons of wires in there that are different, not sure the books go by connectors tho.

 

Here is a picture of the connector C207 that you are referring to. The wires are the same for all the 89 models. Back to the problem with your starting, disconnect the two wire connector for the lock cylinder under the dash. Take one of your keys and attach two wires to the contacts on it and put the other end in the connector going to the module. Now use the other key to try and start the car, if it starts replace the lock cylinder.

 

wow that was fast... that is half the problem, now i just need the ECM side. How do i determine what year the harness in my car now is? or maybe you can look through them and post a few different years if they are different? Known factors... car was manual, ECM is 8746 which is a reman so I cant look for any dates in there... pretty much leaves late 80's early 90's

Thanks much on the starting problem, I'll try it out tomorrow if I get a chance, between class and work... or maybe i can save time and try it while im driveing...

 

I tried it... nothing, not even a little bit. Would you happen to have a schematic or the wires for the starter switch itself, on top of the steering column? I think I wanna check and make sure the wire that supplies the power is supplying... other than that I guess if that is ok the only other thing is the VATS box itself? I am getting sick of starting my car with a screw driver!

 

You looking for something like this?

 

And this?

 

I got my security light to come on with about 6 resistors in series and parallel to make 1.800 k ohm... the key measures 1.874 or something close to that... once you turn the key to the on position the light stays on for 3 seconds or so and shuts off... is that right?

 

yep!!!!!!!!

 

ok... so why wont my car still start... that was definatly the (a) problem... how many things can go wrong all at the same time... I tried bypassing the starter relay with jumper between A and E... still nothing... what elce?

 

Aparantly my VATS has previously been disabled... I know this how?... cause my car likes to start (YES, with the key) with and without the VATS resistor wire hooked up ... thats right, it likes to START... so aparantly the stupid rod that pulls the switch straightned itself out... i even tore the switch off the collumn and it did not move, was still at max adjustment even... HOW DOES A METAL ROD STRAIGHTEN ITS SELF OUT!!!! oh well at least it starts now... at least I got some good info out of the C207 connector... BY THE WAY, ever look and see if you can find another one of those that is different?

Thanks
Shaun