Darth Mole

Hello 3rd-Gen-Friends,

first of all, please let me introduce myself, my last post was written a long time ago...

My name is Marcel, I am 23 years old come from Germany. I drive a 92' Firebird V6 for four years now and still working on new features.

My newest idea: I want to remove my VATS completly because I have a new alarm system with an Anti-Theft-System. Can someone of you tell me what to do?

I already looked around in the message boards and the technical articles but I only found a lot of threads about "bypassing"... So, is it necessary to burn a new PROM or is it enough to remove the module and rewire some wires to the ECM?

Thanks a lot and Greetings from Germany,

Marcel

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Hello from Texas

You are correct. If you remove VATS, you will need to burn a new PROM.
To remove VATS, you don't need to physically remove it from the vehicle. You can just disconnect it.

VATS controls two features in the car: cranking and fueling.
1) If you re-burn your PROM and delete VATS from the computer, the fueling will no longer be controlled by VATS.
2) To enable cranking without VATS, you will need to remove and bypass the VATS Starter Enable relay (behind driver side kick panel).

Also, remove the VATS fuse, otherwise the Security Indicator will be flashing (or lit) while driving.

This diagram will help you: http://www.austinthirdgen.org/mkport...m_pass-key.jpg

Do you know anybody in Germany who can burn a new chip (PROM) for you? You'll need an EPROM 27C256, they can be purchased an any electronics store for a few Euros. You don't need any fancy equipment or fancy programs. Just a friend with an EPROM burner. I can supply you with information on where to make the change in the chip.

Hope this helps.
Lou

Darth Mole

Hi Lou,

thanks a lot! Yes, maybe I know one or two people who can burn a chip for me. It would be great to get further information about the things to change.

Just for clearence, this is what I have to do after the new chip is burned:

1. Swap the old PROM for the new one.
2. Remove and bypass the Starter Enable Relay.
3. Remove the VATS fuse.
4. (optionally) Remove the other VATS stuff.

The fuel system does not need any manual changes on the wiring, bypassing, etc, this is done by burning the new PROM, correct?

Thanks a lot,

Marcel

PS.: Another question: There is a resistor on the key, but where is defined how much the restistance should be? Is it stored on the PROM (ECM) or in the Decoder Module? The reason I ask is because my girlfriend would get my old equipment for her own car, if it is stored in the Decoder module.

MrDude_1

the VATS key resistance value is stored in the VATS module.

the only thing the ECM ever sees from the VATS system is the fuel enable signal. With the new prom, the fuel enable signal is no longer needed.


by the way, when they wire your alarm, they can use the VATS system relay as the starter disable relay. there is no need to wire in a second relay for starter disable.

to be honest, i would just leave the VATS system since it is effective, reliable, passively activated, and will work along with your new alarm system.

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

Biglou I have a 92 camaro I'm wishing to do the same thing to, would I still need the same chip type u named for him or a diff one? Like would I use the EPROM 27c256 or a different one? Thanks a mill!

P.S my VATS is starting to go bad that's why I want it removed

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

And it's a 305 engine

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

WOW, a 6 y/o thread. Congratulations on reviving the dead! :-D

The 256 chip is for the TPI engine computers. They are impossible to find nowadays.
But if you have the TBI engine, you would be in luck because you would need ust a 128 chip. Those are still available at certain places.

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

I have the carb engine not the TPI so I need the 128?

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Carbs are technology from ice-age, they do not use chips. They were invented before people had running electricity.

So you do not need any chips for your carbed engine.

Hope this helps.
Lou

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/pr...84129_zoom.jpg

Biglou my engine's like this one so i think its the tbi...Im not a very engine minded guy haha, I can do most stuff but when it comes to sayin if the engine is a tbi or a carb...i have no idea.

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

That looks like a TBI engine. Then you would need the 128 chip.

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

ok thanks!

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Tbi uses a 2732

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

It's the stock engine, the 128 maybe the stock chip? Which is it lol the 128 or the 2732? 0_o

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

2732 chips are hard to find.
Easier to find and use the 128.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

the stock prom is a 2732 I have quite a few of them, unless your goung to be reprograming no need to cut or bend legs on a 27c128 or 256 or solder in a socket to use a flash eeprom.
Only 4k is needed unless you are going to stack more than one binary file.

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

well I cant find anyone or any shop/ dealer that can help me with my vats issue Any one know of a website or anyone on here that can get me a PROM without the VATS in it and reprogram my EMC so the vats is no longer in it aswell? My camaro is my daily driver and i have no other car

P.S im doing all this because my VATS is going out and doesnt want to work half the time and i just want it GONE FOREVER l0l

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

Also would a ECM and PROM from a older model without the VATS in it work in my car? Just like undo the mine and put the other in?

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Cheaper than paying for a custom chip, you can replace the ignition cylinder (or whatever is causing your VATS problem).
But if you have your heart set on eliminating VATS (which prevents any retard from starting your car with a screwdriver), you can bypass it (do a search) or have TP burn you a custom chip. (I don't have any good 2732's anymore)

vetteoz

iTrader: (13)

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...781-post4.html

There is no " reprogramming " of the ECM ; a non VATS memcal (chip ) is all that is required

The chip reprogramming takes care of the fuel side , you still have to manually remove or bypass the starter enable relay in order for VATS to be gone for good

camaro_lover92

iTrader: (1)

yeah thanks lol, i see that now i misread the post haha

BadRiggins

So could I keep the VATS system and add an aftermarket security system? I just recently came along one and I really want to keep my VATS as well.

Thanks.

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Yes.

BadRiggins

Is it any harder than doing it in a car without VATS?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

No a alarm will be serp earth wire it up like the manufacture suggests with the features you want if it has a starter kill big whoops the vats is separate although the enable relay could be a point to wire in a starter cut.

X Jackal X

So rather than making another thread it might be easier to just hijack this one.

Here is the story, I am trying to bypass the VATS module on a 1990 Iroc-z. I have a pcmforless motherchip installed into the ecm which has vats disabled on it. However, the module itself is still active and still effects starting. I have open access to the vats module and just want a hand in knowing what wires I need to crimp together to do this.

I am making a somewhat educated guess in saying that I need to crimp the black/yellow wire from the starter relay to the black/white ground wire leaving the vats module? What am I missing here?


Btw the way, I am looking the the wiring diagram posted above. (here is the link again) I have the same wires as listed in the diagram. http://www.austinthirdgen.org/mkport...m_pass-key.jpg

vetteoz

iTrader: (13)

with VATS deleted in the tune , the enable relay is redundant now and only a source of potential no start problems in the future
As per the diagram ,
bypass it completely by joining the wire from the Ign switch ( yellow ) to the wire going to the NSS (Dk green )
Put relay in the bin

X Jackal X

I took a look at another thread to find the relay's location. It is quite a tricky s.o.b. I think I will probably put a toggle switch on the relay's coil side as a anti theft measure while I am at it.

Thanks vetteoz. You are the man.

Ron U.S.M.C.

Disconnect the relay from the connector and jump the connector like this.

Its the two large wires on either side.

I would do a better job of making sure the jumper was definitely in place using a zip tie and electrical tape to cover any part of the jumper showing.

It will be a very hot wire when activated.

This is not my car.

greenyone

iTrader: (1)

http://www.bakerelectronix.com/products_vats/

This company makes a bypass module. Wouldn't this be easier and probably cheaper than a new prom or a prom flash?

Ron U.S.M.C.

Anyone interested in removing VATS should talk to Tuned Performance .

Here's what he did for me and I cant be happier.

Check out this thread =

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/elec...ing-tuned.html

Not2Available

Security light went on 18 months ago. Diagnostics reveal a bad VATS module. Replaced it with a new dealer part and purchased another one for backup. After completion, the Security was on but started and ran fine. Further diagnostics led to a VATS module, put in my backup new one, same problem. With VATS module unplugged, light is out. Using the 18 month old failed one, no light, no crank which I knew would be the result..
Checked fuses, unplugged VATS fuse, light out with no crank condition. With gauges fuse out, no light, starts fine. With C228 unplugged at bottom of steering column, light on still cranks and starts which it shouldn't. I have the shop manual, Mitchell On Demand, ALL Data for information.
Any suggestions?
Patrick

Ron U.S.M.C.

Try this !