Ok so first I will say what the problem is and what I did to try to fix it.

Well first the code meanings here are entirely different than what my hanes manual says. Newest comp for these cars w/ thermomaster chip, 6000ft above sea level.
first off it threw off a code for the o2 saying its an open (grounded) circuit/extremely lean/bad computer. So I checked the voltage, .882 (idle warm). cleared the codes.
Figured what the hell I replaced it. I checked the voltage Again .882 (idle warm). Cleared the codes.
So I put in another o2 sensor. Still .882 (Idle warm)

egr code also going off consistently.

Figured 3 o2 sensors, has to be a bad comp/bad chip/bad wiring. So I replaced it with a reman delco comp, same one as I had. After half of a day, o2 code came back. So I checked the circuit from the o2 connector to the back of the comp, resistance and continuity is fine. To be safe I clipped the wire at the comp and ran a new wire from the comp to the o2 sensor.
I still get the code. What else is there? I've eliminated everything but a bad chip or is there something else that can cause this? Maf? egr? fuel pressure? I know the thermomaster chips have issues.

 

FWIW
A correctly working O2 sensor voltage is not fixed ;
it should rapidly cycle from .1 - .9 V when at operating temp
Read
http://www.autodiagnosticsandpublish...or-testing.htm

 

Well obviously something is wrong. I've checked it three time and got the same reading. However I haven't checked the egr circuit or the maf sensor. I know those can affect it after reading that link.
Truth is I'm getting fed up with the car. To many repairs, too many quirks, all of which has cost me bout a 1k in under 6mths. I think at this point its about to become someone elses problem.

 

When did the problem start? All of a sudden? Was anything changed just before?
How long have you had the chip? Have you passed emissions testing with it before?

A static reading on an O2 sensor does not necessarily mean that the sensor is bad (especially after 3 new sensors). The ECM is responsible for the cross-counts on the oxygen level, not the sensor itself.
Though it does trouble me that the reading is always at 882 mV, which seems very odd.

 

I bought the car with that problem. I figured it was just a faulty circuit. Thermomasters chips are known to have/cause problems. I have paperwork saying that the car passed emissions, however it was from the previous owner, so I really don't know if it had the stock ship or not.
As far as testing the o2 circuit, the link vette gave me has allot of info that I never knew about testing it. So when i get it back up and running (clutch/exhaust) I'm gonna check it properly and all circuits that relate to it, maf and egr.
Also I'm gonna clean the maff and tb.. have cold start (eroneous idle)/skip issues till it warms up. Once it warms though, its highly responsive.

 

Alright, we'll let you do some investigation and get back to us late with what you find.
Also, it is not completely out of the question that the chip is simply dumping too much fuel into the engine, causing a rich condition. If you have a stock chip, feel free to install it and see what the O2 readings are afterwards.

 

Well as far as the stock ship, thats the issue. I literally can't seem to find one. I can have a custom programmed one, stock programing, but they still want between 100-200 for one.
If you have any leads to one, let me know.

 

ok so first is how I tested the circuit, then the results.
Now I ran anew wire straight to the back of the ecm, to avoid any possibility of a break in the wire.

Key on. engine off-Unplugged the o2 sensor and measured the voltage on the ecm side of the connector. The reading should be .450V . If no voltage there is a break in the wire; high/low voltage is a faulty ecm.
Tested @ .828V Back of connector and back of the ecm. (Faulty Ecm)

Second test was to hook up a dvom to a ground and to the start the car. Monitor the starting voltage and see if the voltage varies from.150-.900V as the car warms up.
Tested @ start .878v varied down to ..638V. Maintained .638-.660V @ OP Temp

If there is no varaince or very little variance in start voltage to OP temp voltage ground ALDL while engine is running. Watch for SES light to blink. Fast blinking will indicate open loop, flashing will stay constant. Slower blinking indicates Closed loop-comp is reading o2 and allowing it to control A/F. In this mode if SES is on longer than off=rich Off longer than on=lean. If O2 is not controlling A/F by OP Temp in closed loop o2 is bad.
Tested with very rapid constant flash. (o2 is bad)

Comp tested bad before the o2 sensor was even brought into the equation.?

Comp is an Ac Delco reman 165. It only has 3wks run time on it, and these circuits were bad before replacement, hence its replacement.

Interesting things I noticed when testing the o2. If I turn anything electrical on in the car the o2 voltage drops, usually around .020V.
Also when driving down the road I noticed based on speed and rpm, o2 voltage drops significantly Lowest was @ 70mph/2600rpm .150-.190V - 65mph/2400 .200-.300V - 60mph/2300rpm .300-.400V - 35mph/1500prm .450-.600V+
Dropping gears to decelerate All over the board.
Sitting still voltage climbs up.
Grounding ALDL at a stop light rapid flashing of the SES.

Another oddity I noticed, is when I disconnected the EGR Solenoind Vaccum to the EGR Valve itself, At IDLE its pulling vacuum.

Bad comp ground??? Crossed voltage wires???

 

Ok so no one has a solution or a point to start at?
This cant be an unusual problem?

 

If you disconnect the vacuum line on the egr valve and you are getting vacuum, you might have a bad egr solinoid. You should not have vacuum at the egr valve when the engine is idling in park. Having vacuum there will keep the egr open all the time and make the engine run like crap. Your right with the o2 sensor. If you disconnect the o2, your reading should be .45v. Had that problem with my iroc reading .45v all the time. Turn out I didnt have a ground for the o2 at the ecm. Grounded that wire and fixed mine. I would start by getting a stock prom. I had a ads superchip in my car at one time and it caused havoc. Your prom might be bad.

 

I'm trying to figure out the pins at the ecm. More towards the ground wires specifically the ecm ground. My o2 only has a single wire, so where is the grd wire to it? I'm trying to find a stock prom..I probably should ask over in the ecm. I'm sure someone can program one for me.
Egr solenoid was replaced prior to testing. That was the cheaper fix.
I don't think the ecm is bad, its literally not going into open loop, it stays into closed loop and refuses to react to the o2 signal.

 

The o2 is grounded by the body of the o2. There is a ground at the ecm for the o2. Here is a pic of the ecm that shows o2 ground and ecm grounds. I assume you have a 305 tpi motor. Thats what this pic is for.

 

Jermdm I thank you a million for that. Now where do you guys get this stuff? lol Seriously.

Well I have to major ground points, on the back of each cylinder head. I just retightened one last night.
Is there a manual I can buy, or find that would tell me where every connector and ground and wire is ran inside the car?

The wiring wasn't pretty when I got the car, (Only a few electronics actually worked) so I may need to redo it myself and finding all the wires, connectors, junctions and grounds would be a bonus.

 

Helm Inc. Its a factory service manual.

 

Verdict is... I ran a new ground wire from the back of the comp to the firewall/block ground strap. o2 signal started to pan out, rather its all over the place, like its suppose to be. Unless at idle, it goes as low as .020V.

LIke an *** I got ahead of myself. I had pulled the ecm fuse while wiring up the new ground. Then I descided to do a basic diag on the egr system. While the fuse was out I grounded the aldl. Everything checked semi ok on the egr. Pulled the clip out of the aldl. An tried to start the car without the ecm fuse in. LOL. Realised after nothing happened, put the fuse in and the battery was near dead. Jump started the car and now....
Now the SES light will not come on at all while the engine is running, code 13 came back but no code 32 yet. The alt gauge which used to read near 14V won't even read 13 unless I'm nailing 3k on the tach.
My conclusion is that something is not grounding or is back feeding the grounds. Its the only logical solution I think of.
Rewire the entire system? How do I know the fuse panel is the right one? (I've seen 4 different ones for this car.)

 

something else I noticed. Someone contacted me reguarding the thermomaster chip. So to oblige him, he wanted pics of the chip.

So I unplugged the ecm fuse, took the circuit board out, removed the chip. Now I left the wires plugged into the back.

Now upon reassembly when I went to put the board back in, the board arcced against the case...I removed the wires from the back of the board and reinstalled everything.

What baffles me is, if the key is off, and the fuse for the ecm is removed...How the hell can the comp board arc....every circuit should have dead or deenergised??? There was no power to the comp, or so I though.

 

you can damage a ecm with esd and even if a computer is powered down the capacitors in the ecm still hold a charge.

 

I have one for you. I Pm'ed you earlier!