amigadman

I picked up a Winter project and am not sure which way to go. Parts car is a 85 TA with a new 350/Hooker headers/air gap intake with a Holley 750/MSD ignition/new heads ported and polished not sure on valve sizes/GTA disk rear.Car was set up for quarter mile with roll cage . Just never got finished and that's how I bought it. This is the donor car with some rust. The car all is going into is a stock 1988 TA 305 TPI 90,000 miles in need of exhaust,suspension,and head work.I plan on moving all the good stuff from the 85 to the 88 including swapping the t-top roof. Question is to swap the intake and TPI from the 305 to the 350 going in or stay with the air gap and carb?Mileage? Performance?Reliability?

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Carb, simple to tune and will deliver fewer headaches and cost less.

But every TPI and EFI lover and their mom will disagree.

TJ07RK

I have a 86 Z with a 305 carb and I have a 91 350 TPI engine that I am going to go with the carb set up. I have found that is a much easyer way to do it.

HCR13

iTrader: (5)

I get 26mpg on my 305 TPI, just a thought on mileage....

mmadden55

The Carb is the easy way to go. From a performance standpoint fuel injection is way better, also on mileage. The Stock 305 TPI will need some help to get the best performance. I say swap over the TPI to get it running. Down the road get a Holley stealth ram and swap over your fuel rails, and add in some better injectors etc.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Have to say bull ****, there is a reason the fastest cars in the world are carbed.

vetteoz

iTrader: (13)

Carbs is the king for cars driven WOT ; undisputed.
But they don't have to cold start /idle in sub zero temps or get fuel economy.
I have engines with both and they both work excellent for what they are used for.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Well, you must not hang with the guys i do. I have the almighty LS1 guys cranking their head and cam cars two or three time before they stay running and i bump the key and it fires up.

It is all in the tune and i dont have a choke on any of them. As for fuel econemy, it is no much better for EFI on a carbed ride with the proper tune. Most people make them too rich and they use way too much.

amigadman

As far as having both sitting next to each other for speed of swapping . I was thinking of moving the 350 carb into the 88 305tpi and maybe swappint the tpi set-up later? Looks like the 85 was an injected car converted to carb already. Any thoughts?

Saabster

iTrader: (2)

What fastest car are you talking about because I think the Veyron is fuel injected.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Yeaaa...i was speaking of quarter mile racing. Not to mention, how long can the Veyron run at a constant 200 MPH like a NASCAR? Not long, but then again we are not talking apples for apples.

And if you didnt know, the Saleen Aero is faster than the Veyron.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hgny_fDep_A

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Then you didn't you just say that?

Right, apples & oranges.
Fact: NASCAR cars run carbs because NASCAR makes them run carbs. They have been talking for a couple of years of allowing fuel injection (not requiring FI). Word is when NASCAR allows FI, teams will all be running FI within a year or two. Teams are already working on FI systems so they'll be ready when the day comes.

Using NASCAR for an argument for the supposed superiority of carbs is silliness.

By the way, NASCAR also requires flat tappet lifters. That what you recommend for a "performance" engine???

What's your point? Saleens are FI.

Carbs are like the use of profanity - proof you're too lazy to use your brain to make something clean work.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Well, for the last statement, it is proof of lack of funding and the ability to go fast on a budget.

I get a bigger cam and heads, i re jet, a TPI or 90 of any other FI has to enlarge injectors and 9 times out of ten(actually more) they have to have someone tune their stuff for them, so clearly they are the ones too lazy to do their own work.

I am a hands on guy and the fastest quarter mile cars are still carbed.

The Saleen thing was just letting him know the Veyron is not the fastest, off topic, my bad sir.

As for NASCAR, whatever, your right and it is gay, open wheel and LeMans is better.

off topic again, my bad.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

I will agree that in the short term, it is less expensive to get peak HP out of a carb system.

But, it isn't legal to convert an EFI vehicle to carb unless it is old enough to have been offered with carb for the chassis model year, and then only if you use a factory or certified replacement carb system. It is also going to sacrifice "area under the curve", and will not be able to compete efficiency-wise with properly tuned feedback EFI, meaning the long term costs to operate on the street will be higher with carb. Since mileage was mentioned as a consideration by the OP, it can't be ignored.

Carb has a weakness that simply can't be overcome by tuning. That is, metering and fuel atomization is accomplished by air flow. That cannot be adjusted for best efficiency under all operating conditions. If you optimize it for WOT, it will suffer at idle, off-idle, and cruise. If you optimize it for idle, off-idle, and cruise, you'll compromise WOT.

Fuel injection, on the other hand, sprays fuel from high pressure to atmospheric or below through a small orifice - much better atomization. Liquid doesn't burn - it has to be evaporated and thoroughly mixed with the air in order to get the most of both power and efficiency. In addition, a feedback system will compensate for changing conditions without operator input - can't say that with carbs.

Yes, you can make carbs run much more efficiently than they do from the factory or out of the box. But, you're going to have to invest either in equipment or pay for dyno time - hey, just like you do if you want to optimize EFI. . .

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

It is give and take ether way.

The carb as for long term depends on the application. In the end, for different people you will prefer a different setup, but in the end i am still wooping the **** out of EFI cars with a carb for fractions of the cost.

Not as you stated, if you dont know how to tune, you will still be better with a carb price wise, but for the person that doesnt know anything, the EFI seems better, but EVERYONE i know has tuning troubles with EFI.

They get it right though..eventually, after spending more than i want to talk about.

Never heard of having to give up one thing for another on a carb though, WOT VS idle and cruise characteristics. I never have a compromise with mine. Mid range is the only thing i can say can be an issue, till you finally get the right power valve.

Saabster

iTrader: (2)

I didn't know, that's epicly awesome.

Personally I'm gonna to megasquirt my TBI car and see how fast I can go with as few things as possible.

MADMAXGTA

iTrader: (1)

so if you make the swap from tpi to carb do you have to change the fuel pump?

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Generally yes, unless you get a return style regulator.