Dumb Q-Are all Formula's WS6's?
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From: Orem, UT
Dumb Q-Are all Formula's WS6's?
So I'm looking at an 89 Firebird with the 305/M5 in it, and I have a question.
I looked up the VIN, and it's a Formula (has the teardrop hood and everything), but it's missing all of it's badges. The only badge it has is one on the passenger side dash that says "upgraded suspension". The car has disc brakes on all 4 tires, but just has regular firebird centercaps.
According to http://www.theformulasource.com, all third-gen Formula's are WS6's. Any truth to this?
Any other info you can give me? The RPO list is AWOL on this car as well.
I looked up the VIN, and it's a Formula (has the teardrop hood and everything), but it's missing all of it's badges. The only badge it has is one on the passenger side dash that says "upgraded suspension". The car has disc brakes on all 4 tires, but just has regular firebird centercaps.
According to http://www.theformulasource.com, all third-gen Formula's are WS6's. Any truth to this?
Any other info you can give me? The RPO list is AWOL on this car as well.
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From: Orem, UT
Originally posted by 83firebirdS/E
All formula's are WS6!!
That badge inside would have said "Performance Suspension"
All formula's are WS6!!
That badge inside would have said "Performance Suspension"
My bad on the badge, it does indeed say "Performance Suspension", I just wasn't thinking when I typed
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The "Performance Suspension" badge doesnt necessarily mean that you have WS6. There are a couple suspension upgrades other than WS6. An excellent thread on this can be found here:
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...ight=ws6+s%2Fe
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...ight=ws6+s%2Fe
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From: Quebec
Car: 94 Firebird
Engine: 3.4L
Transmission: t5
yes.. My 85 T/A as that badge as well... with no rear disc... without the original bill... can you know with what package it came? I mean what lvl of suspension?
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I am quoting Kizz here, hope this helps...Kizz, thanks for the incredible amount of suspension knowledge......
"I doubt this old wive's tale will ever be put to rest. WS6 is not a suspension package, never was, never will be. it's a performance package that includes many upgrade items, one of them being better springs & sway bars. but guess what, it also includes better brakes, better steering ratio, positraction and other stuff.
That picture does not say anything about WS6. the "Special suspension package" it refers to is LEVEL TWO suspension for 1982, I guess the equivalent of RPO Y99 or F41. "Special suspension package" and "Special performance package" are not the same thing.
it breaks down like this:
FIREBIRD - LEVEL ONE suspension is standard. peewee front sway bar, no rear sway bar at all! doh. also the steering system is not rack & pinion, but is some ancient corkscrew design I can't think of at the moment. LEVEL TWO is optional and includes 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar but still 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE is not available.
FIREBIRD Trans Am - LEVEL TWO suspension is standard and it has 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar and 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE suspension is available but the only way to get it is to order the WS6 performance package, which includes 32MM front sway bar, 21MM rear sway bar, and stiffer springs, which is what LEVEL THREE is all about.
Firebird S/E - exactly the same as FIREBIRD Trans Am above.
WS6 was not standard on anything. it was a pay-extra option for all f-bodys, at least in 1982, which is what we're talking about here.
your photo talks about Y99/F41, not WS6. it shows Y99/F41 available on Firebird, standard for Firebird Trans Am and standard on Firebird S/E, ( A, S, S ) which is right on the money.
I assume you're on the 82 brochure.. well if so, look on the back cover, middle column, about two thirds of the way down. You'll see "Special performance package". That's WS6. the availability will look like this: ( -, A, A ). The dash means Not Available. which is the same way I tried to describe it above.
In 1982 they also had a shortage of WS6 disc-brake rear axles, so they substituted in drum-brake axles for most cars. The car still kept the rest of the WS6 goodies, but since it didn't have the disc brakes, it was different enough to warrant its own RPO. They called it WS7. So when you ordered a WS6 in 82, you probably got a WS7 instead unless you were lucky. All 2000 of the 82 Recaros got mandatory WS6 but there wasn't much left after that. To find a 1982 WS6 non-Recaro is pretty damn rare. Only PHS can verify it, as the cars didn't have their RPO stickers in 'em till 1984.
just tryin to help : "
"I doubt this old wive's tale will ever be put to rest. WS6 is not a suspension package, never was, never will be. it's a performance package that includes many upgrade items, one of them being better springs & sway bars. but guess what, it also includes better brakes, better steering ratio, positraction and other stuff.
That picture does not say anything about WS6. the "Special suspension package" it refers to is LEVEL TWO suspension for 1982, I guess the equivalent of RPO Y99 or F41. "Special suspension package" and "Special performance package" are not the same thing.
it breaks down like this:
FIREBIRD - LEVEL ONE suspension is standard. peewee front sway bar, no rear sway bar at all! doh. also the steering system is not rack & pinion, but is some ancient corkscrew design I can't think of at the moment. LEVEL TWO is optional and includes 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar but still 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE is not available.
FIREBIRD Trans Am - LEVEL TWO suspension is standard and it has 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar and 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE suspension is available but the only way to get it is to order the WS6 performance package, which includes 32MM front sway bar, 21MM rear sway bar, and stiffer springs, which is what LEVEL THREE is all about.
Firebird S/E - exactly the same as FIREBIRD Trans Am above.
WS6 was not standard on anything. it was a pay-extra option for all f-bodys, at least in 1982, which is what we're talking about here.
your photo talks about Y99/F41, not WS6. it shows Y99/F41 available on Firebird, standard for Firebird Trans Am and standard on Firebird S/E, ( A, S, S ) which is right on the money.
I assume you're on the 82 brochure.. well if so, look on the back cover, middle column, about two thirds of the way down. You'll see "Special performance package". That's WS6. the availability will look like this: ( -, A, A ). The dash means Not Available. which is the same way I tried to describe it above.
In 1982 they also had a shortage of WS6 disc-brake rear axles, so they substituted in drum-brake axles for most cars. The car still kept the rest of the WS6 goodies, but since it didn't have the disc brakes, it was different enough to warrant its own RPO. They called it WS7. So when you ordered a WS6 in 82, you probably got a WS7 instead unless you were lucky. All 2000 of the 82 Recaros got mandatory WS6 but there wasn't much left after that. To find a 1982 WS6 non-Recaro is pretty damn rare. Only PHS can verify it, as the cars didn't have their RPO stickers in 'em till 1984.
just tryin to help : "
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From: Norwalk, Iowa
part of that info is not right. for 1) the WS6 package had 36 mm front sway bar, not 32mm. Also, I don't think that any thirdgens had 14" rims, the smallest you could get was 15" I believe.
Also there technically was WS6 cars that didn't have posi. They didnt have the WS6 RPO, so techincally they werent WS6, but everything was the same as a WS6 except the posi. A WY6 replaced the WS6 when this occurance happened.
Also there technically was WS6 cars that didn't have posi. They didnt have the WS6 RPO, so techincally they werent WS6, but everything was the same as a WS6 except the posi. A WY6 replaced the WS6 when this occurance happened.
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Originally posted by joshp14
part of that info is not right. for 1) the WS6 package had 36 mm front sway bar, not 32mm. Also, I don't think that any thirdgens had 14" rims, the smallest you could get was 15" I believe.
part of that info is not right. for 1) the WS6 package had 36 mm front sway bar, not 32mm. Also, I don't think that any thirdgens had 14" rims, the smallest you could get was 15" I believe.
As far as the rims, 15" was the smallest rim with WS6/WS7. 14" was the standard rim without it on early third gens.
9 times out of 10, the typical thirdgen user only knows information relevant to his/her own car. When generalizations are applied to all years, misinformation is passed around.
This thread is a classic example.
This thread is a classic example.
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Joined: Oct 2002
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From: MN
Car: 1989 Formy droptop/88 Deville
Engine: L98 350 TPI
Transmission: factory RWD, WS6 susp
Originally posted by Dirty Rob
I am quoting Kizz here, hope this helps...Kizz, thanks for the incredible amount of suspension knowledge......
"I doubt this old wive's tale will ever be put to rest. WS6 is not a suspension package, never was, never will be. it's a performance package that includes many upgrade items, one of them being better springs & sway bars. but guess what, it also includes better brakes, better steering ratio, positraction and other stuff.
That picture does not say anything about WS6. the "Special suspension package" it refers to is LEVEL TWO suspension for 1982, I guess the equivalent of RPO Y99 or F41. "Special suspension package" and "Special performance package" are not the same thing.
it breaks down like this:
FIREBIRD - LEVEL ONE suspension is standard. peewee front sway bar, no rear sway bar at all! doh. also the steering system is not rack & pinion, but is some ancient corkscrew design I can't think of at the moment. LEVEL TWO is optional and includes 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar but still 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE is not available.
FIREBIRD Trans Am - LEVEL TWO suspension is standard and it has 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar and 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE suspension is available but the only way to get it is to order the WS6 performance package, which includes 32MM front sway bar, 21MM rear sway bar, and stiffer springs, which is what LEVEL THREE is all about.
Firebird S/E - exactly the same as FIREBIRD Trans Am above.
WS6 was not standard on anything. it was a pay-extra option for all f-bodys, at least in 1982, which is what we're talking about here.
your photo talks about Y99/F41, not WS6. it shows Y99/F41 available on Firebird, standard for Firebird Trans Am and standard on Firebird S/E, ( A, S, S ) which is right on the money.
I assume you're on the 82 brochure.. well if so, look on the back cover, middle column, about two thirds of the way down. You'll see "Special performance package". That's WS6. the availability will look like this: ( -, A, A ). The dash means Not Available. which is the same way I tried to describe it above.
In 1982 they also had a shortage of WS6 disc-brake rear axles, so they substituted in drum-brake axles for most cars. The car still kept the rest of the WS6 goodies, but since it didn't have the disc brakes, it was different enough to warrant its own RPO. They called it WS7. So when you ordered a WS6 in 82, you probably got a WS7 instead unless you were lucky. All 2000 of the 82 Recaros got mandatory WS6 but there wasn't much left after that. To find a 1982 WS6 non-Recaro is pretty damn rare. Only PHS can verify it, as the cars didn't have their RPO stickers in 'em till 1984.
just tryin to help : "
I am quoting Kizz here, hope this helps...Kizz, thanks for the incredible amount of suspension knowledge......
"I doubt this old wive's tale will ever be put to rest. WS6 is not a suspension package, never was, never will be. it's a performance package that includes many upgrade items, one of them being better springs & sway bars. but guess what, it also includes better brakes, better steering ratio, positraction and other stuff.
That picture does not say anything about WS6. the "Special suspension package" it refers to is LEVEL TWO suspension for 1982, I guess the equivalent of RPO Y99 or F41. "Special suspension package" and "Special performance package" are not the same thing.
it breaks down like this:
FIREBIRD - LEVEL ONE suspension is standard. peewee front sway bar, no rear sway bar at all! doh. also the steering system is not rack & pinion, but is some ancient corkscrew design I can't think of at the moment. LEVEL TWO is optional and includes 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar but still 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE is not available.
FIREBIRD Trans Am - LEVEL TWO suspension is standard and it has 30MM front sway bar, 12MM rear sway bar and 14 inch wheels. LEVEL THREE suspension is available but the only way to get it is to order the WS6 performance package, which includes 32MM front sway bar, 21MM rear sway bar, and stiffer springs, which is what LEVEL THREE is all about.
Firebird S/E - exactly the same as FIREBIRD Trans Am above.
WS6 was not standard on anything. it was a pay-extra option for all f-bodys, at least in 1982, which is what we're talking about here.
your photo talks about Y99/F41, not WS6. it shows Y99/F41 available on Firebird, standard for Firebird Trans Am and standard on Firebird S/E, ( A, S, S ) which is right on the money.
I assume you're on the 82 brochure.. well if so, look on the back cover, middle column, about two thirds of the way down. You'll see "Special performance package". That's WS6. the availability will look like this: ( -, A, A ). The dash means Not Available. which is the same way I tried to describe it above.
In 1982 they also had a shortage of WS6 disc-brake rear axles, so they substituted in drum-brake axles for most cars. The car still kept the rest of the WS6 goodies, but since it didn't have the disc brakes, it was different enough to warrant its own RPO. They called it WS7. So when you ordered a WS6 in 82, you probably got a WS7 instead unless you were lucky. All 2000 of the 82 Recaros got mandatory WS6 but there wasn't much left after that. To find a 1982 WS6 non-Recaro is pretty damn rare. Only PHS can verify it, as the cars didn't have their RPO stickers in 'em till 1984.
just tryin to help : "
Foregoing the correction, I had suspension pieces that make mine qualify, but as you've pointed out...there are several pieces available in the package. A Pontiac dealer can also help you in this regard, I've found. I think you can add the parts your car doesn't have, most people find a way to mod a car in ways the manufacturer neglected
Bill
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