I think it is hilarious what people are trying to pull, even dealers... Granted they may not be any the wiser, but it is their loss..

So Today's victim or should I say contestant, is a 1989 Formula LO3...

the car is a super clean example, and looks great in pictures (too bad it is an LO3)...

First person to answer it correctly...gets a smile and a handshake (If I ever meet them)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Ponti...lenotsupported

You have to be up on your information to figure it out... There may be more than one thing, But there is a MAJOR one that should stick out like a sore thumb and one reason NOT to purchase this car without some extensive research!!!

Good luck...

 

Would it be the air cleaner on the "tpi" ?

 

The first thing i noticed is that it says its a tuned port car in the description but in the picture shows it has a tbi. also is i don't know much about the pontiacs but is that a correct steering wheel for an 89

 

140 MPH cluster on a 305 TBI car. That means more than likely this is NOT a 55k mile car unless they just happened to have the odometer reset to match the mileage of the car, which is unlikely.

The car also has an 8k tach so it means the entire cluster has probably been replaced because a 305 TBI should have a 6k tach.

 

89 didnt get ABS, 90 did.

 

Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a WINNER!!!

That was my thought exactly...

Actually I suspect that the entire interior may have been replaced as the Dash I do not believe in 1989 had the color keyed Dash panel, my 1989 Formula 350 Vert does not have it that is for sure... I do know that in 1987 & 1988 it was available on the Formula... It may have been with the Custom seats tho, but looking at the pictures I do not believe those to be the Deluxe seats as they do not have the pockets on the back of the seat...

Actually the TPI/TBI thing I did not even notice, personally that is just bad information, nothing like the gauge cluster, it has been changed...

John

 

Yea me!!! I knew that had to be what you were talking about. Also, notice that he claims it's a one owner car. That means he should know about anything that has been changed so if the mileage is incorrect he can't blame it on a previous owner.

When can I claim my smile and handshake?

 

that was to easy lol I spotted it in like a second

 

Meet me at the Trans Am nationals in Dayton I should be there in the Winners Circle with my Yellow car...

John

 

I hope that is a joke... no Thirdgen's had ABS

 

scratch that, im thinking air bags.

 

i dont no much but i spotted the air cleaner,and speedo seemed odd to me i guess i was right about that we should have more of these games

 

Def not a tuned port, Hopefully someone notices that

 

lol i sent him a message on ebay telling him its a tbi not tpi and he told me to relax and mind my own buisness sounds like someones trying to scam a sucker

 

i live in lima ohio, about 30-40 min away maybe i will take a ride up there

 

Well, since he has a picture of the engine in the listing he's not really going to scam anybody about the engine since it's obviously not a TPI engine. Anybody with only a slight knowledge of these cars should know that. However, very few people would notice that the cluster is not original and there's a very good change the mileage shown isn't accurate. Since he claims to be the original owner he knows the actual mileage on the car and my guess is that the odometer is incorrect. If that's the case, he's a scammer.

 

just click on history report and it tells you that it is a tbi car

 

He sounds both ignorant, and arrogant to boot, certainly not what I would look for in a seller. I wonder what his explanation for the incorrect cluster is.

 

yeah, my first thought was the tbi engine.
i didnt notice the cluster, but even if you were a moron, you would see the vehicle history report saying it was a tbi.
at that point, i would (if it were me) get a history report and they would probably note some discrepancy in the mileage unless the gauges were swapped out by the dealer or when the car had very low mileage

 

he added on there that the gauges are original and from the factory.

 

and he fix the type of motor it is... what a jerk...

 

Well yea, they are original and from the factory. Just not for his car.

Just like my car, the 145 speedo is a factory original, just not for my model and engine combo.

 

I was browsing craigslist today and i found this:
http://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/cto/1219914286.html


Can you guys figure out the problem? It's not as exciting as the last one but I e-mailed the guy and asked him to clarify what the car was to see if he was just confused or lying and he told me that "It is a true Formula with factory 5.7L and racing suspension."

 

trans am body is one thing.

 

Did you explain that Formula's do not come with ground effects or that front end? That they do not come with those wheels he has on the car? They also do not come with those taillights. That is a T/A.

 

Wrong wing and wrong rims mostly likely, too.

 

Yeah, I'm thinking this dude was told by one someone this was a formula when he's had a trans am the whole time because it is weird to even look at that and think anyone could ever think its an original formula.

Off topic but does anyone know where I can get those ground effects for my formula...

 

He did explain the wing situation near the end of his post. That was one thing I caught also.

 

Yeah I did tell him that formulas didn't come with that hood or front end, and that they didn't have the ground effects. I didn't mention the wheels or the tail lights. He hasn't responded to me as of yet. I figure if someone told him he had a formula then he thought he's had one this whole time. Either that, or he is somehow trying to pass that car off as a formula. Which will be kinda hard seeing as it doesn't look like one at all..

 

One quick read of his description makes it clear that the seller doesn't know anything about cars, but is trying to sound like he does. Why else would he be trying to "pass off" a T/A as a less expensive Formula?

"5.7 racing engine" and "racing suspension" and "racing transmission" LOL. Looks like a regular L98 WS6 Trans Am to me.

 

Haha I had a good laugh myself. You're right. It really wouldn't make sense for someone to try to pass a car off a less expensive version. This guy wrote a book. I had to read it a few times to even try to understand what the hell he was saying.

 

This is a fun game, someone find the next one!

 

Pretty sure I got one.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/engi...0-formula.html

 

350 with t5

 

I was actually looking at the airbag...haha.

 

THe Airbag and the T5...

John

 

Going towards the first car, a freind of mine bought a 91 firebird with the L03 TBI & 5 speed and it in fact did have a 140mph cluster with 8K tach.....not sure if this is just coincidence or if it was a rare factory option. Car looked pretty original besides that.

 

As mentioned in another thread, anything is technically possible from the factory, wrong decals, wrong IP... The IP's are actual date stamped IIRC have something on them with a date on them. If I was looking at the car I would definately disassemble the Dash to inspect it to see whether it is within a reasonable time before the car was made. You could check the Door jamb to see the Month the car was made, and from the information that is available and from the sequence number you should be able to tell about when it was made within a week if not a few days. Then you can relate that to when the IP was made and if the IP was made after the production date then you know that it is not original. If it was a few weeks, probably around 6 weeks or so prior to the assembly date of the car then there is a good chance it may be original.

Keep in mind that our cars were made at an assembly plant, this is different than a factory like What was Buick City. Buick City had its own Foundry, stamps, engine plant, transmission plant and was virtually an all inclusive production facility, some things were still shipped in like Seating, carpet, trim etc. At one time Buick City was the single largest factory in the world. With all that said, Van Nuys, and Norwood were both assembly plants, parts were shipped in from vendors, usually reasonably close vendors, thus why from what I have seen all Van Nuys cars have LOF glass and Norwood cars have PPG glass. The parts were shipped in from a supplier Just In Time or JIT so they were usually made just weeks before they were installed on a car.

Just some thoughts.

John

 

Last year I was at a car show with my 87 GTA, 350 tpi, t-top, and some guy comes up to me and says "not bad", about the my car . "I got an 86 GTA"...... So I told him that "there are no 86 GTA's, your probably confused. They only made GTA's from 87 to 92. Does it look like mine?" Yeap, he said. "then its a 87 to 89 GTA." "NO Its a 86 GTA".....86 he says.... anyway the guy who sold him the car got his hand the GTA emblems, put it on the car at some point, then to sold his firebird as an 86 GTA.......poor sucker, I did not enjoy tell him

 

OKAY, I don't know if anyone has posted this one yet, but this one is good....


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Colle...=65%3A7|39%3A1

(credit goes elsewhere because I found this in another thread but thought this would be appropriate)

What wrong with this Third Gen ?

 

1. O.k. so in his description he says that only the 91 formula got t-tops w/350...Wrong! 87 GTA did half way, not at first.
2. Did the S/E models ever have WS6 option????I don't know
3. 15in rims on T/A? Should be 16in on T/A and 15in on S/E.
4. 91' 2518 GTA's were built!
5. As far as I know TBI was Not an option for top of the line (T/A GTA)
6. 120m/h cluster that can't be right either

 

"In 1991 The Formula was the only third Gen F-body to get to T-tops with a 350 Engine starting in MID year 1991"

That is true. In 1991 that was the only way to get a Thirdgen w/ 350 and t-tops.

Yes, the S/E could get WS6.

In the earlier years WS6 meant 15" rims. The 16" rims didn't appear until the 1984 15th IIRC. His quote on the WS6 appears to be for 82-84, not 85+, which is rather confusing, but it looks like he copy pasted from a bunch of different sources.

I think he may referring to convertibles on the numbers, not sure in that.

The LO3/LG4 was available in a Trans Am until 1990, iirc.

"WS6 was standard equipment on top of the line Trans Am which featured adjustable lumbar supports, monochromatic paint, and special badges among other top of the line options"

This quote is not true. WS6 was not standard on the TA, it was standard on the GTA. Replace Trans Am with GTA and that sentence is correct.

 

O.K. At least someone else found his description confusing.....I'm still not sure what engine he has? I think he's also saying that His "Top of the Line" car came factory w/15in rims....That can't be true!!!!? It's just seems that he googled FIREBIRD typed a bunch of Stuff to make his car/description sound fancy.
6. 120m/h cluster wasn't this a hot topic on the other car???

 

It has a 305 TPI engine. 8th of the vin is F and I think that was the only engine available in the 91/92 TA Verts.

 

so standard suspension for the GTA was the WS6?

 

Yes, both the GTA and Formula came standard with the WS6. It was N/A for the base model and an option for the Trans Am.

Also, about the cluster, after some searching it looks like in 91/92 you only got the 140 w/ the N10 dual cat option for the 305 5-speeds, so I would guess that cluster is just fine in that car being we have no idea what options it has.