Just thought I would post this. It is a piece of third gen history.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-Trans-Am-Gale-Banks-Twin-Turbo-1982-firebird-trans-am-gale-banks-twin-turbo-200-mph-car-/390688097835?forcerrptr=true&hash=item5af6d3462b&item=390688097835&pt=US_Cars_Trucks
Not sure if it's worth what he is asking but it is spotless and one of a kind(I think).

 

That looks to be a real GB turbo car, although a lot of the details (hose connectors, boost retard) are relatively new (last 10 to 15 years, maybe newer).

These cars were record holders back in the early to mid 80's and cost a boatload when done. Banks did not skip out on cheap parts and cross fingers they would live - he just changed them from the start.

If my wife would let me do it, I would pay $85k for it...

 

That car is good example as to why there is no reason to put true dual exhaust on a Thirdgen. 611 HP, twin turbo and basically factory exhaust routing.

 

Holy hells yes that car is wicked sweet

...and where do I get those VDO gauges!!! Helleva crooked dash tho lol, or center console/radio pod...

Incredible how clean that car is.

 

What's going on with the dashpad/console/dashboard? It looks all warped and off kilter...? Nonetheless, what a gorgeous car. I've never been much a 'bird fan, but this one looks fantastic. Looks a lot better than the 85-90 ones that's for sure.

 

The bottom of the accelerator pedal is broken off, too.

 

they were high to build a 200+mph car without a full cage

 

Like a cage would help if you crashed at 200...

 

A properly engineered cage would certainly increase your chance at survival, especially considering your chances of crashing at a full 200mph are slim considering the actual amount of time spent at 200mph, but I would like a good cage for a crash anywhere between 80-200mph, especially in one of these cars.

 

There are plenty of cars that go 200mph with no cages. In fact I think most cars that go 200mph dont have cages. In a 200 mph crash survivability is mostly luck regardless of the cage, and a cage is a serious injury hazard in a street car. It's probably safer without it.

Also, these cars actually got excellent crash test ratings. They arent as good as new cars, but for the time they were great. They had 5 star ratings for front and rear collisions. Of course, those ratings are for 30mph accidents...

 

The ground effects give the car an incredible look.

I wonder what the deal is with the interior; it looks great but something is slightly off, as if the body is tweaked or somehow modified to fit all the performance stuff in and the interior moldings weren't modified to fit in the new shape.

 

I know it says in the article for the car that they completely removed the tan interior from the car and installed the blue or blck interior that that you see in the pictures, that may have something to do with it.

 

I still have the Car & Driver magazine with that car in it. Truly a great piece of 3rd gen history. I am delighted that the car survives in the condition it is in. Impressive for today, much less 30 years ago. Speaks volumes to the talents at Banks in those days, as well as to the basic competence of the 3rd gen platform itself.

 

They went through a bunch of engines due to detonation while trying to get the 200 mph run, according to the article. It goes to show how far turbocharging has progressed with intercooling and meth injection. Also, blow through carb has its limitations. Fuel injection on that car would have made a huge difference. I wonder what it would take to get that 200 mph run in a third gen now - LS swap with a large turbocharger? Maybe even an LS9 engine swap.

 

In that car, 425 to 450hp... That's all it would need.

 

I was thinking the same thing when I saw the exhaust setup.

 

It would still take about 550-600 hp to reach 200mph. What type of motor used wouldn't matter, it's just a certain power level that is needed.
EFI would have been a motor saver in this setup and prolly made a lil better power.
A 600hp NA sbc can do 200 just as easy as a LS these days.

 

I love that a supercar has AC.

 

Thought the Turbo TTA was hot... I guess I have to move it down a notch
It's so C L E A N ! ! ! !

Was it a 4th gen Fbody Banks was testing at high speed and the car flipped since they said aerodynamically, it was like a backwards arrow? Or was it a third gen?

Rafael

 

i really really like the wheels

 

At one time you could buy the kit to install the Banks Turbo stuff... It was the entire drivetrain from Engine back to rear axle. Then I think Banks would also convert it for you... There was a 3rd gen Performance book that had it in there...

That would be a sweet ride.

 

Interesting to see how many stock parts were reused

Torque arm
LCAs
Upper panhard bar
No SFCs of any kind

The snout girdle on the 9" is an interesting take on mounting the TA

That car is a neat piece of history. Nice to see a company build what they need instead of buy brand name everything

 

I'm not sure where you get your 200mph power figures, but they are off by at least 50hp (if not 100+).

Keep in mind that this car would go 225mph (not sure if that was tested or a reasonable estimate, but it did hit 204mph) with 611hp, making it a lot more efficient than 600hp to hit 200mph.

They used the most aerodynamic 3rd gen and tweaked it even more for this particular car. Even a 100% dead stock IROC or TA would hit 200mph with 500hp or less - I have a detailed aerodynamic calculator and with stock GM figures and weight, 200 is about 490hp. A little bit of massaging could drop that figure to 450hp or less without any major modifications.

Hot Rod had done an article in 1989 of a bunch of a race team who modified their 88 TA to hit record top speeds. The car only was lowered, had the mirrors removed, and had a slightly lower front spoiler (1.5" or so) and the car hit 238mph with a 650hp engine.

 

i know

ditto, even has one of those "junk" fram oil filters that aren't any good haha

"600 horsepower you can live with" was the tagline iirc

 

My numbers were just XXX numbers.
I was just pointing out, X car takes X power to reach 200mph no matter what motor is in X car. that is all.
I do know my 89 formula has been over 200mph (GPS and even once on a cops radar gun) and it had 550 NA hp or so back then when I did that all the time.

 

It actually looks like someone polished the SLP exhaust for the Firehawk... Looks almost identical to what I have on my 87, I polished from the muffler (if you can call it that) to the tips and it looked fantastic...

 

Uunderstood.

One point to make is that power curve and gearing does matter quite a bit when it comes to top speed. If you look at the small engine, high HP exotics like Ferrari and Lambo, they all have very high RPM power peaks and very small gear spreads. When you shift into your top speed gear at redline and end up at 80% of the revs, you have a lot of leverage to pull to stop speed. If, for example, have a 700R4 in your car with a 7000 rpm rev limit (and a 6500 peak), you will end up at 4900rpm or so and have to claw up another1600rpm for the theoretical top speed. A 4.5L Ferrari might redline at 8250 and end up at 7300 in the top speed gear - big difference and a good one for the F car.

 

Banks exhaust is 100x better looking than the SLP. Two chrome pipes that are at a gradual angle coming out from the driver's side make a great visual impression.

I had two Banks exhausts on my many f-bodies, both of which had the SS muffler and chrome pipes with a very thick walled aluminized steel tubing. This car has a highly shined SS exhaust all the way back from what the pics show.

 

One thing to consider about Ferrari's and Lambos is the power curve of a 12 cyl engine is much flatter than a 8 cyl or 4 cyl. If you take a 600 hp 4 cyl an 8 cyl 600 hp would beat it every time, and the 12 cyl will beat the 8 cyl with the same "HP". The reason is the less pistons you have the power curve creates more of a mountain, what you want is a power curve that looks like a gentle hill (ideally flat) Add to that because you can make each cyl smaller the momentum of each piston is lower therefore the RPM can spin up higher without the worry of breaking something...

a 1000 HP engine that peaks at 400 RPM probably would not go really fast, but it would get there in a hurry, and you would really need some gearing to make it functional...

 

It really depends on the engine design, most exotic car 12 cylinders are oversquare to accommodate high revs. Those designs have excellent VE and HP at high RPM, but they trade that off for TQ and power under the curve.

Actually the most efficient engine design is a 10 cylinder one, like Lambo uses on their lower models - it has the right combination of rotating weight, cylinder head flow, and displacement to work best.

If you refer to the old Quad 4 argument of having as much power as a V8, you would be right - TQ moves things, not HP. But a 650hp LS7 (7L) will make much more power under the curve than a 650hp Ferrari FF (6.3L) not due to number of cylinders, but the additional displacement and head design (the FF has 50% more cylinders and 3x the number of valves).

 

ba ba boom http://www.vdo-gauges.com/instrument...s/cockpit.html

 

That's a pretty sweet TA

 

I didn't realize those cars had DN 4+1 transmissions. Interesting.

That's awesome one of George's car n driver magazines was used for the auction. Fazio's was great growing up!

-- Joe

 

ok guys dont cause to much of an uproar but i have a little question concerning the bowed dash? ok so our cars are unibodied correct so to maintain a good amount of horsepower and torque wouldnt you need to add subframe connectors. i was reading somewhere that there is a certain amount of horsepower that our cars can take before the body tweaks and bends itself outta shape. now as for this car ITS AMAZING but i didnt see any subframe connectors (might be the problem with the dash idk), might not be looking hard enough but still little insite please and thank you

 

It was designed for top speed, not drag racing.... so all the power is not being applied at the green light....

Rafael

 

i doubt its a bent subframe issue because all the exterior panels line up fine and its just the dash that's a bit bowed, fairly certain its because of the switch from the factory tan to the all black panels that was probably done out of factory and not with much care

 

I attached a screen scrape of what the car sold for on Ebay back on 2013-11-03. $84,900
Less than three months later, the car sold at Barrett Jackson for $25,300
Barrett Jackson Results

 

23k huh? Will have to remind our members that the next time somemone think's their stock 1985 camaro is worth 30k

-- Joe

 

wow, it's funny i didn't didn't see this from awhile ago....i wonder which barrett jackson auction it was sold at. It's strange to see that the car is coming from the chicagoland area! Who knew that car was practically in my backyard!?
I love the exhaust, and you can't get any more stainless steel then that, however if that was a polishing job, dang, musta put a butt load of hours to make that glimmer!

I'm sure the car musta been expensive to build and surprise to see no cage. At 85k, i would think that's pretty steep. However, if it sold for 23k, ouch...that's a slap in the face. Then again, this is reality and that we can't all envision our cars as being anything special but to our own eyes.
Can't help but compare between banks and this other company who put out their own salt speed racer...

 

My buddy was delayed and could not bid on the car for me and I would like to know who bought the car and if they are interested in selling it. If you know where the car went please call me.

Thanks
Chuck
847-226-3444

 

Doesn't look like it sold for $85k, that was the asking price. There was one offer that was refused.

Kevin D.