I have the original Van Nuys build sheet for my 1989 IROC. Not sure how to find the date? In box 1 it shows 02-04. The car was special ordered on 3/14/1989. It was delivered on 5/14/1989. Is the build date April 2nd?

 

Van Nuys car should have small metal build date tag on radiator support passenger side

 

 

look at your radiator it will have a date stamped on it also. That should be with in 30 days of you build date.

 

02-04 sounds like April 2 in the international (everybody except US) format of day-month-year.

 

There is no tag on the radiator support? No sign there ever was one either?

 

that’s what I was thinking.

 

That is not a date tag. That is the production line number and should match the number in box 24 of the build sheet. The build date is in box 10.

Now, you say the car was special ordered in March, but the car was built in February. The only explanation is that this build was identical to what the customer wanted to order and this car was delivered as his order. Otherwise, it's not possible to start building a car before it was ordered.

 

It is box 10 (not box 1) that shows 02-04. I believe this means it was built on April 2nd (not Feb 4th). I can confirm this by looking at the door jam sicker which I just found shows the mfg date of April 1989.




So special ordered in March, built in April and delivered in May. Those were the days!

 

Box 10 of the build sheet that I have for 1988 Trans Am shows "9-18". There is no 18 month.

Also 2/4/1989 is a Saturday and 4/2/1989 is a Sunday.

Leonard's 1992 Camaro, which we know was built on 8/27/1992, shows "8-27" for box 10 on his build sheet.

 

This is the build sheet.

 

My car was built 07-16. As mentioned above, there is no 16th month and my car was built in July, so the month is the 1st number. The only real explanation, if the VIN matches between the car and the build sheet is what I mentioned earlier. Your car was finished in February, unless there was a parts delay that kept it at the factory. I question if the car was actually ordered, or if it was just a dealer lot purchase. That car was probably delivered to the dealership sometime in late February/early March. Does the dealer name on the buildsheet match the dealer name where the car was ordered, or purchased?

 

First thing that came to my mind, as others have mentioned, was whether or not the VIN on the build sheet in box 9/24 matches the VIN on the door jamb label, and that they match all of the other VINs around the car: windshield, body panel stickers, firewall and engine block stamps.

I've ordered 3 3rdgens, and each took ~3 months from order to delivery, with the actual build date being a couple of weeks before delivery, which means it's typically an approximate 2-month process from order to build, so an order in March being built in April and delivered in May, being only a 2-month start to finish process, would seem unusual.

If this car was "scheduled" for an 02/04 build (a Saturday, which may or may not be common, but probably not unheard of), then it was most likely ordered in December, which means the dealership had already ordered it for its lot. But that still wouldn't explain why it wasn't built until April, as the door jamb label (if matching) suggests, unless there was a hold up of some kind.

You've never shown or mentioned your location, stout. Are you in the US? If not, then might export orders be handled differently? If so, then there could be any number of reasons for the delays, if any, if the paperwork and the car match.

But if nothing out of the ordinary occurred, and if the build sheet matches the car, then that car had been previously ordered by the dealership and sold to the customer as the car he ordered, after a delay of some kind in getting it out the door. Otherwise, it sure seems like something isn't going to match here.

 

1) I have a copy of the original "Offer to Purchase" form dated 3/14/89 from Dellenbach Chevrolet in Ft. Collins, CO. It lists all the options the original buyer wanted (the guy knew what to get!).

2) I have the Van Nuys Build Sheet showing shipped to Dellenbach Chevrolet in Fort Collins, CO with 02-04 in box 10. Order 029KUA.

3) No visible date code on Radiator support but it looks like something may have been there?

4) Date stamping on radiator is 12 Apr 89

5) Original door jam sticker shows 04/89

6) I have the original window sticker showing dealer to whom delivered Dellenbach Chevrolet in Fort Collins, CO (no date that I can see). Order 029KUA (same as BS)

7) I have the original (CC) of final sales agreement from Dellenbach Chevrolet in Fort Collins, CO to original buyer (same guy that ordered in March).

8) I have the RPO code sticker in the glove box (console) but not sure if that has date information?

So it is clear to me the car was not built in February or it could not have an April Radiator or an April door sticker? I guess it is possible it was started at the factory in February but not finished until April? Does not seem probable?

 

Well, the build sheet does say "scheduled". The build sheets are printed for assembly, so they would have to be printed before the car is actually built?

Can't speak about Van Nuys and 1989, but I know on the Ford side it was not uncommon to have a scheduled date and build date be days, weeks or months different. A few of mine are a month difference between scheduled and built.

Also, you have the N10 option. There was previous discussion about the N10 availability.

 

What does "scheduled" mean?

Maybe some of you are experts on how assembly lines worked at GM in the 80s but it is my understanding the serial number is tied to the chassis just prior to paint and the order is tied to the chassis/serial number just prior to paint. The order stays with the chassis until it rolls off the assembly line. They paint in batches so they sequence the days production based on paint color ordered. Assembly line workers pull parts out of local inventory based on the build sheet.

On the original order sheet it shows (hand written) "high flow exhaust system optional" but no cost or code mentioned. Because this was written up in March, and the N10 option (dual cats) was not officially offered until mid year, they must have known enough to order it even though the code was not available yet?

All the vin numbers match on the car, build sheet, door sticker, window sticker and final sales receipt. I have not checked all the locations on the car yet ( I will when I get a chance) but this is a very, very original 54K mile car.

If it were not for the April date on door sticker, and the radiator, most would just assume the car was built in feb based on the build sheet.

The fact the car has some very rare options the buyer included when he ordered it in March makes it very hard to believe the car was in inventory or already built? DX3 (Decal and stripe delete) in particular is not something a dealer would typically order for the showroom? He waited until May for delivery which would not have been the case if the dealer ordered it early in the year and had it built in February?

The only thing that makes sense is the 02-04 code in box 10 on the build sheet does not represent a Feb build date, or its reversed for April 2nd? Maybe the keyboard operator that day at the factory was dyslectic? February 4th 1989 is a Saturday and April 2nd 1989 is a Sunday making both dates some what questionable for build dates?

 

For clarification, atleast on the Pontiac side, the N10 option was documented to dealers back in December of 1988:


One other option is a copy of the invoice. Wonder what dates are listed on the invoice for the car?

 

I assume the N10 option would have been similar timing for 1989 on the Camaro? Based on research here I know there are several that have 1989 L98 cars and LB9 cars with T5s that have cars without the N10 dual cats. It may have been later in the year when N10 came automatically with the L98 and LB9/T5 cars? Maybe the comment on the special order about high flow exhaust was just make sure his had it?

I have no idea how to get the invoice for this car?

 

I love this thread. Love the mystery, and all the details and questions it flushes out.

I was going to post the same bulletin JT did. N10 was around in the Feb. '89 timeline...before it in fact I should think. That bulletin is pointing out that it is now required with LB9 and MM5. That does not mean it was not available prior to that. Right?

My plant experience at GM is probably not of much help. LeonardS (and perhaps others) walked the line and watched their cars built. They would be a better resource than I.

https://www.hagerty.com/media/automo...-z28-superfan/

He used to have a more definitive site with more details and photos I think, but I can't put my hands on the link at the moment.

I was never in the Van Nuys plant, or any "car" plant for that matter, aside from Bowling Green. My experience was on the truck side, and later in the mid-90s. I can tell you that by then painting was done robotically, and as such, the color could be (and was) switched from one vehicle to the next. At the Baltimore plant, the paper sheet was hung on the core support not long after it came out of the oven to bake the paint. This sheet was pulled form the printer, and taped on. (You'll see a similar sheet hanging from the hood in the photos in that Hagerty article). It contained all of the build info for the van (Astro/Safari). Did it have cladding, AWD, axle ratio, CD player, rear A/C, aluminum wheels, interior color, trim (LS, LT), etc. etc....it was all on there, for the workers to see as it entered their station on the line. BTW, job one when the body emerged from the oven, and I mean like 8 feet out...paint the blackout behind the grille. Upper story of the plant, in summer, right outside the oven. What a miserable, hot job. You can bet that whoever worked that job was brand new, or had pissed off the wrong people. But I digress....

Of course, ALL of those options had to be sequenced. Just in time delivery you know...only modest amounts of stock were maintained at the plant. If a supplier fell short, or ran into an issue, it could crate a delay in building. So while the office up from may have sequenced (scheduled) the order to fit into a time slot where they projected they would have room on the line (between other sold unit, sold orders, and other "priorities" like pilot builds) and all the parts to build a particular combo, it may have been delayed.

So it is possible that while the schedule date was one thing, that the build date was another. There's a reason the door sticker just has a month and year, and not a day date. Partly for delays, partly for weekends if the plant wasn't working, partly because it could take more than a day for a vehicle to be built.

Other delays can occur too, after the build. Engine failure at start up (or any component that doesn't pass testing for that matter), body damage, recalls, parts shortage where they built the car anyway then held it until the parts came in, etc. The plant environment is a crazy and fluid one. Any of these might explain a late delivery to a dealer, but none would explain the date difference on the door decal.

It's a curious case. If it was just the door decal that was in conflict, I'd say it's a misprint. But other things certainly bring that into question.

 

You can order a copy using GM Media's website:
https://www.alliedvaughn.com/service...ce-order-form/

However, I don't think build date is listed. Invoice and Shipping date are generally listed, which I think April is pretty well expected, so it likely won't provide any more information.

 

Thanks, very helpful!

Also the radiator as an 12 April 89 date on it...

 

I sent a note off the GMHA

 

I was able to talk on the phone with the wife of Christopher Nieves who was one of the previous owners. They bought it from the son of the original owner in 2020. She confirmed it was a special order car with very specific options by the guy's father (Tim Ciranni). She also confirmed the car was all original including paint.

Names of owners:

Tim Ciranni (1989-xxx)
xxx Ciranni (xxx-2020) (Tim Ciranni's son)
Christopher Nieves (2020-2020)
Terry Blanton (2020-2021)
Angela Naff (2021-2022)
Jeremy Tigner (2022-2023)
Martin Hansen (2023-?)

Christopher's wife thought Terry and Angela might be active remembers on 3rd gen?

I see that Terry is active on the IROC-Z FB group so I sent him a note there...

 

What’s up with all the different owners in a short period of time?

 

Well, the offer to purchase, from March, is just a deposit for when the car comes in. It was common to document the options that you were putting a deposit down for, just in case a dealer would try to do a swap. You need to document the purchase line by line. If you notice, the top right only has a description of the car, but the VIN block is blank. It's very possible the owner talked with a salesman, ordered the car in February, but didn't put a deposit down, and an offer to buy, until the dealer got a delivery date. The dates are now making sense to me.

Leonard, did you ever need to pt a deposit on your car? Or, an offer to buy?

 

Buyer did put a deposit down in March ($200) on the purchase order. There was no VIN number on the Purchase Order from March because the car was not built yet. On everything but the build sheet it shows the car was built in April (door jam sticker, radiator). Mystery as to why the build sheet shows February and the car was built in Apr?

 

For 31 years the car was owned by the original owner and his son. I talked with Nieves and he sold it because he found a Yellow one which is what he wanted. Banton bought it and not sure why he sold it but it appears he has a few 3rd gen cars. Not sure about Angela but I know she collects Camaros. Tigner bought it for his son but I guess he cannot drive stick. I bought it because I have been looking for a nice original one for some time and I plan on keeping it for a while.

 

Scott, I’ve never put a deposit on any Chevrolet or GMC I’ve purchased. I’ve had good enough relationships with the Dealers that I trusted them and they trusted me. I did pay a deposit on a couple Jeep vehicles that we ordered for my wife, because I didn’t know the Dealer and their SOP was to take refundable deposits.

 

You have a good amount of documentation which makes the car story much more interesting. How about posting some photos of the car? Hang on to the car and enjoy it!

 

I plan on keeping it for a while as it took me years to find one with every option I wanted and in excellent condition.

 

Pulled the radio this morning to fix the power switch and look what I found. Radio dated 3/28/89

 

I think the only thing that doesn't make sense is the date on the buildsheet itself. Everything makes it clear the car was built well after the "scheduled" date on the buildsheet.

So it's either 1) The buildsheet was in error or 2) The car was scheduled for that date but something changed to make it months out.

There was more than one buildsheet with the car and there was some trim sheets. Unfortunately, the trim sheets don't show as much data (no dates) and may not be in the car. The other buildsheets are almost never with the car. If you look at Leonard's website with pictures of his 1992 Camaro being built at the Van Nuys plant, same plant as yours, you will see a large buildsheet taped to the front but I don't think those had the date either. The instrument cluster should also have a diagnostic tag pass, which should show the date and time of that part, like you found on the radio.

 

I was able to have an email exchange with the original owner and he agrees the build sheet is wrong if it has a February date and agrees the April 2nd would make total sense since he ordered it in March. I also got a copy of the invoice from GM heritage which shows a 04/20/89 date for ship with original owner's name to prove it was a special order.

 

the build date (which is more like a scheduled date) is in the far left upper box on the build sheet, it should be box 1. And should show the date as Month /day, if the bottom numbers are 02-04 then it wouldn’t be correct if you are saying that the car was ordered in March check your vin and make sure it’s the same as your car. And that day could, but more likely not the car’s actual build date, this was a scheduled date, the tag that is on the right side of the radiator core support is a day code, actually the first two numbers are the day of production for the model year, there was only two digits, so once the 100 day of production was reached, the number went back to 00. The last four digits refer to the batch number on the assembly line your car was. The numbers on this tag are on the build sheet as well as I think the window sticker. Van Nuys cars left the factory with build sheets and sub assembly line sheets left in the interior and most times the dealer tossed them in the garbage when they were set up at the dealer.

 

All the VINs match up on all documents. The numbers on the radiator core support are not visible unfortunately (per photo above). All documents (except build sheet) and visible date codes on the car’s components support a March/April build.

 

Ha! I found the radiator core support tag. It was not on the passenger side but instead is in the center under the intake air cleaner cover.



This number matches the number in box 24 and in box 1 of the build sheet. It is also on the window sticker down near the vin #.

So 13 represents the 13th, 113th, 213th or 313th build date day in 1989? Assuming build dates happen on all calendar days, in my car's case I assume 13 represents the 113th day of 1989 which is April 23rd.

1) I have a copy of the original "offer to purchase" form from the dealer dated 3/14/89.
2) I have a copy of the original factory invoice dated 04/20/89, correct VIN, same dealer as #1, same buyer as #1, order number 029KUA.
3) I have the original build sheet with correct VIN, A0134627 in box 1 and box 24, Sched. No. date of 02-04 in box 10, same dealer as #1, same order number as #2.
4) I have the original Window sticker with correct VIN, A0134627 printed at bottom, same dealer as #1, same order number as #2.
5) "13 4627" is on the radiator core support tag same as #3 box 1 and box 24. As I doubt it represents January 13th I assume it represents 113 which is April 23rd.
6) "12 APR 89" is printed on the radiator
7) 3/28/89 in on the radio tag.
8) the door jam sticker is dated 04/89 with correct VIN.
Where else can I check?

So all this begs the question, what does the 02-04 Sched. No. date in box 10 of the build sheet represent? Is this possibly when GM allocated production capacity to build the basic chassis VIN # for this Camaro even though chassis specific RPOs were not assigned? My build sheet can't be the only one with this mystery?
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