ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Which pan are you running? With that capacity does it still clear exhaust and k-member? Also asking for a friend. Pro Tip: Its Chuck!

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Holley 302-1 pan. 6 quarts in the pan plus 1/2 quart in the engine.

Exhaust clearance no problem at all. I haven't test fit to a stock k-member yet but the dimensions show some promise. I have a BMR k-member in the car now that will definitely clear the pan but it causes other fitment problems on the top side. I want to go back to stock k-member if I can. BMR K member is pretty flimsy.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Do you have to have the hood insulation on it? Without it the bar may just rub a little bit in 1-2 spots like mine. And I mean barely. I bet if I took the STB bases to a sander I wouldn't have an issue at all.

Chuck!

Its interesting. I read a thread on ls1tech about someone running a megasquirt that would cut out the engine on hard launches because oil pressure dropped. He was running 6 quarts, and when he moved to 7 it was fine.

I have the same thought about the tank and I wouldnt mind the ~5-10 hp from switching to the wet sump + crank scraper. Improved racing is bringing one out specifically for the fbody pan on the LS7.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I have an f-body pan now and did not want to reuse it. The front is too shallow. With a 4" stroke you might be able to slip a business card between the rod bolt and pan. I had to grind the pan for clearance with my 4.125 stroke. The windage tray only fits over the back 6 cylinders and the front 2 cylinders whip oil all day every day.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Went to the 1/8 mile drags for the first time. Not sure what was the DA but it was definitely a slow night for me. But it was still a chance to run the car a little faster than I would dare on the street which is always fun.

Boy, did I have to work to find traction though. First few runs I peddled and spun all the way down the track never finding full throttle. Then I remembered I didn't lower tire pressure.... Oops. I found a full second and +15 mph right there. But even at 16.5 psi (warm) I still had to feather 1-2 shift or the tires would blow off. I spent the entire night running really slow 60' times, feathering 1-2 shift, and trying to play catch up every time. And I mean EVERY time.

But my wife tells me that my signature "come from behind" style was becoming a crowd pleaser by the end of the night. I guess people were enjoying watching whether or not I could manage a flybye. My wife caught part of this flybye on a 5th gen Camaro with drag radials, BMR drag suspension, and ??? engine mods.


Here's a solo run. Gotta love the sound of that car!

86Z

iTrader: (4)

sounds good! i'm really enjoying the sounds of my 6.0 with the long tubes these days

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I'm still in money conservation mode but decided pushrods aren't too expensive so I got some Manton 3/8" pushrods on order. This will allow me to button up the LS7 engine for good.

I've measured pushrod length once before but not to the detail like needed with this engine. This thread at LS1tech has a good writeup how to measure pushrod length accurately.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...od-length.html

I purchased a 12" caliper to take length measurements. The Johnson short travel lifters with axle oiling (ST2126LSR) have only 0.058" travel and a preload spec of 0.035 +/- .010 inch. So not much leeway for error!

The shape of the ends of the Comp Cams pushrod length checkers are different than the shape of the actual pushrods. I was instructed to hit a target of 0.038" preload instead of 0.035" in order to compensate. The growth of the engine is ignored (about 0.01" aluminum block) because it's safer to be a little short than too long.

A quick reality check at the end was to install the check rods at final length (zero lash + preload), set the rocker to zero lash, and then turn the rocker bolt until it began to tighten up (not full torque, just feeling a lot of resistance). As long as the wrench turned between 6 o'clock and 7 o'clock then things were probably done right. (Note: Stock lifters would have more turn of the wrench because the preload is at least double.)

Finally, I sent my measurements to Mamo Motorsports and Tony grouped them into batches as shown below. Looks like I'll have 4 different pushrod lengths.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Good choice with the Manton's. I ended up running 5 different lengths on my MMS setup. Are you running Tony's 10mm Yella Terra Rockers as well?

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Yes, Mamo Yella Terra 1.85 rockers. They are kind of a pseudo shaft rocker without all the extra bolts and support. Intake and Exhaust are in a pair on a common shaft.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Just picked up somethin' from a junkyard in the desert where I grew up. It's an older Trans Am hood with the mesh screen. Figured I might as well grab it while I can because it's not every day I drive 4000 miles with my truck. The desert is soooo nice to steel.... and this little gem has been sitting inside a building since 2001.

I'll get it cleaned up and paint matched one of these days when I feel like giving the car a little more aggressive look.

Ozz1967

iTrader: (4)

That's the 82-84 model TransAm hood. I have one on my car. Functional cowl induction!

skinny z

LS variant or otherwise it one of those things that bugs me about wannabe engine assemblers that don't pay attention to these details. And it's one of those things that overlooked, don't result in immediate failure but rather result in a slow and steady decline to having to repair and rebuild.
Props to working out the details.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I decided to replace the oil barbell with a Sac City Corvette unit while everything is still easily accessible. I removed the engine rear cover and found the original oil barbell (dirty yellow color) left of crankshaft. Spent a few minutes scratching my head how to remove that sucker because I was afraid it would go deeper into the oil galley if I pushed on it. So I decided to punch a small screwdriver in the side and pull it out. (Lesson learned: You can push on it if you want)




Took a little force but it did come out in one piece....




Ready to install the oil barbell from Sac City Corvette. They provide a 1/4-20 threaded hole in the end of the barbell to make the job easier.




Job finished..... well, not really. Turns out I can't re-align the rear cover with the crankshaft seal in place so I had to knock out the old seal and I'm waiting for a new seal to arrive.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I have an LS1 F-body accessory drive that I want to re-use with the LS7. However, the LS7 crank snout is longer than most other LS engines and it results in a gap between the damper and bolt. I can use either a spacer to take up the gap, or buy a custom damper with extra long hub. I am going to buy a new damper anyway so I called ATI to talk about options.

• The ATI damper for F-body (917264) offers the best protection. I'd have to use it with a crank spacer. Price is $500.

• A 10% under drive is available (917276) at same cost but it's not as good and ATI recommended upgrading to the 66 durometer rubbers and servicing every 5 years. Again, crank spacer is needed.

• A custom order is possible with either of the dampers above but with an extra long hub so that no crank spacer is needed. I like that idea! Price is $700. Suddenly the other options sounded better.

I ended up ordering the 10% under drive with 66 rubbers. Shorter belts are needed. I went with gatorback belts, 4060775 and 4040390.

I got a Scoggin Dickey crank spacer (part number SDLS7SPCR) and it didn't fit on the crankshaft. Apparently they expect everyone to final hone to fit. I used a 120 grit brush-hone from Grainger (part number BC11212) and honed out the inner diameter of the spacer. But none of that amounted to anything of use because it turns out the Scoggin Dickey spacer does not fit inside the hub of the ATI damper. A friend of mine was nice enough to make me an aluminum spacer instead (left side of photo).

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

So last night I am installing valve covers for the last time while buttoning up the engine. I wanted to do this right so I looked up the factory torque spec for the valve cover hold-down bolts and began to tighten to spec. I'm thinking to myself.... man, this is awfully tight.... I've never gone this tight before..... gosh, I don't know if this is *SNAP*.... Problem is the bolt didn't relax. And stripped threads don't make a pop noise.

I pull the valve cover and the bolt is fine. I look at the boss in the head and the threads are stripped. I look closer and find the boss split top to bottom. ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?! So now I get the joy of repairing this problem and the LS7 digs my wallet once again.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

That sucks. I stripped one of my valve cover bolt holes too but was able to chase it. I found most of the tapped holes in these AFR/MMS heads are super gritty. Most needed a chase. Yours is very fixable but a huge pain to pull it all apart. You might be able to Tig it back together in place and put a heli coil in it.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

So let's talk about repair options here. I figure the best is to take the head off, let somebody weld up the crack, and then helicoil the thread. But honestly this is not a very important piece of the engine and I really -- I mean really really don't want to remove and disassemble the heads. An on engine repair would be nice.

So I found an epoxy from Loctite called Form-A-Thread that looks easy and is tough enough for holding a valve cover screw. It has a temp rating up to 300F. Not sure how hot the head gets at that spot between intake and exhaust valve. But what if I went one step further and totally rednecked this in true 3rd gen fashion by filling the crack with the Form-A-Thread too?

Obviously this kind of stuff is not my forte. Ideas are welcome.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Been staring at the picture giving this thought. I'm thinking bonding materials are not an option because the crack isn't open enough to get a paste inside. Welding offers good penetration but I'm afraid that a weld bead on the inside will side-load a drill bit and I'll never be able to drill straight down the hole (not with a hand drill anyway). Home repair is looking less likely the more I ponder this.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Don't over think it. If you've ever seen 100k aluminum block engines welded up between rounds in the bed of a pickup, you'd be ok with doing the repair inplace.
I'd squeeze it back shut, V out the crack a bit, have it tigged up (inplace if you can) drill/tap and install helicoil. It can be done inplace. We aren't wiring up the space shuttle here or installing booster rocket Orings (last one may be a bad example)..

And how did I miss that you picked up a hood? Nice!!!

skinny z

Why not forgo the welding altogether and just do a Heli-Coil repair? You've nothing to lose really. If it fails, then you can adopt T Tops plan and weld it up.
On a slightly different note, the question is why did it fail? Last time that happened to me was the result of the bolt bottoming out in the head. Aftermarket head, aftermarket valve covers = broken bolt. I had to measure the depth of each bolt boss and cut each fastener to length. Turns out passenger left and right heads were different by about about 3/32nds".

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

You've spent too much at this point to half *** it. Hot rodding with high dollar parts requires contingency plans. I do agree that it likely can be fixed still installed on the motor, but I don't agree that you can heli coil it without welding that crack. It needs to be welded. Leaving the crack in there with anything other than a Tig repair will leave you with dissimilar materials with different expansion rates. It's all bad news that will bite you in the *** later. If this is a MMS head it should have an AFR warranty. Might be worth a phone call to Tony. He'll make it right if he can't offer advice.
​​​​​​

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I'm coordinating with a welding shop. Just going to throw the whole engine in the back of the truck and drive the truck into the shop. The caller ID from my desk phone does wonders.

A co-worker told me about the Time-Sert thread insert. It is a solid insert that works in thin wall areas.

I'm thinking the failure was caused by hydraulics. I had just poured a quart of oil on the valve train and I think the hole was full of oil when I tightened the screw. It also doesn't help that trick flow left a thin wall when they shaved it off while milling the rocker rail.

skinny z

Sounds like you have a plan.
That said, to counter the post earlier, it is just a valve cover bolt (albeit in a high zoot cylinder head).
And for what it's worth, the dissimilar metals thing...? I don't think the expansion coefficient enters into it really but point made.
But I can't say I recall seeing a Heli-Coil made out of aluminium either.
Credit to Jon for working it out. Most certainly the weld and insert will give the best results.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Makes complete sense. That boss isn't very big and even the slightest debris in the threads could split it open. Not a lot mass in that part of the head which shows the weakness of cast aluminum.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I just know smart people, that's all. Some of them here.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Got the boss repaired. The weld doesn't win any awards for beauty though. And that's after I spent time with a grinder.

Turns out the threads weren't completely mucked up so I used the Loctite Form-A-Thread (bluish color) to fill in where there was some material missing. If it doesn't hold then I'll drill it out and install a solid thread insert. Probably be fine though, it's just an M6 bolt.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Welp.... I got it together. I guess this is what a 700+ Hp naturally aspirated driver looks like.

Just received an order from Summit Racing full of bits and bobbles needed for the swap. Only thing left to buy is the damper.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Quite a while ago I bought a 140 mph speedometer with over 150K miles on the clock. I didn't like that it had some random number on the odometer so today I took apart the gage and saw it was quite easy to set the odometer to anything I want. I set it to 0 miles for now and probably will install it when the LS7 goes in.

skinny z

Nothing like zeros on the clock. I did the same when I installed my home-brewed gauge cluster. I have a vintage AutoMeter speedometer (NOS) that started my latest iteration off a 0 miles. At least oil change intervals are easily calculated.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

While you have the gauge apart, check the little gear that goes bad and replace it b4 you install gauge.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

The gear was fine but where do you get those service parts?

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/inte...roken-but.html

scooter

iTrader: (11)

You make it sound so easy to set to "0", lol. I took a speedometer apart and couldn't figure out how to change the dials without taking the dials out completely. Can to give a little more detail?

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

scooter, I sent you a PM. I won't explain it to most people but you've got the "friends and family" deal.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Got you, thanks for the tip!

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I have never wired up oil pressure to the Holley EFI because Holley has a very expensive pressure sender ( $121 ) that does't fit on the engine (of course!). One thing I noticed today is that the LS7 has a 3-pin oil pressure sender with a different style connector than what I use today with my LS1 style sender. This opens up opportunity to give the HP EFI an oil pressure reading for the price of a $8 connector pigtail.

I found a GM style pigtail at Ballenger Motorsports (part number 85998). I cut the Holley connector out of the harness and will splice into the GM connector pigtail using the pinouts below.




Software can be configured with the GM sender transfer function of voltage and pressure. The GM sender outputs a linear scale between 0.5V = 0 psi and 4.5V = 130 psi. I can now set up a safety net in case of loss of oil pressure with pressure being monitored by the ECM. Edit: No more guessing needed, Holley has GM oil pressure sensor in V6 software.

JoshHefnerX

I dont remember if you went over this or not, but instead of all the oil pan/ windage tray work... why not just use it dry sump as intended?

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

The reservoir tank is huge. I didn't want to cut up my car trying to make it fit.
I kept some of the dry sump parts so I have the option in the future.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Well, gents, say goodbye to "Pokey", the long stroke LS that put life back in my car after a 17 year slumber. This 427 iron block stroker has served up gobs of fun the last 3 years and a few *** kickings too. But a LS7 awaits that is leaner and meaner.

Engine has been loosed from the car on the top side. Just need to loose a few things from the bottom side and drop it out the bottom.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Replacing a 427 for a 427 is a great problem to have. Very jelly

straightbuchana

Loving this build! Keep us updated, I'm excited to see what comes of it.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Oh - my - gosh.... what a flipping pain in the butt! I can't for the life of me figure out why I remembered this being so easy. 'Cause it's not any more! LOL!

Six days later and the engine is finally on the ground and I think the transmission hydraulic fitting is broken. Maybe more things broken. Now I just need to find my Harbor Freight Shrink-Ray and fish everything out from under the car.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

And I just noticed in the picture that I destroyed my front right brake line. ***@#$*@#( !!!

skinny z

Despite the commentary elsewhere, I still don't appreciate the idea of doing this from the bottom. That you have to mess with the suspension really capped it for me in the pros and cons department. You've further contributed to the con side of things.
But any progress is progress.

JayBoCC2

Having done it both ways I do prefer coming out and back in from the bottom. Though it is a bit more work it felt a lot cleaner and less risky in many ways.

That said I also destroyed a brake line doing it the first tkme... Luckily that was the only thing!

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

What do you mean? It was loads of fun!

I don't have any choice, Skinny. Even David Copperfield couldn't get my engine out the top. The combination of parts I have make it impossible. And removing/installing a fully assembled engine out the bottom is the path of least resistance to help prevent injury to my back. It's easy to lay on the ground doing stuff, more risky leaning over the engine bay trying to install headers, front accessories and such.

I looked at the weather and decided to get the job done tonight. Let me tell you, this is a pretty big accomplishment for a gimp with a bad back! Now where does my wife keep that bottle of ibuprofen???

Chuck!

Do you happen to have a picture of how your MGW sits in the center console without the shift boot and plate on? Mine rubs on the side of the console in 3-6 and R and gives me a ton of vibration at highway speeds. I dont know if its how my hawks cross member sits or the shifter itself...

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Chuck, I looked through my old photos and these two pictures are the best I have without the boot installed. I also included a picture with the boot, and a video I made a while ago to help somebody at the time. I have the style of shifter for 2000 Camaro. The shifter does not vibrate in the slightest.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

My original plan was to carry over the FOMOCO 60 lb/hr injectors (ya, you heard me... Ford) and fuel rails from my LS3 manifold but I learned that the LS7 manifold sets the injectors at a slightly different angle. Fortunately, Nasty Performance has LS7 billet fuel rails that allow the use of my tall injectors. They had never tried mounting to a MSD intake though. Access to the mounting bolts isn't very good so getting the rails installed might prove a bit tricky. Way cheaper than buying new injectors though!

I thought it wise to install new injector o-rings but those suckers are hard to find! I finally found a set at Fuel Injector Connection. Gen III and Gen IV engines use different o-rings so it is important to pay attention to what you're buying. I needed the LS3 style with orange and blue color o-rings. Orange goes on the the bottom in the manifold, and Blue goes on the top in the fuel rail.

https://fuelinjectorconnection.com/c...lsa-o-ring-set

Update: Set of o-rings is GM part number 89017587. These are the only o-rings available and other places are just repackaging the GM parts.




And this won't be of interest to anyone but I need to capture it for my own documentation. I am using Fragola o-rings for the -8 fuel rail fittings. I ordered a set of Aeromotive o-rings but found the cross-sectional diameter to be much smaller than the Fragola. I know from experience that the Fragola will seal so using those again.




Another item that isn't the same between LS engines is the MAP sensor grommet. The following link has a nice explanation that illustrates the difference. https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...l#post13673067

The MSD intake manifold has all the MAP sensor locations blanked out. I chose to stay with the LS1 style grommet (GM part number 16194007) like I had before and drilled a hole accordingly.






I ended up using an LS6 PCV hose to the manifold. It was a really tight stretch, but I made it work. I tried using the plastic LS3 hose but it was too small diameter to fit over the port on the intake.






Changing topics again, the LS1 F-body alternator bracket has 3 mounting locations on front of engine, but my old iron block had provisions for only 2 of those bolts. The LS7 has the third mounting location (under idler pulley) but I was missing the bolt. That bolt is shorter than the other two and is GM part number 11516360 (M10x1.5 - 90mm flange bolt).